FabSwingers.com > Forums > The Lounge > Torture boys get a minimum of 5 years !

Torture boys get a minimum of 5 years !

By *afthalf OP Man over a year ago

Near you x

Im shocked once again at the legal system of this country.

Have followed thisstory since it first broke and honestly believed after the Jamie Bulger case that these 2 would have been held " at her Majestys pleasure ", in other words, till the queen says they should be let out.

What do they get ??..5 years...5 YEARS !!...

I really do feel so sorry for the victims and there familys and hope to god that they can some how get over this and make their lives something so much better !

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Mmmm call me cynical but until the punishment fits the crime it will continue to be like this

The problem is crime is a big part of the economy

And if we had proper sentences and deterrents there would not be so many jobs in the crime industry

Its a sad fact of modern life

Like i said call me cynical xx

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

these kids are evil.

nothing more, nothing less.

and had their arms not tired, they would be murderers like Jamie Bulger's killers.

now someone will blame the council, social workers, the police, teachers and the lollypop lady standing outside the school they go to...

but...

It is the parents and those little monsters to blame.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Have a heart!

They are children afterall.

How would you feel if you were locked up at that age and be told you'll never get out and enjoy freedom again???

Their parents failed them. The society failed them. We the tax payers failed them!

Why didn't the Social Services do something about them? Instead of allowing them to rot with their abusive parents???!!!

Why didn't their neighbours/relatives etc. do something about them? To rescue them from such hellish upbringing???!!!

I sincerely hope they can have a fresh start in life without any prejudice, and put the unfornate events leading to their downfall behind them.

They are young, and they can still have a good future, if they are allowed to do so.

And before anyone jumps up and down and asks about what about the victums?

I feel sorry for them for being the victums. However, I do not buy the "an eye for an eye" mentality, sorry!

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

the law has it stands is stacked against the victim .these animals will be let out in 5 yrs time with new id,new home and cash on tap from the state.this is not fantasy this is how we deal with high profile crimalals in the uk.crime here pays .the victims will get nothing.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

you make great points pearl.

I do have a heart and on this occasion it goes out to both young boys abused and especially to the young boy who said to his friend ' you go on and leave me here to die '.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *leasureDomeMan over a year ago

all over the place

The legal system has actually played a canny hand here ,the sentence was actually indeterminate-with a minimum of 5years-however the experts all say there is little chance of them getting out after that period such is the level of mental derangement particularly from the younger one,the lawyers did a back room deal to drop the attempted murder charge so the sexual angle of the attack could be emphasised.

When a kid is born he or she is a blank sheet and they become what the parents make them ,these kids had a horrendous

start,witnessing brutality from there parents,constant exposure to pornography involving bdsm and a environment described by psychiatrists as toxic (some of the stuff they were exposed to had to be hidden from public)

So it came to the crime ,horrendous but the police were powerless as they were under 10 and as soon as they hit 10 acted.The real failing was once again from Doncaster,for placing them in the same town in foster care as there father.

Its time parents were prosecuted for not caring for there kids properly in an environment where they clearly dont care about what happens to them .

I can only hope the poor victims of this inevitable crime can and are supported till they are mature enough to deal with what happened.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago
Forum Mod

"you make great points pearl.

I do have a heart and on this occasion it goes out to both young boys abused and especially to the young boy who said to his friend ' you go on and leave me here to die '.

xx"

That one sentence from that little boy made my heart break

I agree they were let down

They had a hellish upbringing probably worse then any of us can imagine

That does'nt make any of it right though,they must have had some good influences in their lives too

Im sure they went to school and understood the differences between right and wrong?

I think the parents should be punished too,I was talking to hubby about this and the whole case turned our stomachs,he said what most of us probably feel with children that he would hunt down anyone that did anything like that to our children and he would hunt the parents down too

Whether that is right or wrong that is how you feel as a parent and you just can't help feeling that way

As these boys spend the next few years incarcerated I just hope that some good is done for them so that when they come out they will be decent human beings

For the 2 that were attacked I hope that with love and support they can both get past the horror of what happened and both lead happy contented lives

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

i agree that the parents of kids like these or those that cauce havok on estates should be prosecuted but it will never happen as governments aint interested in the real world the only thing they want is ya cash .as for the animals getting out when 5 yrs are up you can bet ya life they will get out just like the bulger killers.the experts say there is little chance of them getting out but the experts dont run the country

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *ickmealloverWoman over a year ago

a very plush appartment off junt 7 M5

The parents were lacking yes

BUT

The children still know right from wrong

what causes pain and what doesn't

The parents failed them but even so they know what they did was hurtful and not the nicest thing to do

They made a choice to inflict pain and in my book are as guilty as any adult

They deserve what they get and so much more

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *he_original_poloWoman over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester

My knee jerk reaction was “5 years! Is that it!”… but then it is a smart call really.

Because of their age they are yet to go through some very significant changes in their development and more specifically their brain… the stage many refer to as ‘Kevin Syndrome’ … then beginning of the transformation to adulthood is some way off for both of them.

