FabSwingers.com > Forums > Politics > Can I ask our leave mean leave people a question
Can I ask our leave mean leave people a question
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By *abio OP Man
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
Just curious.... but is there anything that the government could publish between now and March 30th that you would not call project fear in the case of a no deal brexit?
Basically at what point would fear become a reality you would need to face
Because honestly if the answer is brexit day plus 1, then what is the point of doing anything....
The reason why I asked is that if the soubrey amendment goes through, this is what the government are going to have to do..... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Just curious.... but is there anything that the government could publish between now and March 30th that you would not call project fear in the case of a no deal brexit?
Basically at what point would fear become a reality you would need to face
Because honestly if the answer is brexit day plus 1, then what is the point of doing anything....
The reason why I asked is that if the soubrey amendment goes through, this is what the government are going to have to do....."
Before the 29th would be better  |
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By *abio OP Man
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
It’s looks like the government are going to publish the preparations plans and no deal assessments from operation yellowhammer... which means we will all get to see what the government truely thinks will happen |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Brexit means Brexit wont happen
A half brexit might well happen &
Remain is the only possible outcome other than that."
You can’t half brexit.
You leave the Eu or you don’t.
Those who claim otherwise add fuel to the “they didn’t know what they voted for” remainers argument.
It’s like wanting to get pregnant but only if it’s a girl, and having sex anyway. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Just curious.... but is there anything that the government could publish between now and March 30th that you would not call project fear in the case of a no deal brexit?
Basically at what point would fear become a reality you would need to face
Because honestly if the answer is brexit day plus 1, then what is the point of doing
anything....
The reason why I asked is that if the soubrey amendment goes through, this is what the government are going to have to do....."
They could publish their resignation letters... that wouldn't put fear into anyone |
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"Brexit means Brexit wont happen
A half brexit might well happen &
Remain is the only possible outcome other than that.
You can’t half brexit.
You leave the Eu or you don’t.
Those who claim otherwise add fuel to the “they didn’t know what they voted for” remainers argument.
It’s like wanting to get pregnant but only if it’s a girl, and having sex anyway. "
Course you can half brexit.
Just a different way of saying soft brexit.
All Embryos start out as Female.
Only after a few weeks does the male hormone get involved.
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By *oodmessMan
over a year ago
yumsville |
I am just totally confused on why the ERG abstained from TM's bill to further backstop talks.
If they don't want further backstop talks then they must be happy with the current deal which they voted against?
Same applies to those in the Labour, Libs, Green camps. If they voted against further backstop talks then they must like the backstop agreement as it stands?
Confused - though probably got it wrong. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Brexit means Brexit wont happen
A half brexit might well happen &
Remain is the only possible outcome other than that.
You can’t half brexit.
You leave the Eu or you don’t.
Those who claim otherwise add fuel to the “they didn’t know what they voted for” remainers argument.
It’s like wanting to get pregnant but only if it’s a girl, and having sex anyway. "
My friend voted leave because he heard that not infamous brexit speech done by hanan an co.
He effectively voted on the premise that "nobody is talking about the single market" and "we can be like Norway". He's not part Norwegian unlike myself, but I've taken him there with me and he liked the idea of our society being more like theirs
He now doesn't want to leave the EU. He doesn't like it, but he has listened and realised that what he voted for has been comendeered, or that it was not deliverable. |
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"I am just totally confused on why the ERG abstained from TM's bill to further backstop talks.
If they don't want further backstop talks then they must be happy with the current deal which they voted against?
Same applies to those in the Labour, Libs, Green camps. If they voted against further backstop talks then they must like the backstop agreement as it stands?
Confused - though probably got it wrong."
Theresa May was able to get the support of the ERG on the Brady ammendment during the last round of votes because the Brady ammendment kept no deal on the table and was a clear instruction to change the backstop in a legally binding way with an end date to it or to give the UK unilateral right to leave the backstop of our own volition. Since the Brady vote Theresa May looks like she has capitulated to the EU on the backstop plus the revelations about Olly Robbins being overheard in a hotel bar seemed to suggest the government had taken no deal off the table. The ERG wants no deal kept on the table. The ERG also want Olly Robbins sacked and replaced with trade negotiator Falconer, which Theresa May still hasn't done since the Brady ammendment vote. In light of all this the ERG chose to abstain on tonight's vote. If Theresa May wants the ERG back on board she needs to do those things she agreed on the Brady ammendment. |
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There were 3 specific terms set in place when article 50 was triggered, the ERG wants to wiggle out of these & go with a Hard Brexit.
Think of it like this.
A man wants to divorce his wife after signing a pre nuptial agreement that she will get the house & alimony to help her bring there children up.
After the divorce, he burns the house down & gives the children to care homes & says ex wife , go f*ck yourself. |
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By *abio OP Man
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
"I am just totally confused on why the ERG abstained from TM's bill to further backstop talks.
"
its because not only is the brady amendment now in the motion which they held may to hostage over...., but the spielman amendment that agreed there was a majority in the house for a no deal brexit......
they feel that if she gets no concession out of the EU, the only other road to go down is to take no deal off the table......
its interesting that the ERG are now basically acting like a party within the party.... and are basically trying to hold her as a hostage!
i think the backlash will come in the next few weeks if she steers in that direction.... we have another set of amendable motion votes up in 2 weeks time.... that is when we may finally see the fireworks.. |
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"What will be will be and all this worrying is a waste of time and energy."
Is what tou say on an aeroplane with no engines 35000 feet above the atlantic.
