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Question time, Brexit audience
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"Will people listen to the comments or have you already my made your mind up? " Both  | |||
"Will people listen to the comments or have you already my made your mind up? " is the panel a mix ? (Ps thx for the reminder) | |||
"Will people listen to the comments or have you already my made your mind up? is the panel a mix ? (Ps thx for the reminder)" Yep, tbh it has been decent , everyone on the panel is blaming the government (for balance, the tories refused an invite for a minister from QT ) | |||
"Will people listen to the comments or have you already my made your mind up? is the panel a mix ? (Ps thx for the reminder) Yep, tbh it has been decent , everyone on the panel is blaming the government (for balance, the tories refused an invite for a minister from QT ) " spoilers ! I'm not on iPlayer | |||
"Will people listen to the comments or have you already my made your mind up? is the panel a mix ? (Ps thx for the reminder) Yep, tbh it has been decent , everyone on the panel is blaming the government (for balance, the tories refused an invite for a minister from QT ) spoilers ! I'm not on iPlayer " Ah, it’s worth a watch if have the time | |||
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"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place "interesting. I'm not sure I would now, dopends on the terms. But also because it's an absolute distraction versus the real issues. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place interesting. I'm not sure I would now, dopends on the terms. But also because it's an absolute distraction versus the real issues. "I figured it would be mich higher than that. We're always told how terrible it is and how only a small % still thinks it's a good idea etc so I genuinely thought it would be higher than that. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place interesting. I'm not sure I would now, dopends on the terms. But also because it's an absolute distraction versus the real issues.
I figured it would be mich higher than that. We're always told how terrible it is and how only a small % still thinks it's a good idea etc so I genuinely thought it would be higher than that."guess it depends how the q was phrased. Re-entering is different to not leaving. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place "Polling from a couple of weeks ago had 55% on a similar poll, but wording is vital with polling - that one was something about ‘was the U.K right to leave the EU’ with 55% no, and 30-some yes. Irrelevant anyway now. We just have to wait for the sunlit uplands to arrive  | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place interesting. I'm not sure I would now, dopends on the terms. But also because it's an absolute distraction versus the real issues.
I figured it would be mich higher than that. We're always told how terrible it is and how only a small % still thinks it's a good idea etc so I genuinely thought it would be higher than that.guess it depends how the q was phrased. Re-entering is different to not leaving. "Yeah no doubt. Its a 537 page report and tbh I can't be arsed to find the exact wording if the question. | |||
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"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Polling from a couple of weeks ago had 55% on a similar poll, but wording is vital with polling - that one was something about ‘was the U.K right to leave the EU’ with 55% no, and 30-some yes.
Irrelevant anyway now. We just have to wait for the sunlit uplands to arrive "You were doing so well until the last sentence. You're part of the problem as to why there's such a dicide over Brexit. | |||
"https://www.statista.com/statistics/987347/brexit-opinion-poll/" I'm not arguing against your link. It's quite clearly a different subject. Only 48% want to rejoin. As Hovis said, it's different to leaving. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Polling from a couple of weeks ago had 55% on a similar poll, but wording is vital with polling - that one was something about ‘was the U.K right to leave the EU’ with 55% no, and 30-some yes.
Irrelevant anyway now. We just have to wait for the sunlit uplands to arrive
You were doing so well until the last sentence. You're part of the problem as to why there's such a dicide over Brexit."I’ve explained before that I’m satisfied, leave won the argument, leave won the referendum, and now leave can deliver their promises. Not my circus, not my monkeys. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Polling from a couple of weeks ago had 55% on a similar poll, but wording is vital with polling - that one was something about ‘was the U.K right to leave the EU’ with 55% no, and 30-some yes.
Irrelevant anyway now. We just have to wait for the sunlit uplands to arrive
You were doing so well until the last sentence. You're part of the problem as to why there's such a dicide over Brexit.
I’ve explained before that I’m satisfied, leave won the argument, leave won the referendum, and now leave can deliver their promises.
Not my circus, not my monkeys. "You're so satisfied you can't help with the jibes
You need to give your head a wobble my friend. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Polling from a couple of weeks ago had 55% on a similar poll, but wording is vital with polling - that one was something about ‘was the U.K right to leave the EU’ with 55% no, and 30-some yes.
Irrelevant anyway now. We just have to wait for the sunlit uplands to arrive
You were doing so well until the last sentence. You're part of the problem as to why there's such a dicide over Brexit.
I’ve explained before that I’m satisfied, leave won the argument, leave won the referendum, and now leave can deliver their promises.
Not my circus, not my monkeys.
You're so satisfied you can't help with the jibes
You need to give your head a wobble my friend."Oh I’ll absolutely continue with the jibes. I like pointing out just how wrong David Davis, Liam Fox et Al were. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Polling from a couple of weeks ago had 55% on a similar poll, but wording is vital with polling - that one was something about ‘was the U.K right to leave the EU’ with 55% no, and 30-some yes.
Irrelevant anyway now. We just have to wait for the sunlit uplands to arrive
You were doing so well until the last sentence. You're part of the problem as to why there's such a dicide over Brexit.
I’ve explained before that I’m satisfied, leave won the argument, leave won the referendum, and now leave can deliver their promises.
Not my circus, not my monkeys.
You're so satisfied you can't help with the jibes
You need to give your head a wobble my friend.
Oh I’ll absolutely continue with the jibes. I like pointing out just how wrong David Davis, Liam Fox et Al were."Satisfied then | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Polling from a couple of weeks ago had 55% on a similar poll, but wording is vital with polling - that one was something about ‘was the U.K right to leave the EU’ with 55% no, and 30-some yes.
Irrelevant anyway now. We just have to wait for the sunlit uplands to arrive
You were doing so well until the last sentence. You're part of the problem as to why there's such a dicide over Brexit.
I’ve explained before that I’m satisfied, leave won the argument, leave won the referendum, and now leave can deliver their promises.
Not my circus, not my monkeys.
You're so satisfied you can't help with the jibes
You need to give your head a wobble my friend.
Oh I’ll absolutely continue with the jibes. I like pointing out just how wrong David Davis, Liam Fox et Al were."You should probably leave the sensible discussion to the grown ups  | |||
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"For me the vote was just stay as we where or leave. I like option 3 join EU take the euro become a state of Europe. So for me it was all in or all out so had to vote leave. I'd be happy to rejoin but not like it was. 1 x Europe 1 x Army 1 x currency 1 x Heath System In to me is all in oh and that would make Westminster redundant at the same time so sack that lot Lords and Commons. Even scrap the royals.. " Sometimes it's hard to know when someone is taking the piss or not. This is not even exaggerated from some of the stuff people post here. | |||
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"For me the vote was just stay as we where or leave. I like option 3 join EU take the euro become a state of Europe. So for me it was all in or all out so had to vote leave. I'd be happy to rejoin but not like it was. 1 x Europe 1 x Army 1 x currency 1 x Heath System In to me is all in oh and that would make Westminster redundant at the same time so sack that lot Lords and Commons. Even scrap the royals.. Sometimes it's hard to know when someone is taking the piss or not. This is not even exaggerated from some of the stuff people post here." No I'm serious in for me is in | |||
"If we ever rejoin then the euro won’t be a question - it’ll be mandatory. And we’ll lose out opt-outs. We had perhaps the best deal of any EU member." You say we had the best but one day I would buy things from the EU at one price then it would be a diferant price the next day. Same now but have more options where to trade. | |||
"For me the vote was just stay as we where or leave. I like option 3 join EU take the euro become a state of Europe. So for me it was all in or all out so had to vote leave. I'd be happy to rejoin but not like it was. 1 x Europe 1 x Army 1 x currency 1 x Heath System In to me is all in oh and that would make Westminster redundant at the same time so sack that lot Lords and Commons. Even scrap the royals.. Sometimes it's hard to know when someone is taking the piss or not. This is not even exaggerated from some of the stuff people post here. No I'm serious in for me is in " What's the health system? | |||
"If we ever rejoin then the euro won’t be a question - it’ll be mandatory. And we’ll lose out opt-outs. We had perhaps the best deal of any EU member. You say we had the best but one day I would buy things from the EU at one price then it would be a diferant price the next day. Same now but have more options where to trade." We could always trade with the world. We did trade with the world. | |||
"If we ever rejoin then the euro won’t be a question - it’ll be mandatory. And we’ll lose out opt-outs. We had perhaps the best deal of any EU member. You say we had the best but one day I would buy things from the EU at one price then it would be a diferant price the next day. Same now but have more options where to trade. We could always trade with the world. We did trade with the world. " Yes but trade was easer with EU but I now do more globally as the paper work is the same cost. | |||
"For me the vote was just stay as we where or leave. I like option 3 join EU take the euro become a state of Europe. So for me it was all in or all out so had to vote leave. I'd be happy to rejoin but not like it was. 1 x Europe 1 x Army 1 x currency 1 x Heath System In to me is all in oh and that would make Westminster redundant at the same time so sack that lot Lords and Commons. Even scrap the royals.. " Gets my vote. . Hegemonies are changing across the world, and the USA are on shaky ground with the level of debt they have accrued. Their national debt is ($32.10 Trillion Dollar) (Source : UK Treasury). Debt is fine of course, provided you can service it. Can the US continue to fund this debt level ? I don't know, I'm not an economist. . But other Superpowers are circling in the shallows and if the US do default on their debt, the Dollar will take a huge confidence hit. . Which goes back to why I'd vote for Federal Europe as per the OP's comments. . A Federal Europe would be in a very strong position to use the Euro to replace the Dollar if the USA tanked. . As an ex-European citizen, a financially and militarily stronger Europe is still in my personal interests. You can pretty much guarantee that if Xi or Putin hate the idea, it's good for Europe. . I just hope the UK play nicely, because we're an even smaller voice and have no seat at the at the table anymore. I know we like to bark a lot, but so does my mother's chihuahua. | |||
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"The uk will never rejoin the e.u For that to happen we'd have to join the euro. We'd have to accept a shared debt and no control over our own currency. It would also take a Conservative government and hard austerity to meet the required economic levels. " I suspect we’ll end up with at least an EFTA type arrangement, through demographics and demand alone. | |||
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"The uk will never rejoin the e.u For that to happen we'd have to join the euro. We'd have to accept a shared debt and no control over our own currency. It would also take a Conservative government and hard austerity to meet the required economic levels. " I would say unlikely to re join. As you point out the pound would most likely have to go. Also I read somewhere that the EU itself, in the last few years has gone from running a surplus to being hundreds of billions in debt. Member States will have to contribute to that on top of their own debt but does a new member have to contribute to it? | |||
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"The uk will never rejoin the e.u For that to happen we'd have to join the euro. We'd have to accept a shared debt and no control over our own currency. It would also take a Conservative government and hard austerity to meet the required economic levels. I would say unlikely to re join. As you point out the pound would most likely have to go. Also I read somewhere that the EU itself, in the last few years has gone from running a surplus to being hundreds of billions in debt. Member States will have to contribute to that on top of their own debt but does a new member have to contribute to it?" EU total debt is mind boggling if you simply look at the totals, but as a percentage of GDP it’s not out of the ordinary. It’s complex though due to the differing individual debt levels of each nation. (Which I guess renders the term ‘eu debt’ a bit moot) | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that! "No more bizarre than any of the other reasons people voted. There was a guy on here a while back who said he voted Leave because he had a torrid time trying to move to the UK, and he wanted it to be just as painful for everyone else. | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
No more bizarre than any of the other reasons people voted.
