FabSwingers.com > Forums > Swingers Chat > Straight guys/TV.... Part 2
Straight guys/TV.... Part 2
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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I think what's been really interesting for me, after taking the time to read all your replies is that things aren't black and white. I'll openly admit maybe I've been a little narrow minded, so thanks for opening my eyes a little   |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I think what's been really interesting for me, after taking the time to read all your replies is that things aren't black and white. I'll openly admit maybe I've been a little narrow minded, so thanks for opening my eyes a little "
And there what’s important , being able to be open to listen to lived experiences and be open minded and you may be surprised
So I think your thread was positive
I think a lot of people who don’t know (and that’s okay as it’s a small percentage and most people never interacted in person with trans people or maybe they have but didn’t realise) is just due to ignorance. In the sense of not knowing about something  and talking with some preconceived notions
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"I think what's been really interesting for me, after taking the time to read all your replies is that things aren't black and white. I'll openly admit maybe I've been a little narrow minded, so thanks for opening my eyes a little "
I just wanted to say it's refreshing when people openly admit to having a change of perspective
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"I think what's been really interesting for me, after taking the time to read all your replies is that things aren't black and white. I'll openly admit maybe I've been a little narrow minded, so thanks for opening my eyes a little
I just wanted to say it's refreshing when people openly admit to having a change of perspective
"
I wouldn't neccesaily say my perspective on the original question has changed, but I'm somewhat more understanding/sympathetic |
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"I think what's been really interesting for me, after taking the time to read all your replies is that things aren't black and white. I'll openly admit maybe I've been a little narrow minded, so thanks for opening my eyes a little "
Welcome x its good to ask and try see things from different angles ... a healthy discussion is a good discussion even if its still seen from opposite sites ...
I always say to anyone .. why have/make enemies when you can have / make interesting friends .. |
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"I think what's been really interesting for me, after taking the time to read all your replies is that things aren't black and white. I'll openly admit maybe I've been a little narrow minded, so thanks for opening my eyes a little
I just wanted to say it's refreshing when people openly admit to having a change of perspective
I wouldn't neccesaily say my perspective on the original question has changed, but I'm somewhat more understanding/sympathetic "
Fair enough but even still you have admitted to being more understanding sympathetic life is so much more fun when people are open to seeing other peoples perspective |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I noticed the thread has changed to straight and TV. As I still think there’s some confusion on the two categories
By the way, the difference between TV and TS is generally this:
A TS goes through transition because of gender dysphoria. (This is diagnosed by a specialist psychiatrist who deals with these sex and gender issues)
transition has 3 phases, social transition (so basically telling loved ones, work etc about transitioning and changing documents etc), medical transition (big step…taking cross sex hormones that will change second sex characteristics) and then surgical transition ( getting a vagina, breast augmentation, facial feminisation and so on)
Usually the first 2 steps are needed to be a transsexual (basically when we start messing with biology as hormones are quite something!)
So a TS person lives a life in the gender they identify as. There’s a lot of pressure on passing for trans females, but ultimately, everyone is different and still valid, and transitioning goals are different from person to person.
Transvestitism generally means wearing womens clothing. So the presentation can be very feminine because there’s a dress and make up etc. But the key is it‘s not their true identity. Or if it is, it’s a part of it that comes out in certain moments for different reasons (could be personal, could be for sex etc)
Usually TVs are happy with their gender as male and are happy to let the other side out every now and then.
I can’t speak for all TVs as I’m not one, so correct me if I’m wrong but that’s what I’ve gathered as well from some here on the forum like the lovely Sophie xx |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Whilst I do not have a dog in this fight, my favourite comment on this was from a very effeminate gay man:
"If I fuck a pussy, does that make me straight?" |
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"I noticed the thread has changed to straight and TV. As I still think there’s some confusion on the two categories
By the way, the difference between TV and TS is generally this:
A TS goes through transition because of gender dysphoria. (This is diagnosed by a specialist psychiatrist who deals with these sex and gender issues)
transition has 3 phases, social transition (so basically telling loved ones, work etc about transitioning and changing documents etc), medical transition (big step…taking cross sex hormones that will change second sex characteristics) and then surgical transition ( getting a vagina, breast augmentation, facial feminisation and so on)
Usually the first 2 steps are needed to be a transsexual (basically when we start messing with biology as hormones are quite something!)