Not when your country is tumbling towards self made misery for millions which can be stopped by negating the people & following parliamentary sovereignty . |
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"I am just totally confused on why the ERG abstained from TM's bill to further backstop talks.
its because not only is the brady amendment now in the motion which they held may to hostage over...., but the spielman amendment that agreed there was a majority in the house for a no deal brexit......
they feel that if she gets no concession out of the EU, the only other road to go down is to take no deal off the table......
its interesting that the ERG are now basically acting like a party within the party.... and are basically trying to hold her as a hostage!
i think the backlash will come in the next few weeks if she steers in that direction.... we have another set of amendable motion votes up in 2 weeks time.... that is when we may finally see the fireworks.."
We do now have this fringe ERG group holding May to ransom - who in turn is holding parliament and the country to ransom. All so that May can keep the lunatics in the asylum that is the conservative party. The goal is that this party stays together - the ransom price is whatever is asked for. Your lives are a low price to pay, for theirs. |
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By *oubepoMan
over a year ago
Spain Portugal France |
You are leaving with a ‘no deal’ or something very, very similar, forget the theatrics and the ridiculous scaremongering, the shifty House of Commons antics, the biased MSM News .. The end result is clear
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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago
upton wirral |
"What will be will be and all this worrying is a waste of time and energy.
Is what tou say on an aeroplane with no engines 35000 feet above the atlantic.
Not when your country is tumbling towards self made misery for millions which can be stopped by negating the people & following parliamentary sovereignty ."
In five years brexit will be the best thing to happen to this country in years and you remoaners will look very very silly |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"What will be will be and all this worrying is a waste of time and energy.
Is what tou say on an aeroplane with no engines 35000 feet above the atlantic.
Not when your country is tumbling towards self made misery for millions which can be stopped by negating the people & following parliamentary sovereignty .In five years brexit will be the best thing to happen to this country in years and you remoaners will look very very silly"
Do you genuinely believe this?
I’m wondering how anyone can believe something like this. |
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"What will be will be and all this worrying is a waste of time and energy.
Is what tou say on an aeroplane with no engines 35000 feet above the atlantic.
Not when your country is tumbling towards self made misery for millions which can be stopped by negating the people & following parliamentary sovereignty .In five years brexit will be the best thing to happen to this country in years and you remoaners will look very very silly
Do you genuinely believe this?
I’m wondering how anyone can believe something like this."
Well, it has happened before hasn't it. We were told by the likes of Blair, Mandelson, Clegg, Campbell, the CBI, etc that the UK would be a basket case if we didn't join the Euro.
We didn't join the Euro and it turned out to be one of the best decisions this country has ever made. |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"What will be will be and all this worrying is a waste of time and energy.
Is what tou say on an aeroplane with no engines 35000 feet above the atlantic.
Not when your country is tumbling towards self made misery for millions which can be stopped by negating the people & following parliamentary sovereignty .In five years brexit will be the best thing to happen to this country in years and you remoaners will look very very silly"
Based on what?
What will happen in five years to improve the lives of people in this country? |
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By *oodmessMan
over a year ago
yumsville |
"I am just totally confused on why the ERG abstained from TM's bill to further backstop talks.
its because not only is the brady amendment now in the motion which they held may to hostage over...., but the spielman amendment that agreed there was a majority in the house for a no deal brexit......
they feel that if she gets no concession out of the EU, the only other road to go down is to take no deal off the table......
its interesting that the ERG are now basically acting like a party within the party.... and are basically trying to hold her as a hostage!
i think the backlash will come in the next few weeks if she steers in that direction.... we have another set of amendable motion votes up in 2 weeks time.... that is when we may finally see the fireworks.."
I understand how they are holding May to ransom (for reasons unknown) but as JC's peoples vote didn't didn't pass (in the event of no deal), and these amendments are non binding and no deal is statutory for the 29th, it seems pointless to not face the fact the tory's and dup will always outweigh the other parties as they will never concede government. So, other amendments along different lines need to be explored to have a deal, or no deal will come into effect and the ERGers will have their deal. |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"What will be will be and all this worrying is a waste of time and energy.
Is what tou say on an aeroplane with no engines 35000 feet above the atlantic.
Not when your country is tumbling towards self made misery for millions which can be stopped by negating the people & following parliamentary sovereignty .In five years brexit will be the best thing to happen to this country in years and you remoaners will look very very silly
Do you genuinely believe this?
I’m wondering how anyone can believe something like this.
Well, it has happened before hasn't it. We were told by the likes of Blair, Mandelson, Clegg, Campbell, the CBI, etc that the UK would be a basket case if we didn't join the Euro.
We didn't join the Euro and it turned out to be one of the best decisions this country has ever made. "
What are you talking about? What "happened before"?
Your actually describing something that did not happen.
You have got confused again.
You can try and describe what good things will happen in five years.
Not the unicorn fairytale version. Something with some logic rather than just making a declaration.
What could go wrong? Anything? Nothing at all?
You've not managed over the last three years so why start now?  |
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"What will be will be and all this worrying is a waste of time and energy.
Is what tou say on an aeroplane with no engines 35000 feet above the atlantic.
Not when your country is tumbling towards self made misery for millions which can be stopped by negating the people & following parliamentary sovereignty .In five years brexit will be the best thing to happen to this country in years and you remoaners will look very very silly
Do you genuinely believe this?
I’m wondering how anyone can believe something like this.