There was a guy on here a while back who said he voted Leave because he had a torrid time trying to move to the UK, and he wanted it to be just as painful for everyone else."Ha, I remember him, another one who was very confused, | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that! "A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about” Why yes, yes I am! | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!"Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince "Damn that EU and their….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding. | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince " | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and their….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding."Another Brexit voting halfwit claims he has seen people arrive and go straight to the benefit offices to claim handouts, a bit creepy that he is following people around from the ports or airports | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding."Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding , | |||
"The uk will never rejoin the e.u For that to happen we'd have to join the euro. We'd have to accept a shared debt and no control over our own currency. It would also take a Conservative government and hard austerity to meet the required economic levels. I would say unlikely to re join. As you point out the pound would most likely have to go. Also I read somewhere that the EU itself, in the last few years has gone from running a surplus to being hundreds of billions in debt. Member States will have to contribute to that on top of their own debt but does a new member have to contribute to it? EU total debt is mind boggling if you simply look at the totals, but as a percentage of GDP it’s not out of the ordinary. It’s complex though due to the differing individual debt levels of each nation. (Which I guess renders the term ‘eu debt’ a bit moot)" Some states in the EU have absolutely shocking debt to gdp ratio. In fact most of the west have. It skews the avg. With that avg somewhere just over 90%. I know, I know, ours is higher but this isn't a comparison. | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding , "What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money. The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought"Yep. Some aren't capable of analysis though. | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought"This makes even less sense. If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more. Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best. | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought
This makes even less sense.
If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more.
Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best."I'm not defending or disagreeing with her point of view, I thought the analysis of her thoughts were unkind and misleading. | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought
This makes even less sense.
If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more.
Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best.
I'm not defending or disagreeing with her point of view, I thought the analysis of her thoughts were unkind and misleading.
"Fair enough. I'll watch the show. Not for that moment. But out of general interest. | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought"Why does it cost us more money? | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought
This makes even less sense.
If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more.
Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best."Maybe she has travelled around the EU checking on people working on roofs | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought
This makes even less sense.
If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more.
Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best.
Maybe she has travelled around the EU checking on people working on roofs "She came across has someone who knew about France. But you missed her point, which was trying to explain her experiences of seeing of UK businesses playing by the rules and EU businesses not. I have no idea if she is right or wrong, but I do not disrespect her for having a personal view. | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought
This makes even less sense.
If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more.
Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best.
Maybe she has travelled around the EU checking on people working on roofs
She came across has someone who knew about France. But you missed her point, which was trying to explain her experiences of seeing of UK businesses playing by the rules and EU businesses not.
I have no idea if she is right or wrong, but I do not disrespect her for having a personal view."Did she? Where is her evidence that uk businesses play by the rules and the EU doesn’t? She just came up with a load of stereotyping bollocks to try and prove something she has made up. Thick as mince | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought
This makes even less sense.
If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more.
Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best.
Maybe she has travelled around the EU checking on people working on roofs
She came across has someone who knew about France. But you missed her point, which was trying to explain her experiences of seeing of UK businesses playing by the rules and EU businesses not.
I have no idea if she is right or wrong, but I do not disrespect her for having a personal view.
Did she? Where is her evidence that uk businesses play by the rules and the EU doesn’t? She just came up with a load of stereotyping bollocks to try and prove something she has made up. Thick as mince "Bullshit. You can't just say someone is making up bollocks because you don't know. If that's what she saw, rats what she saw. | |||
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"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought
This makes even less sense.
If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more.
Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best.
Maybe she has travelled around the EU checking on people working on roofs
She came across has someone who knew about France. But you missed her point, which was trying to explain her experiences of seeing of UK businesses playing by the rules and EU businesses not.
I have no idea if she is right or wrong, but I do not disrespect her for having a personal view.
Did she? Where is her evidence that uk businesses play by the rules and the EU doesn’t? She just came up with a load of stereotyping bollocks to try and prove something she has made up. Thick as mince
Bullshit. You can't just say someone is making up bollocks because you don't know.
If that's what she saw, rats what she saw. "I’ve seen plenty of dodgy builders in the UK. Does that mean we weren’t abiding by EU regs as well? | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought
This makes even less sense.
If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more.
Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best.
Maybe she has travelled around the EU checking on people working on roofs
She came across has someone who knew about France. But you missed her point, which was trying to explain her experiences of seeing of UK businesses playing by the rules and EU businesses not.
I have no idea if she is right or wrong, but I do not disrespect her for having a personal view.
Did she? Where is her evidence that uk businesses play by the rules and the EU doesn’t? She just came up with a load of stereotyping bollocks to try and prove something she has made up. Thick as mince "I'm seeing you becoming more inclined to be disrespectful and rude of late. Are you okay? | |||
"Rats "Forever just here to try pick on people. How about showing us yours, that was the point of the thread. | |||
| |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought
This makes even less sense.
If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more.
Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best.
Maybe she has travelled around the EU checking on people working on roofs
She came across has someone who knew about France. But you missed her point, which was trying to explain her experiences of seeing of UK businesses playing by the rules and EU businesses not.
I have no idea if she is right or wrong, but I do not disrespect her for having a personal view.
Did she? Where is her evidence that uk businesses play by the rules and the EU doesn’t? She just came up with a load of stereotyping bollocks to try and prove something she has made up. Thick as mince
Bullshit. You can't just say someone is making up bollocks because you don't know.
If that's what she saw, rats what she saw.
I’ve seen plenty of dodgy builders in the UK. Does that mean we weren’t abiding by EU regs as well? "What's 'dodgy'? | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought
This makes even less sense.
If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more.
Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best.
Maybe she has travelled around the EU checking on people working on roofs
She came across has someone who knew about France. But you missed her point, which was trying to explain her experiences of seeing of UK businesses playing by the rules and EU businesses not.
I have no idea if she is right or wrong, but I do not disrespect her for having a personal view.
Did she? Where is her evidence that uk businesses play by the rules and the EU doesn’t? She just came up with a load of stereotyping bollocks to try and prove something she has made up. Thick as mince
Bullshit. You can't just say someone is making up bollocks because you don't know.
If that's what she saw, rats what she saw.
I’ve seen plenty of dodgy builders in the UK. Does that mean we weren’t abiding by EU regs as well? "Possibly, if that’s what you saw then obviously it applies to everyone | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought
This makes even less sense.
If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more.
Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best.
Maybe she has travelled around the EU checking on people working on roofs
She came across has someone who knew about France. But you missed her point, which was trying to explain her experiences of seeing of UK businesses playing by the rules and EU businesses not.
I have no idea if she is right or wrong, but I do not disrespect her for having a personal view.
Did she? Where is her evidence that uk businesses play by the rules and the EU doesn’t? She just came up with a load of stereotyping bollocks to try and prove something she has made up. Thick as mince
Bullshit. You can't just say someone is making up bollocks because you don't know.
If that's what she saw, rats what she saw.
I’ve seen plenty of dodgy builders in the UK. Does that mean we weren’t abiding by EU regs as well? "It is clear she had a poor example, and we are not discussing the rights or wrongs of experiences, just her right to express them without people on here being rude towards her. | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought
This makes even less sense.
If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more.
Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best.
Maybe she has travelled around the EU checking on people working on roofs
She came across has someone who knew about France. But you missed her point, which was trying to explain her experiences of seeing of UK businesses playing by the rules and EU businesses not.
I have no idea if she is right or wrong, but I do not disrespect her for having a personal view.
Did she? Where is her evidence that uk businesses play by the rules and the EU doesn’t? She just came up with a load of stereotyping bollocks to try and prove something she has made up. Thick as mince
Bullshit. You can't just say someone is making up bollocks because you don't know.
If that's what she saw, rats what she saw.
I’ve seen plenty of dodgy builders in the UK. Does that mean we weren’t abiding by EU regs as well?
Possibly, if that’s what you saw then obviously it applies to everyone "Rod Hull (RIP) fell of a roof in the UK , whatever does this mean | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought
This makes even less sense.
If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more.
Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best.
Maybe she has travelled around the EU checking on people working on roofs
She came across has someone who knew about France. But you missed her point, which was trying to explain her experiences of seeing of UK businesses playing by the rules and EU businesses not.
I have no idea if she is right or wrong, but I do not disrespect her for having a personal view.
Did she? Where is her evidence that uk businesses play by the rules and the EU doesn’t? She just came up with a load of stereotyping bollocks to try and prove something she has made up. Thick as mince
Bullshit. You can't just say someone is making up bollocks because you don't know.
If that's what she saw, rats what she saw.
I’ve seen plenty of dodgy builders in the UK. Does that mean we weren’t abiding by EU regs as well?
It is clear she had a poor example, and we are not discussing the rights or wrongs of experiences, just her right to express them without people on here being rude towards her. "Thick as mince | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought
This makes even less sense.
If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more.
Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best.
Maybe she has travelled around the EU checking on people working on roofs
She came across has someone who knew about France. But you missed her point, which was trying to explain her experiences of seeing of UK businesses playing by the rules and EU businesses not.
I have no idea if she is right or wrong, but I do not disrespect her for having a personal view.
Did she? Where is her evidence that uk businesses play by the rules and the EU doesn’t? She just came up with a load of stereotyping bollocks to try and prove something she has made up. Thick as mince
Bullshit. You can't just say someone is making up bollocks because you don't know.