So a TS person lives a life in the gender they identify as. There’s a lot of pressure on passing for trans females, but ultimately, everyone is different and still valid, and transitioning goals are different from person to person.
Transvestitism generally means wearing womens clothing. So the presentation can be very feminine because there’s a dress and make up etc. But the key is it‘s not their true identity. Or if it is, it’s a part of it that comes out in certain moments for different reasons (could be personal, could be for sex etc)
Usually TVs are happy with their gender as male and are happy to let the other side out every now and then.
I can’t speak for all TVs as I’m not one, so correct me if I’m wrong but that’s what I’ve gathered as well from some here on the forum like the lovely Sophie xx "
You got the TV part correct in my view. What always annoys me is when we are told we dress for sexual reasons. Some do a lot don’t, especially when we get older.
I don’t try to talk about Trans Women or Men as we are not the same. Born in the wrong body isn’t the same as happy being a man with a need to dress as the opposite sex occasionally or regularly.
Thanks Kylie, Sophie did a great job explaining our side of the Trans element.
I admire your patience when dealing with ignorance and prejudice I don’t think I could be as understanding. I certainly learned more from your posts than I have ever learned on the TV scene. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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When I used to dress more the worst abuse I got was from a trans woman who called me a coward for not having the change.
As said before not everyone who dresses female feels they are the wrong sex. |
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By *illie99TV/TS
over a year ago
Central Scotland |
"
Transvestitism generally means wearing womens clothing. So the presentation can be very feminine because there’s a dress and make up etc. But the key is it‘s not their true identity. Or if it is, it’s a part of it that comes out in certain moments for different reasons (could be personal, could be for sex etc)
Usually TVs are happy with their gender as male and are happy to let the other side out every now and then.
I can’t speak for all TVs as I’m not one, so correct me if I’m wrong but that’s what I’ve gathered as well from some here on the forum like the lovely Sophie xx "
Spot on from my perspective, whilst I love the opportunity to let my feminine side out, slipping into a nice dress and applying the makeup. I identify as male and am more than happy being one. |
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Lingerie is one of my biggest turn ons, whether someone else wearing or wearing myself. In both cases it looks and feels soo sexy (though don't think it looks that great on me!)
I don't dress to look or act feminine. If a lady wanted to dress me that way with make-up etc i'd be cool with that though...all good fun!
I guess it's a kink rather than stating I'm a TV but don't mind which way people might perceive it, but do notice a lot of profiles interested in T.Vs but not looking for single guys! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I noticed the thread has changed to straight and TV. As I still think there’s some confusion on the two categories
By the way, the difference between TV and TS is generally this:
A TS goes through transition because of gender dysphoria. (This is diagnosed by a specialist psychiatrist who deals with these sex and gender issues)
transition has 3 phases, social transition (so basically telling loved ones, work etc about transitioning and changing documents etc), medical transition (big step…taking cross sex hormones that will change second sex characteristics) and then surgical transition ( getting a vagina, breast augmentation, facial feminisation and so on)
Usually the first 2 steps are needed to be a transsexual (basically when we start messing with biology as hormones are quite something!)
So a TS person lives a life in the gender they identify as. There’s a lot of pressure on passing for trans females, but ultimately, everyone is different and still valid, and transitioning goals are different from person to person.
Transvestitism generally means wearing womens clothing. So the presentation can be very feminine because there’s a dress and make up etc. But the key is it‘s not their true identity. Or if it is, it’s a part of it that comes out in certain moments for different reasons (could be personal, could be for sex etc)
Usually TVs are happy with their gender as male and are happy to let the other side out every now and then.
I can’t speak for all TVs as I’m not one, so correct me if I’m wrong but that’s what I’ve gathered as well from some here on the forum like the lovely Sophie xx
You got the TV part correct in my view. What always annoys me is when we are told we dress for sexual reasons. Some do a lot don’t, especially when we get older.