Well, it has happened before hasn't it. We were told by the likes of Blair, Mandelson, Clegg, Campbell, the CBI, etc that the UK would be a basket case if we didn't join the Euro.
We didn't join the Euro and it turned out to be one of the best decisions this country has ever made.
What are you talking about? What "happened before"?
Your actually describing something that did not happen.
You have got confused again.
You can try and describe what good things will happen in five years.
Not the unicorn fairytale version. Something with some logic rather than just making a declaration.
What could go wrong? Anything? Nothing at all?
You've not managed over the last three years so why start now? "
Well considering you can't count as it's not the 3 years anniversary of the vote to Leave until June, I'm not inclined to take much else of what you said seriously.
Dave Mover asked how anyone could take seriously what the previous poster said. People make judgements about the future based on past experiences, and there are similar parallels now between the scaremongering about Leaving the EU, as there were years ago based on not joining the Euro. |
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There are concrete numerical examples of large amounts of money that have been spent so far on brexit. There are concrete examples of jobs and money leaving the UK because of brexit. There are concrete examples of ways in which TMs deal will cost more money and provide less than we already have. There are even more examples of ways in which hard brexit will cost even more money and provide even less than we already have.
In three years I have yet to see anyone provide a concrete, detailed, numerical example of any way in which leaving the EU will increase jobs or make the country wealthier or provide a specific benefit in any other way. Airy fairy talk of "sovereignty" does not count unless you can give a concrete example of how that will translate into a specific greater good. Airy fairy talk of "you can't know how it will turn out" does not count - try going to a bank and asking for money for a business, and when they say "where's your business plan" telling them "oh I'm sure it'll all work out, I'll figure the details later".
I want to see a detailed, costed, realistic plan, explaining all the bad things that could happen, all the good things that could happen, putting them on a balance sheet against each other, and providing actual evidence that brexit will in some way be good for the people and good for the country.
Unfortunately at present all the evidence is that in the short term it will be bad, in the medium term it will be bad, in then long term (say the rest of my life expectancy) it will be bad. For all except a few people who are already rich and powerful, who will get much richer and much more powerful. And frankly I don't give a damn if it turns out to be brilliant 50 years from now, because I won't be here to see it, and none of the people asking for it will be here to see it. |
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"What will be will be and all this worrying is a waste of time and energy.
Is what tou say on an aeroplane with no engines 35000 feet above the atlantic.
Not when your country is tumbling towards self made misery for millions which can be stopped by negating the people & following parliamentary sovereignty .In five years brexit will be the best thing to happen to this country in years and you remoaners will look very very silly"
You keep saying this, yet you have no empirical data to suggest that there is anything in this assertion. It's as logical as saying everything will be fine if we are just less negative. |
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"There are concrete numerical examples of large amounts of money that have been spent so far on brexit. There are concrete examples of jobs and money leaving the UK because of brexit. There are concrete examples of ways in which TMs deal will cost more money and provide less than we already have. There are even more examples of ways in which hard brexit will cost even more money and provide even less than we already have.
In three years I have yet to see anyone provide a concrete, detailed, numerical example of any way in which leaving the EU will increase jobs or make the country wealthier or provide a specific benefit in any other way. Airy fairy talk of "sovereignty" does not count unless you can give a concrete example of how that will translate into a specific greater good. Airy fairy talk of "you can't know how it will turn out" does not count - try going to a bank and asking for money for a business, and when they say "where's your business plan" telling them "oh I'm sure it'll all work out, I'll figure the details later".
I want to see a detailed, costed, realistic plan, explaining all the bad things that could happen, all the good things that could happen, putting them on a balance sheet against each other, and providing actual evidence that brexit will in some way be good for the people and good for the country.
Unfortunately at present all the evidence is that in the short term it will be bad, in the medium term it will be bad, in then long term (say the rest of my life expectancy) it will be bad. For all except a few people who are already rich and powerful, who will get much richer and much more powerful. And frankly I don't give a damn if it turns out to be brilliant 50 years from now, because I won't be here to see it, and none of the people asking for it will be here to see it."
Exactly. You've nailed it.  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"What will be will be and all this worrying is a waste of time and energy.
Is what tou say on an aeroplane with no engines 35000 feet above the atlantic.
Not when your country is tumbling towards self made misery for millions which can be stopped by negating the people & following parliamentary sovereignty .In five years brexit will be the best thing to happen to this country in years and you remoaners will look very very silly
Do you genuinely believe this?
I’m wondering how anyone can believe something like this.
Well, it has happened before hasn't it. We were told by the likes of Blair, Mandelson, Clegg, Campbell, the CBI, etc that the UK would be a basket case if we didn't join the Euro.
We didn't join the Euro and it turned out to be one of the best decisions this country has ever made.
What are you talking about? What "happened before"?
Your actually describing something that did not happen.
You have got confused again.
You can try and describe what good things will happen in five years.
Not the unicorn fairytale version. Something with some logic rather than just making a declaration.
What could go wrong? Anything? Nothing at all?
You've not managed over the last three years so why start now?
Well considering you can't count as it's not the 3 years anniversary of the vote to Leave until June, I'm not inclined to take much else of what you said seriously.
Dave Mover asked how anyone could take seriously what the previous poster said. People make judgements about the future based on past experiences, and there are similar parallels now between the scaremongering about Leaving the EU, as there were years ago based on not joining the Euro."
Yeah and this pretty much answers it. Because something unrelated didn’t happen in the past, we will all be fine now.
So it’s a religious style blind faith rather than an evidence based prediction. |
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By *anbrCouple
over a year ago
Edinburgh |
"What will be will be and all this worrying is a waste of time and energy.