If that's what she saw, rats what she saw.
I’ve seen plenty of dodgy builders in the UK. Does that mean we weren’t abiding by EU regs as well?
Possibly, if that’s what you saw then obviously it applies to everyone
Rod Hull (RIP) fell of a roof in the UK , whatever does this mean "You mentioned right leaning comedians being unfunny and worn out material... | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought
This makes even less sense.
If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more.
Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best.
Maybe she has travelled around the EU checking on people working on roofs
She came across has someone who knew about France. But you missed her point, which was trying to explain her experiences of seeing of UK businesses playing by the rules and EU businesses not.
I have no idea if she is right or wrong, but I do not disrespect her for having a personal view.
Did she? Where is her evidence that uk businesses play by the rules and the EU doesn’t? She just came up with a load of stereotyping bollocks to try and prove something she has made up. Thick as mince
Bullshit. You can't just say someone is making up bollocks because you don't know.
If that's what she saw, rats what she saw.
I’ve seen plenty of dodgy builders in the UK. Does that mean we weren’t abiding by EU regs as well?
Possibly, if that’s what you saw then obviously it applies to everyone
Rod Hull (RIP) fell of a roof in the UK , whatever does this mean
You mentioned right leaning comedians being unfunny and worn out material... "Rod Hull was right leaning? Or was Emu right leaning? | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought
This makes even less sense.
If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more.
Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best.
Maybe she has travelled around the EU checking on people working on roofs
She came across has someone who knew about France. But you missed her point, which was trying to explain her experiences of seeing of UK businesses playing by the rules and EU businesses not.
I have no idea if she is right or wrong, but I do not disrespect her for having a personal view.
Did she? Where is her evidence that uk businesses play by the rules and the EU doesn’t? She just came up with a load of stereotyping bollocks to try and prove something she has made up. Thick as mince
Bullshit. You can't just say someone is making up bollocks because you don't know.
If that's what she saw, rats what she saw.
I’ve seen plenty of dodgy builders in the UK. Does that mean we weren’t abiding by EU regs as well?
It is clear she had a poor example, and we are not discussing the rights or wrongs of experiences, just her right to express them without people on here being rude towards her. "She went on telly and spouted unsubstantiated nonsense. | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought
This makes even less sense.
If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more.
Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best.
Maybe she has travelled around the EU checking on people working on roofs
She came across has someone who knew about France. But you missed her point, which was trying to explain her experiences of seeing of UK businesses playing by the rules and EU businesses not.
I have no idea if she is right or wrong, but I do not disrespect her for having a personal view.
Did she? Where is her evidence that uk businesses play by the rules and the EU doesn’t? She just came up with a load of stereotyping bollocks to try and prove something she has made up. Thick as mince
Bullshit. You can't just say someone is making up bollocks because you don't know.
If that's what she saw, rats what she saw.
I’ve seen plenty of dodgy builders in the UK. Does that mean we weren’t abiding by EU regs as well?
It is clear she had a poor example, and we are not discussing the rights or wrongs of experiences, just her right to express them without people on here being rude towards her.
Thick as mince "always looking to antagonise | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought
This makes even less sense.
If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more.
Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best.
Maybe she has travelled around the EU checking on people working on roofs
She came across has someone who knew about France. But you missed her point, which was trying to explain her experiences of seeing of UK businesses playing by the rules and EU businesses not.
I have no idea if she is right or wrong, but I do not disrespect her for having a personal view.
Did she? Where is her evidence that uk businesses play by the rules and the EU doesn’t? She just came up with a load of stereotyping bollocks to try and prove something she has made up. Thick as mince
Bullshit. You can't just say someone is making up bollocks because you don't know.
If that's what she saw, rats what she saw.
I’ve seen plenty of dodgy builders in the UK. Does that mean we weren’t abiding by EU regs as well?
It is clear she had a poor example, and we are not discussing the rights or wrongs of experiences, just her right to express them without people on here being rude towards her.
She went on telly and spouted unsubstantiated nonsense. "Whilst making a pathetic lazy stereotype that ‘foreign’ workers don’t follow health and safety rules, thick as mince | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought
This makes even less sense.
If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more.
Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best.
Maybe she has travelled around the EU checking on people working on roofs
She came across has someone who knew about France. But you missed her point, which was trying to explain her experiences of seeing of UK businesses playing by the rules and EU businesses not.
I have no idea if she is right or wrong, but I do not disrespect her for having a personal view.
Did she? Where is her evidence that uk businesses play by the rules and the EU doesn’t? She just came up with a load of stereotyping bollocks to try and prove something she has made up. Thick as mince
Bullshit. You can't just say someone is making up bollocks because you don't know.
If that's what she saw, rats what she saw.
I’ve seen plenty of dodgy builders in the UK. Does that mean we weren’t abiding by EU regs as well?
It is clear she had a poor example, and we are not discussing the rights or wrongs of experiences, just her right to express them without people on here being rude towards her.
Thick as mince
always looking to antagonise"Is she on here, or are you getting offended on someone else’s (that you don’t know) behalf | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought
This makes even less sense.
If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more.
Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best.
Maybe she has travelled around the EU checking on people working on roofs
She came across has someone who knew about France. But you missed her point, which was trying to explain her experiences of seeing of UK businesses playing by the rules and EU businesses not.
I have no idea if she is right or wrong, but I do not disrespect her for having a personal view.
Did she? Where is her evidence that uk businesses play by the rules and the EU doesn’t? She just came up with a load of stereotyping bollocks to try and prove something she has made up. Thick as mince
Bullshit. You can't just say someone is making up bollocks because you don't know.
If that's what she saw, rats what she saw.
I’ve seen plenty of dodgy builders in the UK. Does that mean we weren’t abiding by EU regs as well?
It is clear she had a poor example, and we are not discussing the rights or wrongs of experiences, just her right to express them without people on here being rude towards her.
Thick as mince
always looking to antagonise
Is she on here, or are you getting offended on someone else’s (that you don’t know) behalf "I'm not offended, I'm just not a fan of people who throw out rude remarks at every opportunity. | |||
| |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought
This makes even less sense.
If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more.
Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best.
Maybe she has travelled around the EU checking on people working on roofs
She came across has someone who knew about France. But you missed her point, which was trying to explain her experiences of seeing of UK businesses playing by the rules and EU businesses not.
I have no idea if she is right or wrong, but I do not disrespect her for having a personal view.
Did she? Where is her evidence that uk businesses play by the rules and the EU doesn’t? She just came up with a load of stereotyping bollocks to try and prove something she has made up. Thick as mince
Bullshit. You can't just say someone is making up bollocks because you don't know.
If that's what she saw, rats what she saw.
I’ve seen plenty of dodgy builders in the UK. Does that mean we weren’t abiding by EU regs as well?
It is clear she had a poor example, and we are not discussing the rights or wrongs of experiences, just her right to express them without people on here being rude towards her.
Thick as mince
always looking to antagonise
Is she on here, or are you getting offended on someone else’s (that you don’t know) behalf
I'm not offended, I'm just not a fan of people who throw out rude remarks at every opportunity. "A bit of a snowflake then. You don’t have to read or comment if you don’t want to | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought
This makes even less sense.
If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more.
Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best.
Maybe she has travelled around the EU checking on people working on roofs
She came across has someone who knew about France. But you missed her point, which was trying to explain her experiences of seeing of UK businesses playing by the rules and EU businesses not.
I have no idea if she is right or wrong, but I do not disrespect her for having a personal view.
Did she? Where is her evidence that uk businesses play by the rules and the EU doesn’t? She just came up with a load of stereotyping bollocks to try and prove something she has made up. Thick as mince
Bullshit. You can't just say someone is making up bollocks because you don't know.
If that's what she saw, rats what she saw.
I’ve seen plenty of dodgy builders in the UK. Does that mean we weren’t abiding by EU regs as well?
It is clear she had a poor example, and we are not discussing the rights or wrongs of experiences, just her right to express them without people on here being rude towards her.
Thick as mince
always looking to antagonise
Is she on here, or are you getting offended on someone else’s (that you don’t know) behalf
I'm not offended, I'm just not a fan of people who throw out rude remarks at every opportunity.
A bit of a snowflake then. You don’t have to read or comment if you don’t want to "Again the rude comments... | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought
This makes even less sense.
If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more.
Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best.
Maybe she has travelled around the EU checking on people working on roofs
She came across has someone who knew about France. But you missed her point, which was trying to explain her experiences of seeing of UK businesses playing by the rules and EU businesses not.
I have no idea if she is right or wrong, but I do not disrespect her for having a personal view.
Did she? Where is her evidence that uk businesses play by the rules and the EU doesn’t? She just came up with a load of stereotyping bollocks to try and prove something she has made up. Thick as mince
Bullshit. You can't just say someone is making up bollocks because you don't know.
If that's what she saw, rats what she saw.
I’ve seen plenty of dodgy builders in the UK. Does that mean we weren’t abiding by EU regs as well?
It is clear she had a poor example, and we are not discussing the rights or wrongs of experiences, just her right to express them without people on here being rude towards her.
Thick as mince
always looking to antagonise
Is she on here, or are you getting offended on someone else’s (that you don’t know) behalf
I'm not offended, I'm just not a fan of people who throw out rude remarks at every opportunity.
A bit of a snowflake then. You don’t have to read or comment if you don’t want to
Again the rude comments... "Snowflake is rude? | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought
This makes even less sense.
If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more.
Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best.
Maybe she has travelled around the EU checking on people working on roofs
She came across has someone who knew about France. But you missed her point, which was trying to explain her experiences of seeing of UK businesses playing by the rules and EU businesses not.
I have no idea if she is right or wrong, but I do not disrespect her for having a personal view.
Did she? Where is her evidence that uk businesses play by the rules and the EU doesn’t? She just came up with a load of stereotyping bollocks to try and prove something she has made up. Thick as mince
Bullshit. You can't just say someone is making up bollocks because you don't know.
If that's what she saw, rats what she saw.
I’ve seen plenty of dodgy builders in the UK. Does that mean we weren’t abiding by EU regs as well?
It is clear she had a poor example, and we are not discussing the rights or wrongs of experiences, just her right to express them without people on here being rude towards her.
Thick as mince
always looking to antagonise
Is she on here, or are you getting offended on someone else’s (that you don’t know) behalf
I'm not offended, I'm just not a fan of people who throw out rude remarks at every opportunity.