Many of us did things as children we would not dream of doing now… obviously I would hope not to this degree.

The children who committed this awful act, no matter how abhorrent it is, cannot be held totally responsible for their social conditioning at the age they are… considering what they have seen as ‘acceptable’ in their life so far.

A minimum of 5 years and the possibility of “indefinite” will allow assessment at some key stages and see if they are truly conditioned beyond repair, away from the influences they’ve had so far.

If you show your dog it’s OK to destroy the furniture in your home… don’t be surprised when it rips the stuffing out of someone else’s sofa.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

A custodial sentance does several things, it is punishment, it is a supposed deterrent, it protects society from danger and is also meant to offer some rehabilitation.

In this case the offenders may be just victims of their upbringing, but probably not just that, (although it undoubtably had an impact), they may be genuine clinical psychopaths, or more likely a combination of both.

A genuine psychopath has a personality disorder which has an almost complete lack of empathy,conscience,inhibition and as such feels no guilt or remorse as they feel they have done nothing wrong.

There is neither a cure nor any effective treatment for psychopathy; there are no medications or other techniques which can instill empathy, and psychopaths who undergo traditional talk therapy only become more adept at manipulating others.The consensus among researchers is that psychopathy stems from a specific neurological disorder which is biological in origin and present from birth.It is estimated that one percent of the general population are psychopaths.

IF this is the case then the custodial sentance ONLY provides protection to society and as such can be deemed to be as long as the protection is still required.

The true psychopath wont understand the punishment aspect as they think they have done nothing wrong, they wont regard it as a deterrent again as they think they did nothing wrong in the first place, and so far it has proved impossible to genuinely rehabilitate an extreme psychopath other than medication to a degree of vegetative immobility.

So if these offenders ARE true psychopaths we should never expect them to be freed from a secure location, the cost to the taxpayer, multiple millions.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

When I was about 9yo, I took a gold fish out of the bowl, and covered it in Sodium Bicarb to see if I could make salted fish out of it.

I did not know I was doing wrong, I was imitating what I saw the adult folks were doing - covering fish with salt.

Do they really know what is right or wrong? Or just imitating what they saw on films and adult folks did?

I do not believe they were born evil, and their upbringing had a lot to do with it.

I do hope they will emerge as better persons, and be able to have a fresh start without prejudice.

And I hope the victums can find it in their hearts to forgive them eventually, and can recover from their ordeals and move on.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *he_original_poloWoman over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester

There are what are considered “classic indicators” - the repeated behaviour as a child linked to people who go on to be diagnosed as psychopaths/sociopaths in adulthood. However, whilst the vast majority of psycho’s displayed them as a child, it’s not conclusive as others who are perfectly normal in later life can display some of them and then grow out of it.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *ickmealloverWoman over a year ago

a very plush appartment off junt 7 M5

thing is

lots of children have a bad upbringing

Lots of children are brought up around violence

Lots of children are abused

Lots of children go without bare essentials such as love, warmth, food, shelter

They dont all CHOOSE to be violnet and its a cop out to say just because they had it tought thats its an excuse for their bad behavior

Cos guess what

There is no excuse, no validation no matter what

They are scum

I hope the victims never forgive them and hound them till their dying day

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"thing is

lots of children have a bad upbringing

Lots of children are brought up around violence

Lots of children are abused

Lots of children go without bare essentials such as love, warmth, food, shelter

They dont all CHOOSE to be violnet and its a cop out to say just because they had it tought thats its an excuse for their bad behavior

Cos guess what

There is no excuse, no validation no matter what

They are scum

I hope the victims never forgive them and hound them till their dying day

excellent post and i totaly agree.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Just an idle thought,

Approx 1-3% of the population are psychopaths/sociopaths,

Approx 2,000 Fab members are online now.

Statistics suggest approx 20 to 60 of those could be psychopaths/sociopaths

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Just an idle thought,

Approx 1-3% of the population are psychopaths/sociopaths,

Approx 2,000 Fab members are online now.

Statistics suggest approx 20 to 60 of those could be psychopaths/sociopaths

are there any mp,s on here

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Just an idle thought,

Approx 1-3% of the population are psychopaths/sociopaths,

Approx 2,000 Fab members are online now.

Statistics suggest approx 20 to 60 of those could be psychopaths/sociopaths

are there any mp,s on here

Dunno??? have you seen anyone claim the £5.00 per month gold membership as " EXPENSES" ????

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

I thought it was minimum of 5 years as they are what 11/12? They could be detained longer or so i thought?

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *imfromGlasgowMan over a year ago

er...guess

The judge said

"But I hope that they (the victims' families) will appreciate that five years is the very least which A and B (the two convicted boys) will serve.

“They may well be in detention for much longer than that and it will ultimately depend on when the authorities conclude that they no longer represent a risk to the public."