Is what tou say on an aeroplane with no engines 35000 feet above the atlantic.
Not when your country is tumbling towards self made misery for millions which can be stopped by negating the people & following parliamentary sovereignty .In five years brexit will be the best thing to happen to this country in years and you remoaners will look very very silly
Based on what?
What will happen in five years to improve the lives of people in this country?"
Based on what do you think Brexit will be a disaster for us?
We live in a first world country in the 21st century. We are being told that things that we supply to other, poorer countries such as drugs, will disappear. We are told that the police and army are on standby for any rioting etc post Brexit - the only riot will be if the people don't get what the people voted for!
Everything we hear everyday is conjecture to create fear so that the remainders overturn the democratic vote, that way trouble lies! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
It requires no prediction at all that trade will cost more and be more difficult by leaving without trade agreements.
It requires no prediction at all that GDP will drop if trade becomes more expensive & difficult.
It requires no prediction at all that services will suffer because of less funding available if trade becomes more expensive & difficult.
It requires no prediction at all that jobs will be lost if trade becomes more expensive & difficult.
It's just the physical figures that cannot be quantified other than it will be less than we have now.
There's already pressure on many services and any loss of trade can only exasperated the problem.
But all those problems are exactly what will happen if we crash out on WTO like so many seem convinced will be our saviour. |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"What will be will be and all this worrying is a waste of time and energy.
Is what tou say on an aeroplane with no engines 35000 feet above the atlantic.
Not when your country is tumbling towards self made misery for millions which can be stopped by negating the people & following parliamentary sovereignty .In five years brexit will be the best thing to happen to this country in years and you remoaners will look very very silly
Based on what?
What will happen in five years to improve the lives of people in this country?
Based on what do you think Brexit will be a disaster for us?
We live in a first world country in the 21st century. We are being told that things that we supply to other, poorer countries such as drugs, will disappear. We are told that the police and army are on standby for any rioting etc post Brexit - the only riot will be if the people don't get what the people voted for!
Everything we hear everyday is conjecture to create fear so that the remainders overturn the democratic vote, that way trouble lies! "
If you don't know the answer by now you haven't been thinking.
Assuming that the point of leaving is to not be in a frictionless trade area with the EU then export costs to one of the world's biggest and wealthiest markets becomes more expensive. Trade deals which the EU have are lost. There is no logical argument for these deals being carried over on identical terms because our market is so much smaller.
A deal with the USA will be on their terms and will exclude us striking a deal with China.
We lose financial passport information rights to the EU removing a significant proportion of our finance industries work. Investment, jobs and taxes fall. Less public money to spend.
We will not be able to buy or sell as much so income falls and choice and costs rise.
The UK will no longer be the location of any European headquarters. Investment, jobs and taxes fall. Less public money to spend.
There is no reason to invest in the UK to sell to the EU. Investment, jobs and taxes fall. Less public money to spend.
The only economic model that claims to provide a benefit to the UK is to unilaterally remove all tariffs which will kill our manufacturing and agricultural industries. Investment, jobs and taxes fall. Less public money to spend.
What of those things is not logical?
Any other Brexit benefit relies on a cascade of unproven events taking place combined with hope and faith. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
Neo liberalism.
The ideology that as long as the economy is "doing ok" then everything else in society will fall into place.
Business is everything and nothing or nobody will stop it's progress. |
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"There are concrete numerical examples of large amounts of money that have been spent so far on brexit. There are concrete examples of jobs and money leaving the UK because of brexit. There are concrete examples of ways in which TMs deal will cost more money and provide less than we already have. There are even more examples of ways in which hard brexit will cost even more money and provide even less than we already have.
In three years I have yet to see anyone provide a concrete, detailed, numerical example of any way in which leaving the EU will increase jobs or make the country wealthier or provide a specific benefit in any other way. Airy fairy talk of "sovereignty" does not count unless you can give a concrete example of how that will translate into a specific greater good. Airy fairy talk of "you can't know how it will turn out" does not count - try going to a bank and asking for money for a business, and when they say "where's your business plan" telling them "oh I'm sure it'll all work out, I'll figure the details later".
I want to see a detailed, costed, realistic plan, explaining all the bad things that could happen, all the good things that could happen, putting them on a balance sheet against each other, and providing actual evidence that brexit will in some way be good for the people and good for the country.
Unfortunately at present all the evidence is that in the short term it will be bad, in the medium term it will be bad, in then long term (say the rest of my life expectancy) it will be bad. For all except a few people who are already rich and powerful, who will get much richer and much more powerful. And frankly I don't give a damn if it turns out to be brilliant 50 years from now, because I won't be here to see it, and none of the people asking for it will be here to see it."
Spot on |
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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago
North West |
"What will be will be and all this worrying is a waste of time and energy.
Is what tou say on an aeroplane with no engines 35000 feet above the atlantic.
Not when your country is tumbling towards self made misery for millions which can be stopped by negating the people & following parliamentary sovereignty .In five years brexit will be the best thing to happen to this country in years and you remoaners will look very very silly
Based on what?
What will happen in five years to improve the lives of people in this country?
Based on what do you think Brexit will be a disaster for us?
We live in a first world country in the 21st century. We are being told that things that we supply to other, poorer countries such as drugs, will disappear. We are told that the police and army are on standby for any rioting etc post Brexit - the only riot will be if the people don't get what the people voted for!