A bit of a snowflake then. You don’t have to read or comment if you don’t want to
Again the rude comments...
Snowflake is rude? "Your inclination is to be rude, you could have left off "a bit of a snowflake then" as there was no real need to say that. The last part of your post is reasonable, in terms of me not needing to reply, however suggesting I don't need to read the posts is a little far reaching from you | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought
This makes even less sense.
If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more.
Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best.
Maybe she has travelled around the EU checking on people working on roofs
She came across has someone who knew about France. But you missed her point, which was trying to explain her experiences of seeing of UK businesses playing by the rules and EU businesses not.
I have no idea if she is right or wrong, but I do not disrespect her for having a personal view.
Did she? Where is her evidence that uk businesses play by the rules and the EU doesn’t? She just came up with a load of stereotyping bollocks to try and prove something she has made up. Thick as mince
Bullshit. You can't just say someone is making up bollocks because you don't know.
If that's what she saw, rats what she saw.
I’ve seen plenty of dodgy builders in the UK. Does that mean we weren’t abiding by EU regs as well?
It is clear she had a poor example, and we are not discussing the rights or wrongs of experiences, just her right to express them without people on here being rude towards her.
Thick as mince
always looking to antagonise
Is she on here, or are you getting offended on someone else’s (that you don’t know) behalf
I'm not offended, I'm just not a fan of people who throw out rude remarks at every opportunity.
A bit of a snowflake then. You don’t have to read or comment if you don’t want to
Again the rude comments...
Snowflake is rude?
Your inclination is to be rude, you could have left off "a bit of a snowflake then" as there was no real need to say that. The last part of your post is reasonable, in terms of me not needing to reply, however suggesting I don't need to read the posts is a little far reaching from you "It’s up to you, | |||
"For balance (apart from the halfwit who thought immigrants can immediately claim benefits) the audience and the panel made some very good points "I've not seen QT for ages but may have to catch up with this one. Did anyone state when and what immigrants get in benefits? I have found (and it was on a thread here the other week) that asylum seekers get a benefit even while awaiting a decision on their asylum claim. | |||
"For balance (apart from the halfwit who thought immigrants can immediately claim benefits) the audience and the panel made some very good points
I've not seen QT for ages but may have to catch up with this one. Did anyone state when and what immigrants get in benefits? I have found (and it was on a thread here the other week) that asylum seekers get a benefit even while awaiting a decision on their asylum claim. "They do Indeed. And rightly so. | |||
"They do Indeed. And rightly so." Be sure to tell yourself that the next time you hit a pot hole or need a doctors appointment. Maybe even many years from down if you hit 75 and manage to get any kind of pension. | |||
"For balance (apart from the halfwit who thought immigrants can immediately claim benefits) the audience and the panel made some very good points
I've not seen QT for ages but may have to catch up with this one. Did anyone state when and what immigrants get in benefits? I have found (and it was on a thread here the other week) that asylum seekers get a benefit even while awaiting a decision on their asylum claim.
They do Indeed. And rightly so."You are quite the provocateur aren’t you? | |||
"They do Indeed. And rightly so. Be sure to tell yourself that the next time you hit a pot hole or need a doctors appointment. Maybe even many years from down if you hit 75 and manage to get any kind of pension. "That's right. The only options are help asylum seekers and have holes in the road, no doctors, and no pension. Or vice versa. | |||
"They do Indeed. And rightly so. Be sure to tell yourself that the next time you hit a pot hole or need a doctors appointment. Maybe even many years from down if you hit 75 and manage to get any kind of pension. "We’re the 5th richest economy in the world. The fact that services are poor is down to poor government, not lack of cash. | |||
"For balance (apart from the halfwit who thought immigrants can immediately claim benefits) the audience and the panel made some very good points
I've not seen QT for ages but may have to catch up with this one. Did anyone state when and what immigrants get in benefits? I have found (and it was on a thread here the other week) that asylum seekers get a benefit even while awaiting a decision on their asylum claim.
They do Indeed. And rightly so.
You are quite the provocateur aren’t you?"No. Just believe in helping the neediest. | |||
| |||
"For balance (apart from the halfwit who thought immigrants can immediately claim benefits) the audience and the panel made some very good points
I've not seen QT for ages but may have to catch up with this one. Did anyone state when and what immigrants get in benefits? I have found (and it was on a thread here the other week) that asylum seekers get a benefit even while awaiting a decision on their asylum claim. "The halfwit in question stated immigrants, he didn’t mention asylum seekers | |||
"For balance (apart from the halfwit who thought immigrants can immediately claim benefits) the audience and the panel made some very good points
I've not seen QT for ages but may have to catch up with this one. Did anyone state when and what immigrants get in benefits? I have found (and it was on a thread here the other week) that asylum seekers get a benefit even while awaiting a decision on their asylum claim.
They do Indeed. And rightly so.
You are quite the provocateur aren’t you?
No. Just believe in helping the neediest."Economic migrants aren’t the neediest, immigrants aren’t the neediest and should have Jobs or means to support themselves before entry. Similar to what you will need to retire in Italy Legitimate asylum seekers are of course in need of help and support | |||
"For balance (apart from the halfwit who thought immigrants can immediately claim benefits) the audience and the panel made some very good points
I've not seen QT for ages but may have to catch up with this one. Did anyone state when and what immigrants get in benefits? I have found (and it was on a thread here the other week) that asylum seekers get a benefit even while awaiting a decision on their asylum claim.
They do Indeed. And rightly so.
You are quite the provocateur aren’t you?
No. Just believe in helping the neediest.
Economic migrants aren’t the neediest, immigrants aren’t the neediest and should have Jobs or means to support themselves before entry. Similar to what you will need to retire in Italy
Legitimate asylum seekers are of course in need of help and support "And we were discussing asylum seekers. | |||
"For balance (apart from the halfwit who thought immigrants can immediately claim benefits) the audience and the panel made some very good points
I've not seen QT for ages but may have to catch up with this one. Did anyone state when and what immigrants get in benefits? I have found (and it was on a thread here the other week) that asylum seekers get a benefit even while awaiting a decision on their asylum claim.
They do Indeed. And rightly so.
You are quite the provocateur aren’t you?
No. Just believe in helping the neediest.
Economic migrants aren’t the neediest, immigrants aren’t the neediest and should have Jobs or means to support themselves before entry. Similar to what you will need to retire in Italy
Legitimate asylum seekers are of course in need of help and support
And we were discussing asylum seekers."The question was about immigrants and benefits. | |||
"For balance (apart from the halfwit who thought immigrants can immediately claim benefits) the audience and the panel made some very good points
I've not seen QT for ages but may have to catch up with this one. Did anyone state when and what immigrants get in benefits? I have found (and it was on a thread here the other week) that asylum seekers get a benefit even while awaiting a decision on their asylum claim.
The halfwit in question stated immigrants, he didn’t mention asylum seekers "That's my understanding too, but was thinking that they may have simply mixed up immigrants with asylum seekers. Maybe they meant asylum seekers get benefits when they arrive | |||
"For balance (apart from the halfwit who thought immigrants can immediately claim benefits) the audience and the panel made some very good points
I've not seen QT for ages but may have to catch up with this one. Did anyone state when and what immigrants get in benefits? I have found (and it was on a thread here the other week) that asylum seekers get a benefit even while awaiting a decision on their asylum claim.
The halfwit in question stated immigrants, he didn’t mention asylum seekers
That's my understanding too, but was thinking that they may have simply mixed up immigrants with asylum seekers. Maybe they meant asylum seekers get benefits when they arrive"Maybe, he obviously wasn’t the sharpest tool in the box | |||
"For balance (apart from the halfwit who thought immigrants can immediately claim benefits) the audience and the panel made some very good points
I've not seen QT for ages but may have to catch up with this one. Did anyone state when and what immigrants get in benefits? I have found (and it was on a thread here the other week) that asylum seekers get a benefit even while awaiting a decision on their asylum claim.
The halfwit in question stated immigrants, he didn’t mention asylum seekers
That's my understanding too, but was thinking that they may have simply mixed up immigrants with asylum seekers. Maybe they meant asylum seekers get benefits when they arrive
Maybe, he obviously wasn’t the sharpest tool in the box "I don't know him so would not judge him personally. He might well have meant immigrants but I can see how he could have made a mistake. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place "Not sure about that. "Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023 Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out? | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out? "No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased. Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think? From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there) "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside." | |||
"For balance (apart from the halfwit who thought immigrants can immediately claim benefits) the audience and the panel made some very good points
I've not seen QT for ages but may have to catch up with this one. Did anyone state when and what immigrants get in benefits? I have found (and it was on a thread here the other week) that asylum seekers get a benefit even while awaiting a decision on their asylum claim.
The halfwit in question stated immigrants, he didn’t mention asylum seekers
That's my understanding too, but was thinking that they may have simply mixed up immigrants with asylum seekers. Maybe they meant asylum seekers get benefits when they arrive
Maybe, he obviously wasn’t the sharpest tool in the box
I don't know him so would not judge him personally. He might well have meant immigrants but I can see how he could have made a mistake."Fair enough, the poor bloke was obviously confused | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside.""I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone. The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs. Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon. "I disagree, I wouldn't try to 'reasonably assume' they would cancel each other out. I'd like to see percentages for who will, who won't and who doesn't know. For me, that's accurate. You're right though, we won't be asked anytime soon. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon. "Indeed, the question won’t be asked for a decade at least. Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling) The leave campaign, by fair means *and* foul, caught lightning in a bottle in 2016. Right time, right circumstances, right people in charge of the country, | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
Indeed, the question won’t be asked for a decade at least.
Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling)
The leave campaign, by fair means *and* foul, caught lightning in a bottle in 2016. Right time, right circumstances, right people in charge of the country, "Right time and circumstances maybe but right people in charge? 75% of MPs campaigned to remain including most of the cabinet at that time. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
Indeed, the question won’t be asked for a decade at least.
Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling)
The leave campaign, by fair means *and* foul, caught lightning in a bottle in 2016. Right time, right circumstances, right people in charge of the country,
Right time and circumstances maybe but right people in charge?
75% of MPs campaigned to remain including most of the cabinet at that time."Yeah, right people in charge. Cameron, Osbourne et al. A gift to the leave campaign. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
Indeed, the question won’t be asked for a decade at least.
Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling)
The leave campaign, by fair means *and* foul, caught lightning in a bottle in 2016. Right time, right circumstances, right people in charge of the country,
Right time and circumstances maybe but right people in charge?