I don’t try to talk about Trans Women or Men as we are not the same. Born in the wrong body isn’t the same as happy being a man with a need to dress as the opposite sex occasionally or regularly.
Thanks Kylie, Sophie did a great job explaining our side of the Trans element.
I admire your patience when dealing with ignorance and prejudice I don’t think I could be as understanding. I certainly learned more from your posts than I have ever learned on the TV scene. "
I’m so glad to hear  xx |
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By *1bttmMan
over a year ago
Shoreditch east London |
"Whilst I do not have a dog in this fight, my favourite comment on this was from a very effeminate gay man:
"If I fuck a pussy, does that make me straight?""
I've said that be4 but the question was does it make me bi? The person I was "debating" this with said def, yes!
I didn't agree because I identify as 100% gay. It was a spur of moment thing and they argued if it made me cum then I was def attracted to her.....but to be honest I did but I wasn't turned on by her. It was the whole scenario and situation. Had I been alone with her then it def wouldn't ave happened. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Whilst I do not have a dog in this fight, my favourite comment on this was from a very effeminate gay man:
"If I fuck a pussy, does that make me straight?""
If it turned him on and he enjoyed it it makes him bi, bit obvious that tbh… |
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By *bi HaiveMan
over a year ago
Forum Mod Cheeseville, Somerset |
"Whilst I do not have a dog in this fight, my favourite comment on this was from a very effeminate gay man:
"If I fuck a pussy, does that make me straight?"
If it turned him on and he enjoyed it it makes him bi, bit obvious that tbh…"
It doesn't make him anything at all, except in your opinion.
A |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Whilst I do not have a dog in this fight, my favourite comment on this was from a very effeminate gay man:
"If I fuck a pussy, does that make me straight?"
If it turned him on and he enjoyed it it makes him bi, bit obvious that tbh…
It doesn't make him anything at all, except in your opinion.
A"
Okey dokes, thanks.
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By *bi HaiveMan
over a year ago
Forum Mod Cheeseville, Somerset |
"Whilst I do not have a dog in this fight, my favourite comment on this was from a very effeminate gay man:
"If I fuck a pussy, does that make me straight?"
If it turned him on and he enjoyed it it makes him bi, bit obvious that tbh…
It doesn't make him anything at all, except in your opinion.
A
Okey dokes, thanks.
"
You're welcome.
A single act doesn't define someone.
I drove an F1 car once. It didn't make me a racing driver.
I modelled some clothing once. It didn't make me a model for the rest of my life.
I once voted Tory many, many moons ago. But it didn't last thanks god.
Things change. One experience in your life doesn't alter or label you for the entirety of it.
A
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Whilst I do not have a dog in this fight, my favourite comment on this was from a very effeminate gay man:
"If I fuck a pussy, does that make me straight?"
If it turned him on and he enjoyed it it makes him bi, bit obvious that tbh…
It doesn't make him anything at all, except in your opinion.
A
Okey dokes, thanks.
You're welcome.
A single act doesn't define someone.
I drove an F1 car once. It didn't make me a racing driver.
I modelled some clothing once. It didn't make me a model for the rest of my life.
I once voted Tory many, many moons ago. But it didn't last thanks god.
Things change. One experience in your life doesn't alter or label you for the entirety of it.
A
"
To use your analogies
Someone who murders someone once doesn’t make them a murderer…..
Oh wait…. Thanks |
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By *bi HaiveMan
over a year ago
Forum Mod Cheeseville, Somerset |
"Whilst I do not have a dog in this fight, my favourite comment on this was from a very effeminate gay man:
"If I fuck a pussy, does that make me straight?"
If it turned him on and he enjoyed it it makes him bi, bit obvious that tbh…
It doesn't make him anything at all, except in your opinion.
A
Okey dokes, thanks.
You're welcome.
A single act doesn't define someone.
I drove an F1 car once. It didn't make me a racing driver.
I modelled some clothing once. It didn't make me a model for the rest of my life.