Everything we hear everyday is conjecture to create fear so that the remainders overturn the democratic vote, that way trouble lies! "
I can’t believe that we still hear comments/questions like this. To answer your question properly, you would need to articulate what your idea of Brexit is. When you know in your own mind what your idea of Brexit looks like you then need to conduct an exercise that should come naturally - you assess its strengths and weaknesses and then you identify potential pitfalls and obstructions and make contingencies as to how to deal with them. As long as you have a reasonable understanding of how the world works, by doing this, you will quickly figure out that any and every version of Brexit comes with some pretty significant obstacles.
The reality is still the same today as it always was. Most Brexiters made emotionally driven decisions and those decisions were backed by hope and expectation, or just an assumption that everything would be ok because we are British and so we must be able to get along ok without those pesky foreigners.
David Davis was 100% wrong when he infamously said “there is no downside to Brexit, only considerable upsides.” There are no tangible upsides at all. Any potential short term benefit of turning the U.K. into a dumping ground for the world’s tariff free exports will end up destroying manufacturing and creating more jobs in coffee shops and burger joints instead. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"What will be will be and all this worrying is a waste of time and energy.
Is what tou say on an aeroplane with no engines 35000 feet above the atlantic.
Not when your country is tumbling towards self made misery for millions which can be stopped by negating the people & following parliamentary sovereignty .In five years brexit will be the best thing to happen to this country in years and you remoaners will look very very silly"
Was that on the side of a bus? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"What will be will be and all this worrying is a waste of time and energy.
Is what tou say on an aeroplane with no engines 35000 feet above the atlantic.
Not when your country is tumbling towards self made misery for millions which can be stopped by negating the people & following parliamentary sovereignty .In five years brexit will be the best thing to happen to this country in years and you remoaners will look very very silly
Was that on the side of a bus?"
It'd have to be a long bus |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I won’t believe anything that these politicians say in order to try and change my mind about BREXIT. They can no more prove what will happen when we leave, than they could if we were to stay.
I believe in BREXIT, and that the referendum result should damn well be what takes us out of the EU. I had 40 plus years of this ever closening “union” and frankly cannot wait to get out.
On the other side are people who don’t believe we should have had a referendum, but only because they believe that lesser beings had the same voting rights that they had. They believe that people who voted leave are stupid enough to have been conned by corrupt politicians and business people. They want our exit to be cancelled, and often come out with excuses that are very nauseous and condescending. Excuses such as, leave voters didn’t know what they voted for, or leave voters are of low intellect. More often than not, your remainer lives, or has property or business outside of the UK, mainly in EU member states.
Thing is nobody can prove anything yet, because we haven’t left yet. I only wish we would hurry up and get the fuck out ASAP.
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"I won’t believe anything that these politicians say in order to try and change my mind about BREXIT. They can no more prove what will happen when we leave, than they could if we were to stay.
I believe in BREXIT, and that the referendum result should damn well be what takes us out of the EU. I had 40 plus years of this ever closening “union” and frankly cannot wait to get out.
On the other side are people who don’t believe we should have had a referendum, but only because they believe that lesser beings had the same voting rights that they had. They believe that people who voted leave are stupid enough to have been conned by corrupt politicians and business people. They want our exit to be cancelled, and often come out with excuses that are very nauseous and condescending. Excuses such as, leave voters didn’t know what they voted for, or leave voters are of low intellect. More often than not, your remainer lives, or has property or business outside of the UK, mainly in EU member states.
Thing is nobody can prove anything yet, because we haven’t left yet. I only wish we would hurry up and get the fuck out ASAP.
"
Yeah, well the brexiters own property abroad Farrage in France near Perpignan. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I won’t believe anything that these politicians say in order to try and change my mind about BREXIT. They can no more prove what will happen when we leave, than they could if we were to stay.
"
So you don't believe current free trade agreements will be more expensive and difficult being reduced onto WTO terms then ?
Very interesting viewpoint I must say |
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"I won’t believe anything that these politicians say in order to try and change my mind about BREXIT. They can no more prove what will happen when we leave, than they could if we were to stay.
I believe in BREXIT, and that the referendum result should damn well be what takes us out of the EU. I had 40 plus years of this ever closening “union” and frankly cannot wait to get out.
On the other side are people who don’t believe we should have had a referendum, but only because they believe that lesser beings had the same voting rights that they had. They believe that people who voted leave are stupid enough to have been conned by corrupt politicians and business people. They want our exit to be cancelled, and often come out with excuses that are very nauseous and condescending. Excuses such as, leave voters didn’t know what they voted for, or leave voters are of low intellect. More often than not, your remainer lives, or has property or business outside of the UK, mainly in EU member states.
Thing is nobody can prove anything yet, because we haven’t left yet. I only wish we would hurry up and get the fuck out ASAP.
"
The problem here is that Brexit is not a belief system, although many choose to follow it with religeous fervour. We live in a harder, more real economic system, so believing hard and wishing things to be different will not make it so.
Brexiteers just have to be honest for a change and admit they have lied about economic benefits. Unicorns are more likely to exist... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I won’t believe anything that these politicians say in order to try and change my mind about BREXIT. They can no more prove what will happen when we leave, than they could if we were to stay.
I believe in BREXIT, and that the referendum result should damn well be what takes us out of the EU. I had 40 plus years of this ever closening “union” and frankly cannot wait to get out.