75% of MPs campaigned to remain including most of the cabinet at that time.
Yeah, right people in charge. Cameron, Osbourne et al. A gift to the leave campaign. "Got ya. Still, all those other 400 MP too | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
Indeed, the question won’t be asked for a decade at least.
Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling)
The leave campaign, by fair means *and* foul, caught lightning in a bottle in 2016. Right time, right circumstances, right people in charge of the country,
Right time and circumstances maybe but right people in charge?
75% of MPs campaigned to remain including most of the cabinet at that time.
Yeah, right people in charge. Cameron, Osbourne et al. A gift to the leave campaign.
Got ya. Still, all those other 400 MP too "This is where the job of an MP is genuinely difficult - they’re elected to represent the interests of their constituents and the broader country. Which doesn’t mean simply doing what their constituents demand. If I’m the MP of a fiercely leave area, and the data/analysis tells me that remain is better for my constituents, but my constituents demand leave - I’m in a rock/hard place situation. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
Indeed, the question won’t be asked for a decade at least.
Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling)
The leave campaign, by fair means *and* foul, caught lightning in a bottle in 2016. Right time, right circumstances, right people in charge of the country,
Right time and circumstances maybe but right people in charge?
75% of MPs campaigned to remain including most of the cabinet at that time.
Yeah, right people in charge. Cameron, Osbourne et al. A gift to the leave campaign.
Got ya. Still, all those other 400 MP too
This is where the job of an MP is genuinely difficult - they’re elected to represent the interests of their constituents and the broader country. Which doesn’t mean simply doing what their constituents demand.
If I’m the MP of a fiercely leave area, and the data/analysis tells me that remain is better for my constituents, but my constituents demand leave - I’m in a rock/hard place situation. "That's unfortunate but that's a case of 'if you can't handle the heat' They should have presented the data/debate in a better way. | |||
| |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
Indeed, the question won’t be asked for a decade at least.
Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling)
The leave campaign, by fair means *and* foul, caught lightning in a bottle in 2016. Right time, right circumstances, right people in charge of the country,
Right time and circumstances maybe but right people in charge?
75% of MPs campaigned to remain including most of the cabinet at that time.
Yeah, right people in charge. Cameron, Osbourne et al. A gift to the leave campaign.
Got ya. Still, all those other 400 MP too
This is where the job of an MP is genuinely difficult - they’re elected to represent the interests of their constituents and the broader country. Which doesn’t mean simply doing what their constituents demand.
If I’m the MP of a fiercely leave area, and the data/analysis tells me that remain is better for my constituents, but my constituents demand leave - I’m in a rock/hard place situation.
That's unfortunate but that's a case of 'if you can't handle the heat'
They should have presented the data/debate in a better way."And as we’ve seen, that’s not always enough. Remain won every debate undertaken on ‘facts’ - but leave won on intangibles and undeliverables. It was akin to debating theism. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
Indeed, the question won’t be asked for a decade at least.
Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling)
The leave campaign, by fair means *and* foul, caught lightning in a bottle in 2016. Right time, right circumstances, right people in charge of the country,
Right time and circumstances maybe but right people in charge?
75% of MPs campaigned to remain including most of the cabinet at that time.
Yeah, right people in charge. Cameron, Osbourne et al. A gift to the leave campaign.
Got ya. Still, all those other 400 MP too
This is where the job of an MP is genuinely difficult - they’re elected to represent the interests of their constituents and the broader country. Which doesn’t mean simply doing what their constituents demand.
If I’m the MP of a fiercely leave area, and the data/analysis tells me that remain is better for my constituents, but my constituents demand leave - I’m in a rock/hard place situation.
That's unfortunate but that's a case of 'if you can't handle the heat'
They should have presented the data/debate in a better way."Or they should have bullshitted the electorate, and been illegally funded. Like the leave campaigns. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
Indeed, the question won’t be asked for a decade at least.
Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling)
The leave campaign, by fair means *and* foul, caught lightning in a bottle in 2016. Right time, right circumstances, right people in charge of the country,
Right time and circumstances maybe but right people in charge?
75% of MPs campaigned to remain including most of the cabinet at that time.
Yeah, right people in charge. Cameron, Osbourne et al. A gift to the leave campaign.
Got ya. Still, all those other 400 MP too
This is where the job of an MP is genuinely difficult - they’re elected to represent the interests of their constituents and the broader country. Which doesn’t mean simply doing what their constituents demand.
If I’m the MP of a fiercely leave area, and the data/analysis tells me that remain is better for my constituents, but my constituents demand leave - I’m in a rock/hard place situation.
That's unfortunate but that's a case of 'if you can't handle the heat'
They should have presented the data/debate in a better way.
And as we’ve seen, that’s not always enough. Remain won every debate undertaken on ‘facts’ - but leave won on intangibles and undeliverables.
It was akin to debating theism.
"That's why I said in a 'better way'. Every single time a Remain campaigner opened their mouth, it was pessimism. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
Indeed, the question won’t be asked for a decade at least.
Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling)
The leave campaign, by fair means *and* foul, caught lightning in a bottle in 2016. Right time, right circumstances, right people in charge of the country,
Right time and circumstances maybe but right people in charge?
75% of MPs campaigned to remain including most of the cabinet at that time.
Yeah, right people in charge. Cameron, Osbourne et al. A gift to the leave campaign.
Got ya. Still, all those other 400 MP too
This is where the job of an MP is genuinely difficult - they’re elected to represent the interests of their constituents and the broader country. Which doesn’t mean simply doing what their constituents demand.
If I’m the MP of a fiercely leave area, and the data/analysis tells me that remain is better for my constituents, but my constituents demand leave - I’m in a rock/hard place situation.
That's unfortunate but that's a case of 'if you can't handle the heat'
They should have presented the data/debate in a better way.
Or they should have bullshitted the electorate, and been illegally funded. Like the leave campaigns. "Let's not get into the funding argument | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
Indeed, the question won’t be asked for a decade at least.
Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling)
The leave campaign, by fair means *and* foul, caught lightning in a bottle in 2016. Right time, right circumstances, right people in charge of the country,
Right time and circumstances maybe but right people in charge?
75% of MPs campaigned to remain including most of the cabinet at that time.
Yeah, right people in charge. Cameron, Osbourne et al. A gift to the leave campaign.
Got ya. Still, all those other 400 MP too
This is where the job of an MP is genuinely difficult - they’re elected to represent the interests of their constituents and the broader country. Which doesn’t mean simply doing what their constituents demand.
If I’m the MP of a fiercely leave area, and the data/analysis tells me that remain is better for my constituents, but my constituents demand leave - I’m in a rock/hard place situation.
That's unfortunate but that's a case of 'if you can't handle the heat'
They should have presented the data/debate in a better way.
Or they should have bullshitted the electorate, and been illegally funded. Like the leave campaigns.
Let's not get into the funding argument "Fair enough. But let's not pretend that leave won the argument through reason, information and logic. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
Indeed, the question won’t be asked for a decade at least.
Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling)
The leave campaign, by fair means *and* foul, caught lightning in a bottle in 2016. Right time, right circumstances, right people in charge of the country,
Right time and circumstances maybe but right people in charge?
75% of MPs campaigned to remain including most of the cabinet at that time.
Yeah, right people in charge. Cameron, Osbourne et al. A gift to the leave campaign.
Got ya. Still, all those other 400 MP too
This is where the job of an MP is genuinely difficult - they’re elected to represent the interests of their constituents and the broader country. Which doesn’t mean simply doing what their constituents demand.
If I’m the MP of a fiercely leave area, and the data/analysis tells me that remain is better for my constituents, but my constituents demand leave - I’m in a rock/hard place situation.
That's unfortunate but that's a case of 'if you can't handle the heat'
They should have presented the data/debate in a better way.
Or they should have bullshitted the electorate, and been illegally funded. Like the leave campaigns.
Let's not get into the funding argument
Fair enough. But let's not pretend that leave won the argument through reason, information and logic."Who's pretending? | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
Indeed, the question won’t be asked for a decade at least.
Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling)
The leave campaign, by fair means *and* foul, caught lightning in a bottle in 2016. Right time, right circumstances, right people in charge of the country,
Right time and circumstances maybe but right people in charge?
75% of MPs campaigned to remain including most of the cabinet at that time.
Yeah, right people in charge. Cameron, Osbourne et al. A gift to the leave campaign.
Got ya. Still, all those other 400 MP too
This is where the job of an MP is genuinely difficult - they’re elected to represent the interests of their constituents and the broader country. Which doesn’t mean simply doing what their constituents demand.
If I’m the MP of a fiercely leave area, and the data/analysis tells me that remain is better for my constituents, but my constituents demand leave - I’m in a rock/hard place situation.
That's unfortunate but that's a case of 'if you can't handle the heat'
They should have presented the data/debate in a better way.
Or they should have bullshitted the electorate, and been illegally funded. Like the leave campaigns.
Let's not get into the funding argument
Fair enough. But let's not pretend that leave won the argument through reason, information and logic.
Who's pretending?"People who voted for brexit AND still think it was a good idea. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
Indeed, the question won’t be asked for a decade at least.
Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling)
The leave campaign, by fair means *and* foul, caught lightning in a bottle in 2016. Right time, right circumstances, right people in charge of the country,
Right time and circumstances maybe but right people in charge?
75% of MPs campaigned to remain including most of the cabinet at that time.
Yeah, right people in charge. Cameron, Osbourne et al. A gift to the leave campaign.
Got ya. Still, all those other 400 MP too
This is where the job of an MP is genuinely difficult - they’re elected to represent the interests of their constituents and the broader country. Which doesn’t mean simply doing what their constituents demand.
If I’m the MP of a fiercely leave area, and the data/analysis tells me that remain is better for my constituents, but my constituents demand leave - I’m in a rock/hard place situation.
That's unfortunate but that's a case of 'if you can't handle the heat'
They should have presented the data/debate in a better way.
Or they should have bullshitted the electorate, and been illegally funded. Like the leave campaigns.
Let's not get into the funding argument
Fair enough. But let's not pretend that leave won the argument through reason, information and logic."They did win the leave vote on logic. their logic was to win the leave vote and secure the actual exit from the EU we will need to win over the Labour voters in the north and pretty much forget trying to appeal to London. Their tactics, slogans and approach were very well targeted to those that wanted to leave, which was more people than didn't. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
Indeed, the question won’t be asked for a decade at least.
Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling)
The leave campaign, by fair means *and* foul, caught lightning in a bottle in 2016. Right time, right circumstances, right people in charge of the country,
Right time and circumstances maybe but right people in charge?
75% of MPs campaigned to remain including most of the cabinet at that time.
Yeah, right people in charge. Cameron, Osbourne et al. A gift to the leave campaign.
Got ya. Still, all those other 400 MP too
This is where the job of an MP is genuinely difficult - they’re elected to represent the interests of their constituents and the broader country. Which doesn’t mean simply doing what their constituents demand.
If I’m the MP of a fiercely leave area, and the data/analysis tells me that remain is better for my constituents, but my constituents demand leave - I’m in a rock/hard place situation.
That's unfortunate but that's a case of 'if you can't handle the heat'
They should have presented the data/debate in a better way.
Or they should have bullshitted the electorate, and been illegally funded. Like the leave campaigns.
Let's not get into the funding argument
Fair enough. But let's not pretend that leave won the argument through reason, information and logic.
They did win the leave vote on logic. their logic was to win the leave vote and secure the actual exit from the EU we will need to win over the Labour voters in the north and pretty much forget trying to appeal to London.
Their tactics, slogans and approach were very well targeted to those that wanted to leave, which was more people than didn't.
"They were very well targeted indeed, it was a successful campaign which went against the historic feeling I’m towards the EU in the U.K Now they have to deliver on those tactics, slogans and approach, unless they want to be seen as liars and shysters. | |||
"Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling)" You keep mentioning this polling, and you keep not telling us where we can find the data to take a look ourselves. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
Indeed, the question won’t be asked for a decade at least.
Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling)
The leave campaign, by fair means *and* foul, caught lightning in a bottle in 2016. Right time, right circumstances, right people in charge of the country,
Right time and circumstances maybe but right people in charge?
75% of MPs campaigned to remain including most of the cabinet at that time.
Yeah, right people in charge. Cameron, Osbourne et al. A gift to the leave campaign.
Got ya. Still, all those other 400 MP too
This is where the job of an MP is genuinely difficult - they’re elected to represent the interests of their constituents and the broader country. Which doesn’t mean simply doing what their constituents demand.
If I’m the MP of a fiercely leave area, and the data/analysis tells me that remain is better for my constituents, but my constituents demand leave - I’m in a rock/hard place situation.
That's unfortunate but that's a case of 'if you can't handle the heat'
They should have presented the data/debate in a better way.
Or they should have bullshitted the electorate, and been illegally funded. Like the leave campaigns.
Let's not get into the funding argument
Fair enough. But let's not pretend that leave won the argument through reason, information and logic.
Who's pretending?
People who voted for brexit AND still think it was a good idea."Tell them then, I mean your comment was directed at me, misdirected. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
Indeed, the question won’t be asked for a decade at least.
Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling)
The leave campaign, by fair means *and* foul, caught lightning in a bottle in 2016. Right time, right circumstances, right people in charge of the country,
Right time and circumstances maybe but right people in charge?
75% of MPs campaigned to remain including most of the cabinet at that time.
Yeah, right people in charge. Cameron, Osbourne et al. A gift to the leave campaign.
Got ya. Still, all those other 400 MP too
This is where the job of an MP is genuinely difficult - they’re elected to represent the interests of their constituents and the broader country. Which doesn’t mean simply doing what their constituents demand.
If I’m the MP of a fiercely leave area, and the data/analysis tells me that remain is better for my constituents, but my constituents demand leave - I’m in a rock/hard place situation.
That's unfortunate but that's a case of 'if you can't handle the heat'
They should have presented the data/debate in a better way.
Or they should have bullshitted the electorate, and been illegally funded. Like the leave campaigns.
Let's not get into the funding argument
Fair enough. But let's not pretend that leave won the argument through reason, information and logic.
They did win the leave vote on logic. their logic was to win the leave vote and secure the actual exit from the EU we will need to win over the Labour voters in the north and pretty much forget trying to appeal to London.
Their tactics, slogans and approach were very well targeted to those that wanted to leave, which was more people than didn't.
They were very well targeted indeed, it was a successful campaign which went against the historic feeling I’m towards the EU in the U.K
Now they have to deliver on those tactics, slogans and approach, unless they want to be seen as liars and shysters. "They don't need to deliver on those slogans, it was nothing more than a glorified manifesto that nobody owned. | |||
"Or they should have bullshitted the electorate, and been illegally funded. Like the leave campaigns." There's no evidence of illegal funding. Carole Cadwalladr now has a very empty bank account after suggesting that there was. | |||
"Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling) You keep mentioning this polling, and you keep not telling us where we can find the data to take a look ourselves." That’s because I assume you’re capable of using google. Here’s a starter on whether we were right to leave the EU, from Jan 2020 to present: https://www.statista.com/statistics/987347/brexit-opinion-poll/ | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
Indeed, the question won’t be asked for a decade at least.
Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling)
The leave campaign, by fair means *and* foul, caught lightning in a bottle in 2016. Right time, right circumstances, right people in charge of the country,
Right time and circumstances maybe but right people in charge?
75% of MPs campaigned to remain including most of the cabinet at that time.
Yeah, right people in charge. Cameron, Osbourne et al. A gift to the leave campaign.
Got ya. Still, all those other 400 MP too
This is where the job of an MP is genuinely difficult - they’re elected to represent the interests of their constituents and the broader country. Which doesn’t mean simply doing what their constituents demand.
If I’m the MP of a fiercely leave area, and the data/analysis tells me that remain is better for my constituents, but my constituents demand leave - I’m in a rock/hard place situation.
That's unfortunate but that's a case of 'if you can't handle the heat'
They should have presented the data/debate in a better way.
Or they should have bullshitted the electorate, and been illegally funded. Like the leave campaigns.
Let's not get into the funding argument
Fair enough. But let's not pretend that leave won the argument through reason, information and logic.
They did win the leave vote on logic. their logic was to win the leave vote and secure the actual exit from the EU we will need to win over the Labour voters in the north and pretty much forget trying to appeal to London.
Their tactics, slogans and approach were very well targeted to those that wanted to leave, which was more people than didn't.
They were very well targeted indeed, it was a successful campaign which went against the historic feeling I’m towards the EU in the U.K
Now they have to deliver on those tactics, slogans and approach, unless they want to be seen as liars and shysters.
They don't need to deliver on those slogans, it was nothing more than a glorified manifesto that nobody owned."In a manifesto, If a party fails to live up to their promises, they can be rejected at the next election - an important difference. The referendum was sold as ‘once in a lifetime’ | |||
"Or they should have bullshitted the electorate, and been illegally funded. Like the leave campaigns. There's no evidence of illegal funding. Carole Cadwalladr now has a very empty bank account after suggesting that there was." Were vote leave fined for breaking electoral spending rules? And did they withdraw their appeal into the decision? | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
Indeed, the question won’t be asked for a decade at least.
Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling)
The leave campaign, by fair means *and* foul, caught lightning in a bottle in 2016. Right time, right circumstances, right people in charge of the country,
Right time and circumstances maybe but right people in charge?
75% of MPs campaigned to remain including most of the cabinet at that time.
Yeah, right people in charge. Cameron, Osbourne et al. A gift to the leave campaign.
Got ya. Still, all those other 400 MP too
This is where the job of an MP is genuinely difficult - they’re elected to represent the interests of their constituents and the broader country. Which doesn’t mean simply doing what their constituents demand.
If I’m the MP of a fiercely leave area, and the data/analysis tells me that remain is better for my constituents, but my constituents demand leave - I’m in a rock/hard place situation.
That's unfortunate but that's a case of 'if you can't handle the heat'
They should have presented the data/debate in a better way.
Or they should have bullshitted the electorate, and been illegally funded. Like the leave campaigns.
Let's not get into the funding argument
Fair enough. But let's not pretend that leave won the argument through reason, information and logic.
They did win the leave vote on logic. their logic was to win the leave vote and secure the actual exit from the EU we will need to win over the Labour voters in the north and pretty much forget trying to appeal to London.
Their tactics, slogans and approach were very well targeted to those that wanted to leave, which was more people than didn't.
They were very well targeted indeed, it was a successful campaign which went against the historic feeling I’m towards the EU in the U.K
Now they have to deliver on those tactics, slogans and approach, unless they want to be seen as liars and shysters.
They don't need to deliver on those slogans, it was nothing more than a glorified manifesto that nobody owned.
In a manifesto, If a party fails to live up to their promises, they can be rejected at the next election - an important difference. The referendum was sold as ‘once in a lifetime’
"Hence glorified manifesto, and nobody really owned the outcome it fell into the lap of the government to carry out the negotiations. People didn't care the colour of the tie being worn and still don't as long as they have a confidence in getting their short term problems resolved. If you put too much faith in the electorate to make a decision that is for the good of others and not themselves you will be forever disappointed. | |||
"Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling)" "You keep mentioning this polling, and you keep not telling us where we can find the data to take a look ourselves." "That’s because I assume you’re capable of using google. Here’s a starter on whether we were right to leave the EU, from Jan 2020 to present: https://www.statista.com/statistics/987347/brexit-opinion-poll/ " I am indeed capable of using Google. I've used it to look up polling going back to 2010, in which the figures don't match up with what you're saying. But you keep claiming that you have access to polling going back 35 years, and I have been unable to find any such data. You've posted several links recently, how about giving us one to your polling data. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
Indeed, the question won’t be asked for a decade at least.
Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling)
The leave campaign, by fair means *and* foul, caught lightning in a bottle in 2016. Right time, right circumstances, right people in charge of the country,
Right time and circumstances maybe but right people in charge?
75% of MPs campaigned to remain including most of the cabinet at that time.
Yeah, right people in charge. Cameron, Osbourne et al. A gift to the leave campaign.
Got ya. Still, all those other 400 MP too
This is where the job of an MP is genuinely difficult - they’re elected to represent the interests of their constituents and the broader country. Which doesn’t mean simply doing what their constituents demand.
If I’m the MP of a fiercely leave area, and the data/analysis tells me that remain is better for my constituents, but my constituents demand leave - I’m in a rock/hard place situation.
That's unfortunate but that's a case of 'if you can't handle the heat'
They should have presented the data/debate in a better way.
Or they should have bullshitted the electorate, and been illegally funded. Like the leave campaigns.