I once voted Tory many, many moons ago. But it didn't last thanks god.
Things change. One experience in your life doesn't alter or label you for the entirety of it.
A
To use your analogies
Someone who murders someone once doesn’t make them a murderer…..
Oh wait…. Thanks "
There are always exceptions, of course.
But (and we could keep this up all day I'm Sure) if we take your approach then it would be impossible for someone who has ever eaten meat in childhood to call themselves a vegetarian in adulthood.
Or someone who's been christened as a child to convert to another religion and call themselves a Muslim/Bhuddist/Jehovahs Witness.
Or if someone once smoked a joint at uni by your logic they'd be a drug user for life.
Life is rarely black and white.
A |
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"I noticed the thread has changed to straight and TV. As I still think there’s some confusion on the two categories
By the way, the difference between TV and TS is generally this:
A TS goes through transition because of gender dysphoria. (This is diagnosed by a specialist psychiatrist who deals with these sex and gender issues)
transition has 3 phases, social transition (so basically telling loved ones, work etc about transitioning and changing documents etc), medical transition (big step…taking cross sex hormones that will change second sex characteristics) and then surgical transition ( getting a vagina, breast augmentation, facial feminisation and so on)
Usually the first 2 steps are needed to be a transsexual (basically when we start messing with biology as hormones are quite something!)
So a TS person lives a life in the gender they identify as. There’s a lot of pressure on passing for trans females, but ultimately, everyone is different and still valid, and transitioning goals are different from person to person.
Transvestitism generally means wearing womens clothing. So the presentation can be very feminine because there’s a dress and make up etc. But the key is it‘s not their true identity. Or if it is, it’s a part of it that comes out in certain moments for different reasons (could be personal, could be for sex etc)
Usually TVs are happy with their gender as male and are happy to let the other side out every now and then.
I can’t speak for all TVs as I’m not one, so correct me if I’m wrong but that’s what I’ve gathered as well from some here on the forum like the lovely Sophie xx "
Do you see any distinction between sex and gender? |
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"I noticed the thread has changed to straight and TV. As I still think there’s some confusion on the two categories
By the way, the difference between TV and TS is generally this:
A TS goes through transition because of gender dysphoria. (This is diagnosed by a specialist psychiatrist who deals with these sex and gender issues)
transition has 3 phases, social transition (so basically telling loved ones, work etc about transitioning and changing documents etc), medical transition (big step…taking cross sex hormones that will change second sex characteristics) and then surgical transition ( getting a vagina, breast augmentation, facial feminisation and so on)
Usually the first 2 steps are needed to be a transsexual (basically when we start messing with biology as hormones are quite something!)
So a TS person lives a life in the gender they identify as. There’s a lot of pressure on passing for trans females, but ultimately, everyone is different and still valid, and transitioning goals are different from person to person.
Transvestitism generally means wearing womens clothing. So the presentation can be very feminine because there’s a dress and make up etc. But the key is it‘s not their true identity. Or if it is, it’s a part of it that comes out in certain moments for different reasons (could be personal, could be for sex etc)
Usually TVs are happy with their gender as male and are happy to let the other side out every now and then.
I can’t speak for all TVs as I’m not one, so correct me if I’m wrong but that’s what I’ve gathered as well from some here on the forum like the lovely Sophie xx "
You are absolutely bang on, i started dressing mainly for sex, now i am starting to enjoy the transformation into Chantelle more and more and abit more the social side of it too and being someone different
don't get me wrong though the main reason still sex for me  .
When not dressed i am very happy as a man and doing pretty much what all the other men do. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Whilst I do not have a dog in this fight, my favourite comment on this was from a very effeminate gay man:
"If I fuck a pussy, does that make me straight?"
If it turned him on and he enjoyed it it makes him bi, bit obvious that tbh…
It doesn't make him anything at all, except in your opinion.
A
Okey dokes, thanks.
You're welcome.
A single act doesn't define someone.
I drove an F1 car once. It didn't make me a racing driver.
I modelled some clothing once. It didn't make me a model for the rest of my life.