On the other side are people who don’t believe we should have had a referendum, but only because they believe that lesser beings had the same voting rights that they had. They believe that people who voted leave are stupid enough to have been conned by corrupt politicians and business people. They want our exit to be cancelled, and often come out with excuses that are very nauseous and condescending. Excuses such as, leave voters didn’t know what they voted for, or leave voters are of low intellect. More often than not, your remainer lives, or has property or business outside of the UK, mainly in EU member states.
Thing is nobody can prove anything yet, because we haven’t left yet. I only wish we would hurry up and get the fuck out ASAP.
"
Are you saying you are indifferent to the impact Brexit has? Eg any price is worth paying.
Or are you saying no one knows the price?and so we should crack on and find out?
If the latter, what if project fear was right? Would you be okay with that ?
Personally, I can’t see what people who hold the first view are voting against. Possibly a principle rather than a real life issue.
And.i can’t see how anyone can vote where there is a risk of a negative outcome of a negative outcome if they are unwilling to look to understand it.
No one “knows” or “can prove” what the weather will be tomorrow. Yet we make decisions based on imperfect predictions. |
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"What will be will be and all this worrying is a waste of time and energy.
Is what tou say on an aeroplane with no engines 35000 feet above the atlantic.
Not when your country is tumbling towards self made misery for millions which can be stopped by negating the people & following parliamentary sovereignty .In five years brexit will be the best thing to happen to this country in years and you remoaners will look very very silly"
All plucked from thin air - ignoring the clear evidence that points to the opposite.  |
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"I won’t believe anything that these politicians say in order to try and change my mind about BREXIT. They can no more prove what will happen when we leave, than they could if we were to stay.
I believe in BREXIT, and that the referendum result should damn well be what takes us out of the EU. I had 40 plus years of this ever closening “union” and frankly cannot wait to get out.
On the other side are people who don’t believe we should have had a referendum, but only because they believe that lesser beings had the same voting rights that they had. They believe that people who voted leave are stupid enough to have been conned by corrupt politicians and business people. They want our exit to be cancelled, and often come out with excuses that are very nauseous and condescending. Excuses such as, leave voters didn’t know what they voted for, or leave voters are of low intellect. More often than not, your remainer lives, or has property or business outside of the UK, mainly in EU member states.
Thing is nobody can prove anything yet, because we haven’t left yet. I only wish we would hurry up and get the fuck out ASAP.
"
Thankfully, the democratic process should support appropriate evaluation, negotiations and agreements - not to mention hundreds of pieces of legislative change that would be made, rather than a knee-jerk reaction, trying to impose a magic wand waving and everything is done.
As global trade is also a highly complex process, involving thousands of businesses, taxes and standards compliance, it also means that more people than just a few extremists here are impacted and have to make adjustments to their behaviour etc. The bottom line is that UK residents rightly expect those in charge to have managed the whole Brexit mess, such that they'd experience minimal negative impact, if any at all - and this both in the short and longer term. With just days to go until March 29th and the government having no certainty about anything, the immediate short-term well-being isn't looking positive. If the conservatives had managed to agree what they wanted and to have had a plan, they would have been better place to start negotiations. As they didn't, almost 3 years since the referendum, they're highlighting the major catastrophe that this is. |
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"I won’t believe anything that these politicians say in order to try and change my mind about BREXIT. They can no more prove what will happen when we leave, than they could if we were to stay.
I believe in BREXIT, and that the referendum result should damn well be what takes us out of the EU. I had 40 plus years of this ever closening “union” and frankly cannot wait to get out.
On the other side are people who don’t believe we should have had a referendum, but only because they believe that lesser beings had the same voting rights that they had. They believe that people who voted leave are stupid enough to have been conned by corrupt politicians and business people. They want our exit to be cancelled, and often come out with excuses that are very nauseous and condescending. Excuses such as, leave voters didn’t know what they voted for, or leave voters are of low intellect. More often than not, your remainer lives, or has property or business outside of the UK, mainly in EU member states.
Thing is nobody can prove anything yet, because we haven’t left yet. I only wish we would hurry up and get the fuck out ASAP.
"
I'm loving the logic... |
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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
"
Brexiteers just have to be honest for a change and admit they have lied about economic benefits. Unicorns are more likely to exist... "
If only Mrs May, when she became Tory leader and PM in 2016, had reset people's expectations.
She could have been honest with the public, and distanced herself from the impossible claims made by the Leave campaign.
She opted not to. She opted to persist with them, still offering people unicorns and things that were never in her control to deliver.
Her Government is still at it, predicting the EU will cave in at the 11th hour and dish out large slices of cake.
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By *andS66Couple
over a year ago
Derby |
"i can’t see how anyone can vote where there is a risk of a negative outcome of a negative outcome if they are unwilling to look to understand it."
You must have real difficulty bringing yourself to vote in general elections;
- every party will tell you there's a risk of a negative outcome of voting for their opposition... as, of course, there is.
- Unless you're one of a significant number of the electorate who blindly vote for the same party every time. |
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Since the referendum I haven't heard, or read, anything realistically positive about the effects of us leaving the EU - it has been all bad news, and continues to be so.
Has anyone got any accurate constructive statements, based on facts not hearsay or uneducated assumptions, to explain why we should leave the EU? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Since the referendum I haven't heard, or read, anything realistically positive about the effects of us leaving the EU - it has been all bad news, and continues to be so.
Has anyone got any accurate constructive statements, based on facts not hearsay or uneducated assumptions, to explain why we should leave the EU? "
For the sake of a balanced debate, what are the factual benefits of remaining. |
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By *abio OP Man
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
"Since the referendum I haven't heard, or read, anything realistically positive about the effects of us leaving the EU - it has been all bad news, and continues to be so.
