FabSwingers.com > Forums > Politics > Is British Justice, Guilty until Proven Innocent
Is British Justice, Guilty until Proven Innocent
Jump to: Newest in thread
 |
By (user no longer on site) OP 41 weeks ago
|
To get justice in Britain seems to be getting worse. If your unfortunate enough to be wrongly convicted of a crime, then prove your innocence. It is not only getting harder to get compensation.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/law/2018/may/07/men-wrongfully-imprisoned-for-24-years-seek-compensation
If your one of the fortunate ones that do get compensation. You then get 25% of your compensation deducted for the boarding and food by the prison service. You couldn't make it up.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/07/27/innocent-andrew-malkinson-wrongful-conviction-compensation/ |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *irldnCouple 41 weeks ago
Brighton |
"If your one of the fortunate ones that do get compensation. You then get 25% of your compensation deducted for the boarding and food by the prison service. You couldn't make it up."
Is this true! Unbelievable! That is seriously fucked up! |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"To get justice in Britain seems to be getting worse. If your unfortunate enough to be wrongly convicted of a crime, then prove your innocence. It is not only getting harder to get compensation.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/law/2018/may/07/men-wrongfully-imprisoned-for-24-years-seek-compensation
If your one of the fortunate ones that do get compensation. You then get 25% of your compensation deducted for the boarding and food by the prison service. You couldn't make it up.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/07/27/innocent-andrew-malkinson-wrongful-conviction-compensation/"
It's not as simple as you make out
There's differences between quashed and overturned/ innocent.
It will have to go to retrial if he's found innocent then he can claim the larger compensation.
All that's come to light is new evidence that casts doubt, it doesn't mean he never committed the crime.
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site) OP 41 weeks ago
|
"To get justice in Britain seems to be getting worse. If your unfortunate enough to be wrongly convicted of a crime, then prove your innocence. It is not only getting harder to get compensation.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/law/2018/may/07/men-wrongfully-imprisoned-for-24-years-seek-compensation
If your one of the fortunate ones that do get compensation. You then get 25% of your compensation deducted for the boarding and food by the prison service. You couldn't make it up.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/07/27/innocent-andrew-malkinson-wrongful-conviction-compensation/
It's not as simple as you make out
There's differences between quashed and overturned/ innocent.
It will have to go to retrial if he's found innocent then he can claim the larger compensation.
All that's come to light is new evidence that casts doubt, it doesn't mean he never committed the crime.
"
Are you referring to a particular case or generalising. Would you like to spend 15 years in prison because the evidence says you may have committed a crime..? |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site) 41 weeks ago
|
"To get justice in Britain seems to be getting worse. If your unfortunate enough to be wrongly convicted of a crime, then prove your innocence. It is not only getting harder to get compensation.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/law/2018/may/07/men-wrongfully-imprisoned-for-24-years-seek-compensation
If your one of the fortunate ones that do get compensation. You then get 25% of your compensation deducted for the boarding and food by the prison service. You couldn't make it up.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/07/27/innocent-andrew-malkinson-wrongful-conviction-compensation/
It's not as simple as you make out
There's differences between quashed and overturned/ innocent.
It will have to go to retrial if he's found innocent then he can claim the larger compensation.
All that's come to light is new evidence that casts doubt, it doesn't mean he never committed the crime.
Are you referring to a particular case or generalising. Would you like to spend 15 years in prison because the evidence says you may have committed a crime..?"
Digressing, but this is my argument against the death penalty.
You want it? Cool. Don’t complain when you or a loved one is sentenced to death for a crime you didn’t commit. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"To get justice in Britain seems to be getting worse. If your unfortunate enough to be wrongly convicted of a crime, then prove your innocence. It is not only getting harder to get compensation.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/law/2018/may/07/men-wrongfully-imprisoned-for-24-years-seek-compensation
If your one of the fortunate ones that do get compensation. You then get 25% of your compensation deducted for the boarding and food by the prison service. You couldn't make it up.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/07/27/innocent-andrew-malkinson-wrongful-conviction-compensation/
It's not as simple as you make out
There's differences between quashed and overturned/ innocent.
It will have to go to retrial if he's found innocent then he can claim the larger compensation.
All that's come to light is new evidence that casts doubt, it doesn't mean he never committed the crime.
Are you referring to a particular case or generalising. Would you like to spend 15 years in prison because the evidence says you may have committed a crime..?"
This is what need to happen with this case. And it's how it works in general. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"If your one of the fortunate ones that do get compensation. You then get 25% of your compensation deducted for the boarding and food by the prison service. You couldn't make it up.
Is this true! Unbelievable! That is seriously fucked up!"
As I understand it, the compensation is to put you right as if you weren't put away (or at least that's the starting point). You must out on earnings but also miss out on bills. In a sense, it's compensating your disposable income.
I'd hope there is an extra calc that reflects the loss of freedom etc. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"If your one of the fortunate ones that do get compensation. You then get 25% of your compensation deducted for the boarding and food by the prison service. You couldn't make it up.