I once voted Tory many, many moons ago. But it didn't last thanks god.
Things change. One experience in your life doesn't alter or label you for the entirety of it.
A
To use your analogies
Someone who murders someone once doesn’t make them a murderer…..
Oh wait…. Thanks
There are always exceptions, of course.
But (and we could keep this up all day I'm Sure) if we take your approach then it would be impossible for someone who has ever eaten meat in childhood to call themselves a vegetarian in adulthood.
Or someone who's been christened as a child to convert to another religion and call themselves a Muslim/Bhuddist/Jehovahs Witness.
Or if someone once smoked a joint at uni by your logic they'd be a drug user for life.
Life is rarely black and white.
A"
So what?
Never said it was?
You need to reflect on your own comments you seem to be arguing with yourself.
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"I noticed the thread has changed to straight and TV. As I still think there’s some confusion on the two categories
By the way, the difference between TV and TS is generally this:
A TS goes through transition because of gender dysphoria. (This is diagnosed by a specialist psychiatrist who deals with these sex and gender issues)
transition has 3 phases, social transition (so basically telling loved ones, work etc about transitioning and changing documents etc), medical transition (big step…taking cross sex hormones that will change second sex characteristics) and then surgical transition ( getting a vagina, breast augmentation, facial feminisation and so on)
Usually the first 2 steps are needed to be a transsexual (basically when we start messing with biology as hormones are quite something!)
So a TS person lives a life in the gender they identify as. There’s a lot of pressure on passing for trans females, but ultimately, everyone is different and still valid, and transitioning goals are different from person to person.
Transvestitism generally means wearing womens clothing. So the presentation can be very feminine because there’s a dress and make up etc. But the key is it‘s not their true identity. Or if it is, it’s a part of it that comes out in certain moments for different reasons (could be personal, could be for sex etc)
Usually TVs are happy with their gender as male and are happy to let the other side out every now and then.
I can’t speak for all TVs as I’m not one, so correct me if I’m wrong but that’s what I’ve gathered as well from some here on the forum like the lovely Sophie xx "
All good points, but isn’t this thread more about the men having sex with them - and how they view the TS/TV?
If they have a thing for what THEY see as men in women’s clothing, then no it’s not straight.
If they view a TV (regardless of how the TV actually views themself) as a “woman, or close enough” then it’s still essentially straight (assuming that they’re not also interested in men). |
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"I noticed the thread has changed to straight and TV. As I still think there’s some confusion on the two categories
By the way, the difference between TV and TS is generally this:
A TS goes through transition because of gender dysphoria. (This is diagnosed by a specialist psychiatrist who deals with these sex and gender issues)
transition has 3 phases, social transition (so basically telling loved ones, work etc about transitioning and changing documents etc), medical transition (big step…taking cross sex hormones that will change second sex characteristics) and then surgical transition ( getting a vagina, breast augmentation, facial feminisation and so on)
Usually the first 2 steps are needed to be a transsexual (basically when we start messing with biology as hormones are quite something!)
So a TS person lives a life in the gender they identify as. There’s a lot of pressure on passing for trans females, but ultimately, everyone is different and still valid, and transitioning goals are different from person to person.
Transvestitism generally means wearing womens clothing. So the presentation can be very feminine because there’s a dress and make up etc. But the key is it‘s not their true identity. Or if it is, it’s a part of it that comes out in certain moments for different reasons (could be personal, could be for sex etc)
Usually TVs are happy with their gender as male and are happy to let the other side out every now and then.
I can’t speak for all TVs as I’m not one, so correct me if I’m wrong but that’s what I’ve gathered as well from some here on the forum like the lovely Sophie xx
All good points, but isn’t this thread more about the men having sex with them - and how they view the TS/TV?
If they have a thing for what THEY see as men in women’s clothing, then no it’s not straight.