Has anyone got any accurate constructive statements, based on facts not hearsay or uneducated assumptions, to explain why we should leave the EU?
For the sake of a balanced debate, what are the factual benefits of remaining."
well the pound wouldn't have probably tanked the way it has....
... and those jobs that have not left the uk because of certain cross country 3rd party rules wouldn't have gone....
and uk manufacturing would likely be in a better position than it is right now......
and all that money that has had to go into no deal planning could have been spent elsewhere....
and just from a "nice human" point of view.... you wouldn't have millions of people shitting themselves over their status in various different countries.. i mean, stress! who really needs it!!! right????
but other than that lot.... ya right, it's not like we have reaped any benefits from being in the EU!!! (spoiler... being facetious!) |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Since the referendum I haven't heard, or read, anything realistically positive about the effects of us leaving the EU - it has been all bad news, and continues to be so.
Has anyone got any accurate constructive statements, based on facts not hearsay or uneducated assumptions, to explain why we should leave the EU?
For the sake of a balanced debate, what are the factual benefits of remaining.
well the pound wouldn't have probably tanked the way it has....
... and those jobs that have not left the uk because of certain cross country 3rd party rules wouldn't have gone....
and uk manufacturing would likely be in a better position than it is right now......
and all that money that has had to go into no deal planning could have been spent elsewhere....
and just from a "nice human" point of view.... you wouldn't have millions of people shitting themselves over their status in various different countries.. i mean, stress! who really needs it!!! right????
but other than that lot.... ya right, it's not like we have reaped any benefits from being in the EU!!! (spoiler... being facetious!)"
More (I'm sorry to say) crap. One example :
Attributing nissan not manufacturing x trails in sunderland to brexit, when its because suv's with diesel engines don't sell wrll in Europe anyway, and less demand from china.
Any more examples _abio? I'll hive you some time to Google some crap up
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Since the referendum I haven't heard, or read, anything realistically positive about the effects of us leaving the EU - it has been all bad news, and continues to be so.
Has anyone got any accurate constructive statements, based on facts not hearsay or uneducated assumptions, to explain why we should leave the EU?
For the sake of a balanced debate, what are the factual benefits of remaining.
well the pound wouldn't have probably tanked the way it has....
... and those jobs that have not left the uk because of certain cross country 3rd party rules wouldn't have gone....
and uk manufacturing would likely be in a better position than it is right now......
and all that money that has had to go into no deal planning could have been spent elsewhere....
and just from a "nice human" point of view.... you wouldn't have millions of people shitting themselves over their status in various different countries.. i mean, stress! who really needs it!!! right????
but other than that lot.... ya right, it's not like we have reaped any benefits from being in the EU!!! (spoiler... being facetious!)"
How about the eu being obstinate, obstructive snd malevolent? You ever consider that _abio? Just curious. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Since the referendum I haven't heard, or read, anything realistically positive about the effects of us leaving the EU - it has been all bad news, and continues to be so.
Has anyone got any accurate constructive statements, based on facts not hearsay or uneducated assumptions, to explain why we should leave the EU?
For the sake of a balanced debate, what are the factual benefits of remaining.
well the pound wouldn't have probably tanked the way it has....
... and those jobs that have not left the uk because of certain cross country 3rd party rules wouldn't have gone....
and uk manufacturing would likely be in a better position than it is right now......
and all that money that has had to go into no deal planning could have been spent elsewhere....
and just from a "nice human" point of view.... you wouldn't have millions of people shitting themselves over their status in various different countries.. i mean, stress! who really needs it!!! right????
but other than that lot.... ya right, it's not like we have reaped any benefits from being in the EU!!! (spoiler... being facetious!)"
Also freedom to travel around Europe. Also workers rights which are enshrined in EU law. Environmental protection legislation. All the “red tape” that the ERG etc are waiting to remove.
Common trading market. The other poster hit the tip of the iceberg with the financial benefits of being in the EU.
Having a huge trading bloke to negiatiate favourable trade deals with.
Being part of something bigger, working together on scientific and research projects.
I mean if you were genuinely asking this question. What planet have you just arrived from?
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Brexit means Brexit wont happen
A half brexit might well happen &
Remain is the only possible outcome other than that.
You can’t half brexit.
You leave the Eu or you don’t.
Those who claim otherwise add fuel to the “they didn’t know what they voted for” remainers argument.
It’s like wanting to get pregnant but only if it’s a girl, and having sex anyway.
Course you can half brexit.
Just a different way of saying soft brexit.
All Embryos start out as Female.
Only after a few weeks does the male hormone get involved.
"
thats because we wouldn't ask for directions .  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Since the referendum I haven't heard, or read, anything realistically positive about the effects of us leaving the EU - it has been all bad news, and continues to be so.
Has anyone got any accurate constructive statements, based on facts not hearsay or uneducated assumptions, to explain why we should leave the EU?
For the sake of a balanced debate, what are the factual benefits of remaining.
well the pound wouldn't have probably tanked the way it has....
... and those jobs that have not left the uk because of certain cross country 3rd party rules wouldn't have gone....
and uk manufacturing would likely be in a better position than it is right now......
and all that money that has had to go into no deal planning could have been spent elsewhere....
and just from a "nice human" point of view.... you wouldn't have millions of people shitting themselves over their status in various different countries.. i mean, stress! who really needs it!!! right????
but other than that lot.... ya right, it's not like we have reaped any benefits from being in the EU!!! (spoiler... being facetious!)