Let's not get into the funding argument
Fair enough. But let's not pretend that leave won the argument through reason, information and logic.
They did win the leave vote on logic. their logic was to win the leave vote and secure the actual exit from the EU we will need to win over the Labour voters in the north and pretty much forget trying to appeal to London.
Their tactics, slogans and approach were very well targeted to those that wanted to leave, which was more people than didn't.
"That's their tactics. Not the content of the campaign. There's no logic to the brexit bullshit that was promoted as what brexit would bring to the UK. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
Indeed, the question won’t be asked for a decade at least.
Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling)
The leave campaign, by fair means *and* foul, caught lightning in a bottle in 2016. Right time, right circumstances, right people in charge of the country,
Right time and circumstances maybe but right people in charge?
75% of MPs campaigned to remain including most of the cabinet at that time.
Yeah, right people in charge. Cameron, Osbourne et al. A gift to the leave campaign.
Got ya. Still, all those other 400 MP too
This is where the job of an MP is genuinely difficult - they’re elected to represent the interests of their constituents and the broader country. Which doesn’t mean simply doing what their constituents demand.
If I’m the MP of a fiercely leave area, and the data/analysis tells me that remain is better for my constituents, but my constituents demand leave - I’m in a rock/hard place situation.
That's unfortunate but that's a case of 'if you can't handle the heat'
They should have presented the data/debate in a better way.
Or they should have bullshitted the electorate, and been illegally funded. Like the leave campaigns.
Let's not get into the funding argument
Fair enough. But let's not pretend that leave won the argument through reason, information and logic.
They did win the leave vote on logic. their logic was to win the leave vote and secure the actual exit from the EU we will need to win over the Labour voters in the north and pretty much forget trying to appeal to London.
Their tactics, slogans and approach were very well targeted to those that wanted to leave, which was more people than didn't.
They were very well targeted indeed, it was a successful campaign which went against the historic feeling I’m towards the EU in the U.K
Now they have to deliver on those tactics, slogans and approach, unless they want to be seen as liars and shysters.
They don't need to deliver on those slogans, it was nothing more than a glorified manifesto that nobody owned.
In a manifesto, If a party fails to live up to their promises, they can be rejected at the next election - an important difference. The referendum was sold as ‘once in a lifetime’
Hence glorified manifesto, and nobody really owned the outcome it fell into the lap of the government to carry out the negotiations.
People didn't care the colour of the tie being worn and still don't as long as they have a confidence in getting their short term problems resolved.
If you put too much faith in the electorate to make a decision that is for the good of others and not themselves you will be forever disappointed. "That’s just it - the electorate made a decision that was bad for themselves and good for the people they purport to dislike (the establishment) | |||
"Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling) You keep mentioning this polling, and you keep not telling us where we can find the data to take a look ourselves. That’s because I assume you’re capable of using google. Here’s a starter on whether we were right to leave the EU, from Jan 2020 to present: https://www.statista.com/statistics/987347/brexit-opinion-poll/ I am indeed capable of using Google. I've used it to look up polling going back to 2010, in which the figures don't match up with what you're saying. But you keep claiming that you have access to polling going back 35 years, and I have been unable to find any such data. You've posted several links recently, how about giving us one to your polling data." It’s not hard to find. This is one such piece, there are others: https://theconversation.com/amp/polling-history-40-years-of-british-views-on-in-or-out-of-europe-61250 | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
Indeed, the question won’t be asked for a decade at least.
Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling)
The leave campaign, by fair means *and* foul, caught lightning in a bottle in 2016. Right time, right circumstances, right people in charge of the country,
Right time and circumstances maybe but right people in charge?
75% of MPs campaigned to remain including most of the cabinet at that time.
Yeah, right people in charge. Cameron, Osbourne et al. A gift to the leave campaign.
Got ya. Still, all those other 400 MP too
This is where the job of an MP is genuinely difficult - they’re elected to represent the interests of their constituents and the broader country. Which doesn’t mean simply doing what their constituents demand.
If I’m the MP of a fiercely leave area, and the data/analysis tells me that remain is better for my constituents, but my constituents demand leave - I’m in a rock/hard place situation.
That's unfortunate but that's a case of 'if you can't handle the heat'
They should have presented the data/debate in a better way.
Or they should have bullshitted the electorate, and been illegally funded. Like the leave campaigns.
Let's not get into the funding argument
Fair enough. But let's not pretend that leave won the argument through reason, information and logic.
They did win the leave vote on logic. their logic was to win the leave vote and secure the actual exit from the EU we will need to win over the Labour voters in the north and pretty much forget trying to appeal to London.
Their tactics, slogans and approach were very well targeted to those that wanted to leave, which was more people than didn't.
That's their tactics. Not the content of the campaign.
There's no logic to the brexit bullshit that was promoted as what brexit would bring to the UK."There was no definitive understanding of what that could be, it hadn't been negotiated so it was all if's, but's and maybe's and that is how they will never be held accountable, much like reneging on manifesto promises... | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
Indeed, the question won’t be asked for a decade at least.
Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling)
The leave campaign, by fair means *and* foul, caught lightning in a bottle in 2016. Right time, right circumstances, right people in charge of the country,
Right time and circumstances maybe but right people in charge?
75% of MPs campaigned to remain including most of the cabinet at that time.
Yeah, right people in charge. Cameron, Osbourne et al. A gift to the leave campaign.
Got ya. Still, all those other 400 MP too
This is where the job of an MP is genuinely difficult - they’re elected to represent the interests of their constituents and the broader country. Which doesn’t mean simply doing what their constituents demand.
If I’m the MP of a fiercely leave area, and the data/analysis tells me that remain is better for my constituents, but my constituents demand leave - I’m in a rock/hard place situation.
That's unfortunate but that's a case of 'if you can't handle the heat'
They should have presented the data/debate in a better way.
Or they should have bullshitted the electorate, and been illegally funded. Like the leave campaigns.
Let's not get into the funding argument
Fair enough. But let's not pretend that leave won the argument through reason, information and logic.
They did win the leave vote on logic. their logic was to win the leave vote and secure the actual exit from the EU we will need to win over the Labour voters in the north and pretty much forget trying to appeal to London.
Their tactics, slogans and approach were very well targeted to those that wanted to leave, which was more people than didn't.
That's their tactics. Not the content of the campaign.
There's no logic to the brexit bullshit that was promoted as what brexit would bring to the UK.
There was no definitive understanding of what that could be, it hadn't been negotiated so it was all if's, but's and maybe's and that is how they will never be held accountable, much like reneging on manifesto promises..."Profoundly undemocratic eh? | |||
"Or they should have bullshitted the electorate, and been illegally funded. Like the leave campaigns." "There's no evidence of illegal funding. Carole Cadwalladr now has a very empty bank account after suggesting that there was." "Were vote leave fined for breaking electoral spending rules? And did they withdraw their appeal into the decision? " Yes, and yes. They exceeded the maximum spending limit, and impeded the investigation. But "illegally funded" is an accusation relating to the source of their funds, not how much they spent. | |||
"Or they should have bullshitted the electorate, and been illegally funded. Like the leave campaigns. There's no evidence of illegal funding. Carole Cadwalladr now has a very empty bank account after suggesting that there was. Were vote leave fined for breaking electoral spending rules? And did they withdraw their appeal into the decision? Yes, and yes. They exceeded the maximum spending limit, and impeded the investigation. But "illegally funded" is an accusation relating to the source of their funds, not how much they spent." Unfortunately it always ends up going like this. Words mean fuck all apparently, just see this thread and the other one about 'interest'. | |||
"Or they should have bullshitted the electorate, and been illegally funded. Like the leave campaigns. There's no evidence of illegal funding. Carole Cadwalladr now has a very empty bank account after suggesting that there was. Were vote leave fined for breaking electoral spending rules? And did they withdraw their appeal into the decision? Yes, and yes. They exceeded the maximum spending limit, and impeded the investigation. But "illegally funded" is an accusation relating to the source of their funds, not how much they spent. Unfortunately it always ends up going like this. Words mean fuck all apparently, just see this thread and the other one about 'interest'." | |||
"But you keep claiming that you have access to polling going back 35 years, and I have been unable to find any such data. You've posted several links recently, how about giving us one to your polling data." "It’s not hard to find. This is one such piece, there are others: https://theconversation.com/amp/polling-history-40-years-of-british-views-on-in-or-out-of-europe-61250" Thanks for the link. It doesn't support the claims you were making in other threads, but I re-read your post here, and in this thread you've said "broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum". The data from the polls does indeed support that. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
I disagree, I wouldn't try to 'reasonably assume' they would cancel each other out. I'd like to see percentages for who will, who won't and who doesn't know. For me, that's accurate.
You're right though, we won't be asked anytime soon."Interesting? Why would either "stay out" or "go back in" be in the majority in the "Don't knows"? However, looking at your figures. 48%+32%=80% with 20% presumably "don't know". If we split those 20% equally as I suggested we get 58% go in and 42% stay out. So a majority to rejoin? For a stay out vote we would need 100% of the 20% to be stay out folks. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
I disagree, I wouldn't try to 'reasonably assume' they would cancel each other out. I'd like to see percentages for who will, who won't and who doesn't know. For me, that's accurate.
You're right though, we won't be asked anytime soon.
Interesting? Why would either "stay out" or "go back in" be in the majority in the "Don't knows"?
However, looking at your figures. 48%+32%=80% with 20% presumably "don't know". If we split those 20% equally as I suggested we get 58% go in and 42% stay out. So a majority to rejoin? For a stay out vote we would need 100% of the 20% to be stay out folks.
"Its really not interesting. Don't know is don't know, it isn't one or the other. Split them if you like, I'd rather not try to guess. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
I disagree, I wouldn't try to 'reasonably assume' they would cancel each other out. I'd like to see percentages for who will, who won't and who doesn't know. For me, that's accurate.
You're right though, we won't be asked anytime soon.
Interesting? Why would either "stay out" or "go back in" be in the majority in the "Don't knows"?
However, looking at your figures. 48%+32%=80% with 20% presumably "don't know". If we split those 20% equally as I suggested we get 58% go in and 42% stay out. So a majority to rejoin? For a stay out vote we would need 100% of the 20% to be stay out folks.
Its really not interesting.
Don't know is don't know, it isn't one or the other. Split them if you like, I'd rather not try to guess."For me personally, there isn't enough information to answer either way. So I'd be a "don't know". If there was an option. "Undertake some reasonable analysis to the impact of rejoining the EU". I'd vote for that. Another uninformed referendum is the last thing we need. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
Indeed, the question won’t be asked for a decade at least.