Is this true! Unbelievable! That is seriously fucked up! As I understand it, the compensation is to put you right as if you weren't put away (or at least that's the starting point). You must out on earnings but also miss out on bills. In a sense, it's compensating your disposable income.
I'd hope there is an extra calc that reflects the loss of freedom etc. "
Is there a figure for loss of freedom for so many years?
I don't think there would be enough for me. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"If your one of the fortunate ones that do get compensation. You then get 25% of your compensation deducted for the boarding and food by the prison service. You couldn't make it up.
Is this true! Unbelievable! That is seriously fucked up! As I understand it, the compensation is to put you right as if you weren't put away (or at least that's the starting point). You must out on earnings but also miss out on bills. In a sense, it's compensating your disposable income.
I'd hope there is an extra calc that reflects the loss of freedom etc.
Is there a figure for loss of freedom for so many years?
I don't think there would be enough for me."
no idea and agreed. I haven't seen enough detail, just sharing what I have seen explained as the headline looked terrible! |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"If your one of the fortunate ones that do get compensation. You then get 25% of your compensation deducted for the boarding and food by the prison service. You couldn't make it up.
Is this true! Unbelievable! That is seriously fucked up! As I understand it, the compensation is to put you right as if you weren't put away (or at least that's the starting point). You must out on earnings but also miss out on bills. In a sense, it's compensating your disposable income.
I'd hope there is an extra calc that reflects the loss of freedom etc.
Is there a figure for loss of freedom for so many years?
I don't think there would be enough for me."
It is calculated.
Again i must stress. This is the basic level of back pay.
The appeal court must now find sufficient flaws in the case to deem it a miscarriage of justice.
Hes been let out because new evidenced has surfaced thatbdoes not necessarily mean he never committed tne crime.
If the apelal Court believes they did fuck up. He will be given a much larger package
But agree. It wouldn't make up for the lost time in prison.
It also open up the old wounds kf the victim that her perpetrator got away scot free |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
You seem surprised an establishment body makes it difficult for people that call it's decisions into question. No authority likes to be shown to be wrong but it happens every day across every kind of authority. Be it crime, wrong convictions, embezzlement, kids dieing while under state care, or state media covering up for nonces. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"To get justice in Britain seems to be getting worse. If your unfortunate enough to be wrongly convicted of a crime, then prove your innocence. It is not only getting harder to get compensation.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/law/2018/may/07/men-wrongfully-imprisoned-for-24-years-seek-compensation
If your one of the fortunate ones that do get compensation. You then get 25% of your compensation deducted for the boarding and food by the prison service. You couldn't make it up.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/07/27/innocent-andrew-malkinson-wrongful-conviction-compensation/
It's not as simple as you make out
There's differences between quashed and overturned/ innocent.
It will have to go to retrial if he's found innocent then he can claim the larger compensation.
All that's come to light is new evidence that casts doubt, it doesn't mean he never committed the crime.
"
His conviction was quashed by the Court of Appeal following a review by the CCRC.
Another individual has been arrested in relation to the case following a review of DNA evidence which was held in a forensic archive. A decision whether to prosecute this individual is still being considered.
While Mr Malkinson would not have to reimburse the prison service directly if he wins compensation, he could be forced to sacrifice a chunk of any payment he does receive to account for costs he would have incurred on the outside had he not been imprisoned.
Sir Bob Neill, the justice committee chairman, said the Government should review the rules. The controversial guidance was confirmed by the House of Lords in 2007, when it was the UK’s highest court.
While the Government makes the call on whether to grant compensation, it is then up to an independent assessor to determine how much is awarded, including any deductions for living costs.
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"To get justice in Britain seems to be getting worse. If your unfortunate enough to be wrongly convicted of a crime, then prove your innocence. It is not only getting harder to get compensation.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/law/2018/may/07/men-wrongfully-imprisoned-for-24-years-seek-compensation
If your one of the fortunate ones that do get compensation. You then get 25% of your compensation deducted for the boarding and food by the prison service. You couldn't make it up.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/07/27/innocent-andrew-malkinson-wrongful-conviction-compensation/
It's not as simple as you make out
There's differences between quashed and overturned/ innocent.
It will have to go to retrial if he's found innocent then he can claim the larger compensation.
All that's come to light is new evidence that casts doubt, it doesn't mean he never committed the crime.
His conviction was quashed by the Court of Appeal following a review by the CCRC.
Another individual has been arrested in relation to the case following a review of DNA evidence which was held in a forensic archive. A decision whether to prosecute this individual is still being considered.
While Mr Malkinson would not have to reimburse the prison service directly if he wins compensation, he could be forced to sacrifice a chunk of any payment he does receive to account for costs he would have incurred on the outside had he not been imprisoned.
Sir Bob Neill, the justice committee chairman, said the Government should review the rules. The controversial guidance was confirmed by the House of Lords in 2007, when it was the UK’s highest court.
While the Government makes the call on whether to grant compensation, it is then up to an independent assessor to determine how much is awarded, including any deductions for living costs.