If they view a TV (regardless of how the TV actually views themself) as a “woman, or close enough” then it’s still essentially straight (assuming that they’re not also interested in men). "
So in your view there is no objective truth? Feelings are all that matters so we can all have our own reality. There used to be a word for that |
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"I noticed the thread has changed to straight and TV. As I still think there’s some confusion on the two categories
By the way, the difference between TV and TS is generally this:
A TS goes through transition because of gender dysphoria. (This is diagnosed by a specialist psychiatrist who deals with these sex and gender issues)
transition has 3 phases, social transition (so basically telling loved ones, work etc about transitioning and changing documents etc), medical transition (big step…taking cross sex hormones that will change second sex characteristics) and then surgical transition ( getting a vagina, breast augmentation, facial feminisation and so on)
Usually the first 2 steps are needed to be a transsexual (basically when we start messing with biology as hormones are quite something!)
So a TS person lives a life in the gender they identify as. There’s a lot of pressure on passing for trans females, but ultimately, everyone is different and still valid, and transitioning goals are different from person to person.
Transvestitism generally means wearing womens clothing. So the presentation can be very feminine because there’s a dress and make up etc. But the key is it‘s not their true identity. Or if it is, it’s a part of it that comes out in certain moments for different reasons (could be personal, could be for sex etc)
Usually TVs are happy with their gender as male and are happy to let the other side out every now and then.
I can’t speak for all TVs as I’m not one, so correct me if I’m wrong but that’s what I’ve gathered as well from some here on the forum like the lovely Sophie xx
All good points, but isn’t this thread more about the men having sex with them - and how they view the TS/TV?
If they have a thing for what THEY see as men in women’s clothing, then no it’s not straight.
If they view a TV (regardless of how the TV actually views themself) as a “woman, or close enough” then it’s still essentially straight (assuming that they’re not also interested in men).
So in your view there is no objective truth? Feelings are all that matters so we can all have our own reality. There used to be a word for that "
Yes, your OWN views and feelings would seem pretty damned important when determining your OWN sexuality. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I noticed the thread has changed to straight and TV. As I still think there’s some confusion on the two categories
By the way, the difference between TV and TS is generally this:
A TS goes through transition because of gender dysphoria. (This is diagnosed by a specialist psychiatrist who deals with these sex and gender issues)
transition has 3 phases, social transition (so basically telling loved ones, work etc about transitioning and changing documents etc), medical transition (big step…taking cross sex hormones that will change second sex characteristics) and then surgical transition ( getting a vagina, breast augmentation, facial feminisation and so on)
Usually the first 2 steps are needed to be a transsexual (basically when we start messing with biology as hormones are quite something!)
So a TS person lives a life in the gender they identify as. There’s a lot of pressure on passing for trans females, but ultimately, everyone is different and still valid, and transitioning goals are different from person to person.
Transvestitism generally means wearing womens clothing. So the presentation can be very feminine because there’s a dress and make up etc. But the key is it‘s not their true identity. Or if it is, it’s a part of it that comes out in certain moments for different reasons (could be personal, could be for sex etc)
Usually TVs are happy with their gender as male and are happy to let the other side out every now and then.
I can’t speak for all TVs as I’m not one, so correct me if I’m wrong but that’s what I’ve gathered as well from some here on the forum like the lovely Sophie xx
All good points, but isn’t this thread more about the men having sex with them - and how they view the TS/TV?
If they have a thing for what THEY see as men in women’s clothing, then no it’s not straight.
If they view a TV (regardless of how the TV actually views themself) as a “woman, or close enough” then it’s still essentially straight (assuming that they’re not also interested in men). "
This is how I see it.
If I objectively view the person in question as still masculine in any way, then good luck on your journey, you have my full support but I'm afraid not attracted to you.
If I objectively view the person as feminine, then I couldn't give a monkeys what's between their legs, I'm attracted and I'd want any pleasure to be mutual.
And just to add that beauty is in the eye of the beholder etc, and sometimes different people will see different levels of femininity etc, and there's nothing wrong with that either, each to their own. |
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By *ammy_xMan
over a year ago
Reading |
I wonder why we try and categorise and put a label on things.
A person is attracted to another person why worry about how it's defined.
Does it put pressure on people to feel they should act or do things a different way?
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