Also freedom to travel around Europe. Also workers rights which are enshrined in EU law. Environmental protection legislation. All the “red tape” that the ERG etc are waiting to remove.
Common trading market. The other poster hit the tip of the iceberg with the financial benefits of being in the EU.
Having a huge trading bloke to negiatiate favourable trade deals with.
Being part of something bigger, working together on scientific and research projects.
I mean if you were genuinely asking this question. What planet have you just arrived from?
"
Thats lovely, the way you describe all that. I see you live in the south West.
where i live in particular, have always been given the shit end of the stick from southern orientated governments.
While you in the south gain from the eu, and leave us "thick northerners" with the table scraps.
If we were inclued in the benefits of the eu to the extent you are then perhaps we'd hsve voted remain.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Since the referendum I haven't heard, or read, anything realistically positive about the effects of us leaving the EU - it has been all bad news, and continues to be so.
Has anyone got any accurate constructive statements, based on facts not hearsay or uneducated assumptions, to explain why we should leave the EU?
For the sake of a balanced debate, what are the factual benefits of remaining.
well the pound wouldn't have probably tanked the way it has....
... and those jobs that have not left the uk because of certain cross country 3rd party rules wouldn't have gone....
and uk manufacturing would likely be in a better position than it is right now......
and all that money that has had to go into no deal planning could have been spent elsewhere....
and just from a "nice human" point of view.... you wouldn't have millions of people shitting themselves over their status in various different countries.. i mean, stress! who really needs it!!! right????
but other than that lot.... ya right, it's not like we have reaped any benefits from being in the EU!!! (spoiler... being facetious!)
Also freedom to travel around Europe. Also workers rights which are enshrined in EU law. Environmental protection legislation. All the “red tape” that the ERG etc are waiting to remove.
Common trading market. The other poster hit the tip of the iceberg with the financial benefits of being in the EU.
Having a huge trading bloke to negiatiate favourable trade deals with.
Being part of something bigger, working together on scientific and research projects.
I mean if you were genuinely asking this question. What planet have you just arrived from?
Thats lovely, the way you describe all that. I see you live in the south West.
where i live in particular, have always been given the shit end of the stick from southern orientated governments.
While you in the south gain from the eu, and leave us "thick northerners" with the table scraps.
If we were inclued in the benefits of the eu to the extent you are then perhaps we'd hsve voted remain.
"
Why have you labelled yourself “thick northerner”? That’s nothing to do with me.
If you live in an already deprived area, as you’ve insinuated. Then you’ll be amongst the most severely impacted by Brexit.
I too would like to know how so many people were conned into voting themselves into more austerity and poverty for the benefit of a select few. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Since the referendum I haven't heard, or read, anything realistically positive about the effects of us leaving the EU - it has been all bad news, and continues to be so.
Has anyone got any accurate constructive statements, based on facts not hearsay or uneducated assumptions, to explain why we should leave the EU?
For the sake of a balanced debate, what are the factual benefits of remaining.
well the pound wouldn't have probably tanked the way it has....
... and those jobs that have not left the uk because of certain cross country 3rd party rules wouldn't have gone....
and uk manufacturing would likely be in a better position than it is right now......
and all that money that has had to go into no deal planning could have been spent elsewhere....
and just from a "nice human" point of view.... you wouldn't have millions of people shitting themselves over their status in various different countries.. i mean, stress! who really needs it!!! right????
but other than that lot.... ya right, it's not like we have reaped any benefits from being in the EU!!! (spoiler... being facetious!)
Also freedom to travel around Europe. Also workers rights which are enshrined in EU law. Environmental protection legislation. All the “red tape” that the ERG etc are waiting to remove.
Common trading market. The other poster hit the tip of the iceberg with the financial benefits of being in the EU.
Having a huge trading bloke to negiatiate favourable trade deals with.
Being part of something bigger, working together on scientific and research projects.
I mean if you were genuinely asking this question. What planet have you just arrived from?
Thats lovely, the way you describe all that. I see you live in the south West.
where i live in particular, have always been given the shit end of the stick from southern orientated governments.
While you in the south gain from the eu, and leave us "thick northerners" with the table scraps.
If we were inclued in the benefits of the eu to the extent you are then perhaps we'd hsve voted remain.
"
Whixh benefits do you think you’re excluded from ? |
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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago
North West |
"Since the referendum I haven't heard, or read, anything realistically positive about the effects of us leaving the EU - it has been all bad news, and continues to be so.
Has anyone got any accurate constructive statements, based on facts not hearsay or uneducated assumptions, to explain why we should leave the EU?
For the sake of a balanced debate, what are the factual benefits of remaining."
We are already £800 million a week worse off - and we haven’t even left yet. The GBP is undervalued and facing even bigger losses with a no deal exit thereby putting the nation at risk of a national currency crisis. Not to mention the prospect of trying to face up to the world as a small and largely ineffective nation is going to result in a very big reality check.
No credible economist or international political analyst thinks that Brexitis anything other than completely stupid with absolutely no upsides for anyone in the U.K. but with considerable upside for international carpetbaggers. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Peacehaven it would be interesting to hear your view to this
"I won’t believe anything that these politicians say in order to try and change my mind about BREXIT. They can no more prove what will happen when we leave, than they could if we were to stay.
So you don't believe current free trade agreements will be more expensive and difficult being reduced onto WTO terms then ?
Very interesting viewpoint I must say"
So are politicians, economists &
general facts still unbelievable to you? |
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