"
Competition is topped out at £1million but as my other post dose a million make you a millionaire.
If you need a property in lots of parts of the UK this would not get you there.
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
^
I dont know if what I an saying is bot coming across.
But here is a news outlets waybif saying it.
"While Mr Malkinson has had all charges against him dropped, he still hasn't received a declaration of innocence from the Court of Appeal.
Without this, he cannot claim compensation.
Mr Malkinson said this process was a "whole new battle"."
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site) OP 41 weeks ago
|
"You seem surprised an establishment body makes it difficult for people that call it's decisions into question. No authority likes to be shown to be wrong but it happens every day across every kind of authority. Be it crime, wrong convictions, embezzlement, kids dieing while under state care, or state media covering up for nonces."
While am not surprised that authorities will do as you described. I am surprised that they have this legislation that will make it difficult to get compensation once you have fought to prove your innocence.
Morleyman has been saying it doesn't prove he didn't commit the crime, just he cast enough doubt. If you follow this logic, no one found guilty or innocent is actually that. Just not been proven or not proven.
I think once you've been found guilty and imprisoned, the authorities will make every effort to keep you in there and prove they were right.
It seems some people think that because there may be guilty people getting away with it. That a few innocent sacrificial lambs to balance things is ok. As long has it not them or their nearest and dearest. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"You seem surprised an establishment body makes it difficult for people that call it's decisions into question. No authority likes to be shown to be wrong but it happens every day across every kind of authority. Be it crime, wrong convictions, embezzlement, kids dieing while under state care, or state media covering up for nonces.
While am not surprised that authorities will do as you described. I am surprised that they have this legislation that will make it difficult to get compensation once you have fought to prove your innocence.
Morleyman has been saying it doesn't prove he didn't commit the crime, just he cast enough doubt. If you follow this logic, no one found guilty or innocent is actually that. Just not been proven or not proven.
I think once you've been found guilty and imprisoned, the authorities will make every effort to keep you in there and prove they were right.
It seems some people think that because there may be guilty people getting away with it. That a few innocent sacrificial lambs to balance things is ok. As long has it not them or their nearest and dearest. "
It may very well be that the appeal court looks at it an eventually casts him as innocent. But the court needs to decide that.
It's not out the realms of possibility that with advancements a retrial happens with the old evidence and new methodology.
As far as I am aware the new evidence only casted doubt over whether the initial trial was beyond all reasonable doubt. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"It may very well be that the appeal court looks at it an eventually casts him as innocent. But the court needs to decide that."
In this case it looks like he will be found innocent. But you are correct, the court needs to decide that before any compensation can be determined.
"As far as I am aware the new evidence only casted doubt over whether the initial trial was beyond all reasonable doubt."
From what I heard on the radio, the DNA evidence was covered up by the police. They won't say exactly what the DNA is, but they say it's on the victim's clothing, and that is of a sort that would be very strong evidence. The new testing has resulted in a positive match with another person. There is also evidence that one of the witnesses was coerced by the police.
It'll all come out in the re-trial, which will definitely be worth following. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"It may very well be that the appeal court looks at it an eventually casts him as innocent. But the court needs to decide that.
In this case it looks like he will be found innocent. But you are correct, the court needs to decide that before any compensation can be determined.
As far as I am aware the new evidence only casted doubt over whether the initial trial was beyond all reasonable doubt.
From what I heard on the radio, the DNA evidence was covered up by the police. They won't say exactly what the DNA is, but they say it's on the victim's clothing, and that is of a sort that would be very strong evidence. The new testing has resulted in a positive match with another person. There is also evidence that one of the witnesses was coerced by the police.
It'll all come out in the re-trial, which will definitely be worth following."
I'd heard about witness being a druggy.
I've not delved too deep into it. If as you say above is true then good luck to the man living out the rest of his life free and hopefully very well compensated even if it doesn't bring back his mosse dyears.
I dont expect much will happen to the officers, it never usually does.
I feel very sorry for the victim too. But hopefully thr new dna evidence means they can quickly try another person. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"To get justice in Britain seems to be getting worse. If your unfortunate enough to be wrongly convicted of a crime, then prove your innocence. It is not only getting harder to get compensation.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/law/2018/may/07/men-wrongfully-imprisoned-for-24-years-seek-compensation
If your one of the fortunate ones that do get compensation. You then get 25% of your compensation deducted for the boarding and food by the prison service. You couldn't make it up.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/07/27/innocent-andrew-malkinson-wrongful-conviction-compensation/"
. One of the problems in investigating cases such as this is that neither the police officers involved or the witnesses who gave statements are publicly named . Were the witness statements true or did the police manipulate them in order to get the results that they required.? Police forces have unlimited resouces available when it comes to investiging cases such as this , resources available to the defence are limited . Cards are loaded in favour of the police as many members of the public believe that they can do no wrong.
How many police officers have been sent to prison for perverting the course of justice or falsifying statements ? |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
» Add a new message to this topic