It looks as if they could spend the rest of their lives in custody.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *i 1 Get 1 FreeCouple (MM) over a year ago

birmingham

It's worth bearing in mind Doncaster Children's services missed / ignored 31, yes 31 chances to intervene in this case over many years, it 's also worth noting this same outfit are accountable for the loss of 7, yes 7 children's lives since 2004, all who were on the “At Risk” register, words fail me for the contempt I have towards those accountable

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Why do people keeping blaming the world and his wife for what is the fault of the parents.

Parents who dont obviously care, who are not bothered that their offspring run amok.

And expect others to put the problem right.

Like the social services.and schools.

The caseloads of social workers grow each day. Not just with young thugs but with the older generation who require help and in my mind have more rights to it than parents who dont or wont work and expect the country to do what they fail to do.

The country didnt fail them.

Their so called parents did.

And the victims pay the price.AS always

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

No words can dscribe our feelings over this. Sadley those who govern will never learn and something like this will happen again. Very sad.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *ickmealloverWoman over a year ago

a very plush appartment off junt 7 M5

its nowt to do with government

these boys knew deep down what they were doing was wrong

I do hope they get picked on in where they are

A bully will always meet a bigger bully enentually

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

As per...

when they do their minimal sentance.

THEY will be given new identities and new homes.

In effect...they will be rewarded for what they have done.

And if i was a parent of one of the victims, no way could i forgive.

My own son was attacked when 17 with an iron bar. He had to pretend to be dead in order to survive.

Forgiveness is not nor ever will be an option.

IF i came in contact with who ever did it....i would kill them.SIMPLES.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *ugby 123Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

O o O oo

"Why do people keeping blaming the world and his wife for what is the fault of the parents.

Parents who dont obviously care, who are not bothered that their offspring run amok.

And expect others to put the problem right.

Like the social services.and schools.

The country didnt fail them.

Their so called parents did.

And the victims pay the price.AS always "

What she said ^^^^

Plus, for me, teaching a child right from wrong is a requirement from the parents.

If a child is taught this and still acts like these nasty pieces of work did, then in my mind they are evil.

I can never get my head around the fact that someone would want to inflict so much pain onto someone, it just beggars belief for me.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Why not put the parents into jail too. for the full life sentance.

They are as guilty in my eyes.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Im shocked once again at the legal system of this country.

What do they get ??..5 years...5 YEARS !!...

I really do feel so sorry for the victims and there familys and hope to god that they can some how get over this and make their lives something so much better !"

And the women who let her brain dead son pass away by turning of his life support after being told he would never recover and would spend the rest of his life in hospital having a machine breath for him got life....go figure

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"its nowt to do with government

these boys knew deep down what they were doing was wrong

I do hope they get picked on in where they are

A bully will always meet a bigger bully enentually"

Local authorities have admitted this was preventable. These tossers, authorities, are not doing their jobs. It`s the same excuses every time.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Why not put the parents into jail too. for the full life sentance.

They are as guilty in my eyes.

You are soooo right there.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

should throw away the key n rot in hell

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *adchickCouple over a year ago

Cyprus

The police are looking to prosecute the parents. Apparently, they are taking advice as to what they can do to ensure a conviction.

Well..... that's what Sky News are reporting at this moment.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"its nowt to do with government

these boys knew deep down what they were doing was wrong

I do hope they get picked on in where they are

A bully will always meet a bigger bully enentually

Local authorities have admitted this was preventable. These tossers, authorities, are not doing their jobs. It`s the same excuses every time."

But why should the blame be put on the authorities ?

The schools, the social services, the neighbours etc. ?????

I was a right little cow growing up, gave my mother grey hair etc. but i wasnt violent or a vandal.

I came in late and answered back.

It didnt warrant getting someone else in to take the blame. I got a clout round the earhole from me mom and god help me if i did it again.

Why the hell is it everyone elses problem but the parents ?

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago
Forum Mod

"The police are looking to prosecute the parents. Apparently, they are taking advice as to what they can do to ensure a conviction.

Well..... that's what Sky News are reporting at this moment."

So they should,they deserve it too

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *r cassie4Couple over a year ago

highlands

fuckin hang the we bastards sorry for my talk but we need to start punishing people

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

I think it is quite possible that some people can be 'born evil' I have no evidence to prove this theory, but I believe it is possible.

I know of 1 person in particular who grew up with his 2 brothers in a family where both the parents worked and the family had a very good standard of living, holidays, nice clothes, well looked after etc etc etc. They wern't spoiled but they were brought up the right way, to have respect, manners and to know right from wrong - the whole 9 yards.

2 of the lads gew up to be model citizens, but the brother, the 1 to which I refer, grew up to be a proper little shit, into drugs, all manner of petty crime, pinching cars, burglary the lot ... he ended up in and out of jail - much to the dispair of his parents.

Now we can have all the fancy talk in the world, all the reasons and excuses under the sun why these 2 behaved the way they did, but at the end of the day they were and still are and probably always will be a couple of little bastards.

It's high time we started to just accept the fact that some people are born to be bad, quit listening to the talk by the well paid 'experts', bang them up and chuck away the key.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"fuckin hang the we bastards sorry for my talk but we need to start punishing people"

bit strong for a 10 and 11 year old

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Have a heart!