Broadly speaking the U.K was hesitantly pro-EEC/EU for 35 years before the referendum, and also for most of the time since (according to polling)
The leave campaign, by fair means *and* foul, caught lightning in a bottle in 2016. Right time, right circumstances, right people in charge of the country,
Right time and circumstances maybe but right people in charge?
75% of MPs campaigned to remain including most of the cabinet at that time.
Yeah, right people in charge. Cameron, Osbourne et al. A gift to the leave campaign.
Got ya. Still, all those other 400 MP too
This is where the job of an MP is genuinely difficult - they’re elected to represent the interests of their constituents and the broader country. Which doesn’t mean simply doing what their constituents demand.
If I’m the MP of a fiercely leave area, and the data/analysis tells me that remain is better for my constituents, but my constituents demand leave - I’m in a rock/hard place situation.
That's unfortunate but that's a case of 'if you can't handle the heat'
They should have presented the data/debate in a better way.
Or they should have bullshitted the electorate, and been illegally funded. Like the leave campaigns.
Let's not get into the funding argument
Fair enough. But let's not pretend that leave won the argument through reason, information and logic.
They did win the leave vote on logic. their logic was to win the leave vote and secure the actual exit from the EU we will need to win over the Labour voters in the north and pretty much forget trying to appeal to London.
Their tactics, slogans and approach were very well targeted to those that wanted to leave, which was more people than didn't.
They were very well targeted indeed, it was a successful campaign which went against the historic feeling I’m towards the EU in the U.K
Now they have to deliver on those tactics, slogans and approach, unless they want to be seen as liars and shysters. "hahaha you really think they give a flying one about being seen as liars and shysters, for someone who comes across as being on it as far as politics is concerned you really dont seem to understand politicians dont give a shit what the great unwashed think, they answer to there funders and no one else, tory labour libs snp, they all laugh at the general public | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
I disagree, I wouldn't try to 'reasonably assume' they would cancel each other out. I'd like to see percentages for who will, who won't and who doesn't know. For me, that's accurate.
You're right though, we won't be asked anytime soon.
Interesting? Why would either "stay out" or "go back in" be in the majority in the "Don't knows"?
However, looking at your figures. 48%+32%=80% with 20% presumably "don't know". If we split those 20% equally as I suggested we get 58% go in and 42% stay out. So a majority to rejoin? For a stay out vote we would need 100% of the 20% to be stay out folks.
"58/42 broadly tallies with those who think we weee wrong to leave - (slightly lower but within a cpl of percent). If we could all go back in time an redo it with present knowledge, I’d expect remain to win by the same 52/48 or thereabouts. | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought
This makes even less sense.
If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more.
Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best.
Maybe she has travelled around the EU checking on people working on roofs
She came across has someone who knew about France. But you missed her point, which was trying to explain her experiences of seeing of UK businesses playing by the rules and EU businesses not.
I have no idea if she is right or wrong, but I do not disrespect her for having a personal view.
Did she? Where is her evidence that uk businesses play by the rules and the EU doesn’t? She just came up with a load of stereotyping bollocks to try and prove something she has made up. Thick as mince "I explained to hear about bendy bananas. I found a lot of the the debate painful to listen to  | |||
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"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and their….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Another Brexit voting halfwit claims he has seen people arrive and go straight to the benefit offices to claim handouts, a bit creepy that he is following people around from the ports or airports "I agree he made himself look a fool. | |||
"I actually know someone, who voted Leave, because he wanted the UK to be more European (single currency , schengen etc), and we were never going ti achieve that!
A brexiter once said to me on twitter (I paraphrase) “You voted remain, you’re one of those globalist, citizens of the world that May talked about”
Why yes, yes I am!
Women on QT last night voted for Brexit because EU workers were not following health and safety rules when they were on a roof, thick as mince
Damn that EU and they’re….*checks notes*….safe scaffolding.
Tbh, she was complaining that they had unsafe scoffoding ,
What she was trying to say is the UK abided by EU laws but other countries didn't and that cost us more money.
The example she gave was basic but it was easy to understand her direction of thought
This makes even less sense.
If she's right. Other countries are still costing less if they're not following the rules. Only not everything costs us much more.
Also, it's almost certainly hearsay at best.
Maybe she has travelled around the EU checking on people working on roofs
She came across has someone who knew about France. But you missed her point, which was trying to explain her experiences of seeing of UK businesses playing by the rules and EU businesses not.
I have no idea if she is right or wrong, but I do not disrespect her for having a personal view.
Did she? Where is her evidence that uk businesses play by the rules and the EU doesn’t? She just came up with a load of stereotyping bollocks to try and prove something she has made up. Thick as mince
Bullshit. You can't just say someone is making up bollocks because you don't know.
If that's what she saw, rats what she saw.
I’ve seen plenty of dodgy builders in the UK. Does that mean we weren’t abiding by EU regs as well?
Possibly, if that’s what you saw then obviously it applies to everyone
Rod Hull (RIP) fell of a roof in the UK , whatever does this mean "Off | |||
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"I had no problem with the audience being all brexitiers because this had been explained in advance , what I did find strange was that following the Conservative Government calling a referendum , being the government ever since , always holding a majority in Parliament , saying they had an oven ready deal , promising to get Brexit done , claiming to have got Brexit done , changing the oven ready deal for a better deal , completing trade deals with Australia & New Zealand and being given a one hour platform on The BBC to celebrate the success of The UK leaving The EU in front of a crowd who all voted to leave , no Government Minister appeared on the programme ." Maybe because brexit is going so well, that they don't need to spend time justifying it to the serfs. | |||
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"I watched it and as someone who voted leave I was interested in the comments. The only voice worth listening to in my opinion was the the chap from the think tank. No obvious political leaning and just spoke sense. " I thought he spoke well, also thought Campbell spoke well apart from he wouldn't deviate from 'you were lied to' | |||
"I watched it and as someone who voted leave I was interested in the comments. The only voice worth listening to in my opinion was the the chap from the think tank. No obvious political leaning and just spoke sense. I thought he spoke well, also thought Campbell spoke well apart from he wouldn't deviate from 'you were lied to'" Campbell is excellent on Brexit, but in the massively over-simplified world of modern politics he’s put down with ‘but Iraq’, ‘war criminal’ etc. | |||
"I watched it and as someone who voted leave I was interested in the comments. The only voice worth listening to in my opinion was the the chap from the think tank. No obvious political leaning and just spoke sense. I thought he spoke well, also thought Campbell spoke well apart from he wouldn't deviate from 'you were lied to' Campbell is excellent on Brexit, but in the massively over-simplified world of modern politics he’s put down with ‘but Iraq’, ‘war criminal’ etc. " Both can be true, if Boris said something good, he'd also be put down. Campbell was good, would've been better if he didn't do the old politician thing and keep repeating himself in saying 'you were lied to'. He was pulled up on it by the audience but it didn't have any effect. | |||
"I watched it and as someone who voted leave I was interested in the comments. The only voice worth listening to in my opinion was the the chap from the think tank. No obvious political leaning and just spoke sense. I thought he spoke well, also thought Campbell spoke well apart from he wouldn't deviate from 'you were lied to'" He's not wrong. But it wasn't especially enlightening. | |||
"Fun fact I've just learnt... "Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU" The exact same % that voted to remain in the first place
Not sure about that.
"Data from YouGov’s latest Brexit tracker survey found that, excluding those who said they would not vote or did not know, 58.2% of people in Britain would now vote to rejoin." The Guardian 23/6/2023
Perhaps the 48% are those that want to stay out?
No I definitely didn't get it wrong. Different polls different answers of course, and as discussed with someone above, depends on how the question was phrased.
Of course 58% will be a higher number when you exclude the people who wouldn't vote. Skews it slightly, don't you think?
From a poll conducted for UK in a changing Europe (Professor Anand Menon was on the QT program, and to be honest was the most sensible on there)
"Among all voters, 48% would go back into the EU, while 32% would stay out. Among Brexiteers who think it is going badly, 40% would vote to rejoin the bloc while 30% want to stay outside."
I agree it is the wording that matters. I would suggest that excluding the non-voters and the "don't knows" produces a more realistic result than asking just anyone.
The reasons being in the event of another vote the opinions of the non voters would not be counted. The "don't knows" you can reasonably assume will balance each other out between re-enter and stay outs.
Anyway, we won't be asked any time soon.
I disagree, I wouldn't try to 'reasonably assume' they would cancel each other out. I'd like to see percentages for who will, who won't and who doesn't know. For me, that's accurate.
You're right though, we won't be asked anytime soon.
Interesting? Why would either "stay out" or "go back in" be in the majority in the "Don't knows"?
However, looking at your figures. 48%+32%=80% with 20% presumably "don't know". If we split those 20% equally as I suggested we get 58% go in and 42% stay out. So a majority to rejoin? For a stay out vote we would need 100% of the 20% to be stay out folks.
Its really not interesting.
Don't know is don't know, it isn't one or the other. Split them if you like, I'd rather not try to guess.
For me personally, there isn't enough information to answer either way. So I'd be a "don't know". If there was an option. "Undertake some reasonable analysis to the impact of rejoining the EU". I'd vote for that.
Another uninformed referendum is the last thing we need.""Uninformed referenda" is par for the course these days. Few people get past a handful of sound bites and cult of personality before they vote for life changing changes. | |||
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"I watched it and as someone who voted leave I was interested in the comments. The only voice worth listening to in my opinion was the the chap from the think tank. No obvious political leaning and just spoke sense. I thought he spoke well, also thought Campbell spoke well apart from he wouldn't deviate from 'you were lied to' He's not wrong. But it wasn't especially enlightening." Campbell was very happy to work on the dishonesty of Boris and I've no problem with that but was Blair Mr honesty over Iraq? | |||
"I watched it and as someone who voted leave I was interested in the comments. The only voice worth listening to in my opinion was the the chap from the think tank. No obvious political leaning and just spoke sense. I thought he spoke well, also thought Campbell spoke well apart from he wouldn't deviate from 'you were lied to' He's not wrong. But it wasn't especially enlightening. Campbell was very happy to work on the dishonesty of Boris and I've no problem with that but was Blair Mr honesty over Iraq?" Yeah they've both got a lot to answer for. Campbell is far from honourable. | |||
