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Social distancing and masks...
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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We have to wear masks inside shops and enclosed spaces. Unless exempt.
We have to stick to 2 metre distancing inside and should outside too.
But, if anyone has ever seen someone smoking or vaping, exhaled breath travels far far further than 2 metres.
So, what if the problem isn't inside? What if its outside, where people take masks off, where people are exercising? Walking behind people running and cycling?
Most people relax outside, no masks, social distancing therefore is wiped out due to how far breath can travel...
Even the most stringent rule followers could easily be spreading it unless they wear a mask at all times outside their house.
Just thinking out loud...
Are the rules good enough? Or are they just in place to help people feel like they have some control over something that is essentially out of anyone's control? |
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I agree with some of your thinking. I feel that if you are able to smell the aftershave, deodorant or perfume from a person as they pass - it is possible that they are too close - maybe?? However, perhaps the dose if it were Corona virus is inadequate?
I disagree with people not maintaining spacing whilst out walking. I would say the vast majority (over 90%) of people do maintain at least 2m in my experience. However, there are exceptions. I have no idea why but they always seem to be middle aged men with dogs???!!! They appear to be very bad mannered and pig ignorant. It is not all men with dogs but when we have to move quite quickly out the path of somebody - guess what - yep - its a bloke with a dog.
I do notice groups of people and people on doorsteps almost every time I go out and they are not safe spacing. |
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"We have to wear masks inside shops and enclosed spaces. Unless exempt.
We have to stick to 2 metre distancing inside and should outside too.
But, if anyone has ever seen someone smoking or vaping, exhaled breath travels far far further than 2 metres.
So, what if the problem isn't inside? What if its outside, where people take masks off, where people are exercising? Walking behind people running and cycling?
Most people relax outside, no masks, social distancing therefore is wiped out due to how far breath can travel...
Even the most stringent rule followers could easily be spreading it unless they wear a mask at all times outside their house.
Just thinking out loud...
Are the rules good enough? Or are they just in place to help people feel like they have some control over something that is essentially out of anyone's control?"
Some of this is covered by Sebastian Rushworth M.D. in his article
Covid-19: New evidence on face masks
Would've shared the link if that were allowed but you should be able to Google that if interested
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By *rman82Man
over a year ago
Manchester |
"We have to wear masks inside shops and enclosed spaces. Unless exempt.
We have to stick to 2 metre distancing inside and should outside too.
But, if anyone has ever seen someone smoking or vaping, exhaled breath travels far far further than 2 metres.
So, what if the problem isn't inside? What if its outside, where people take masks off, where people are exercising? Walking behind people running and cycling?
Most people relax outside, no masks, social distancing therefore is wiped out due to how far breath can travel...
Even the most stringent rule followers could easily be spreading it unless they wear a mask at all times outside their house.
Just thinking out loud...
Are the rules good enough? Or are they just in place to help people feel like they have some control over something that is essentially out of anyone's control?
Some of this is covered by Sebastian Rushworth M.D. in his article
Covid-19: New evidence on face masks
Would've shared the link if that were allowed but you should be able to Google that if interested
"
It’s an interesting read and he is very good on most things. Probably considered ‘fringe’ by some because his points don’t always fit the Mainstream Media narrative. Which is quite sad really. |
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I went into a big Tescos today and over heard this conversation between the door person and a couple about to enter the store 'Hi are you shopping together?'
'Yes we are'
'Are you from the same household?'
'No we are from separate households'
'Oh thats ok then'
After asking I found out 2 people who live together/are married or whatever, have to shop alone. i.e. only one allowed in the store. However 2 people from different households who claim they share a 'bubble' can shop together. if this is not utterly bonkers I dont know what is! |
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I have a low immune system, took long for the reason. Winter of 2019 normal flu and a very very bad cold.
Winter 2020 wearing a mask, though not required it's not just about me. So far I've had 1 flu and 3 colds.
For some strange reason I'm getting them more than I ever have in my life.
Yet they are saying that flu is almost wiped out not sure on colds
It's baffled me completely.
I've not had a covid19 test because when I rang a adviser from the nhs I'm not showing signs of covid
Stay safe nothing is worth the risk, so many gone. |
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"I agree with some of your thinking. I feel that if you are able to smell the aftershave, deodorant or perfume from a person as they pass - it is possible that they are too close - maybe?? However, perhaps the dose if it were Corona virus is inadequate?
I disagree with people not maintaining spacing whilst out walking. I would say the vast majority (over 90%) of people do maintain at least 2m in my experience. However, there are exceptions. I have no idea why but they always seem to be middle aged men with dogs???!!! They appear to be very bad mannered and pig ignorant. It is not all men with dogs but when we have to move quite quickly out the path of somebody - guess what - yep - its a bloke with a dog.
I do notice groups of people and people on doorsteps almost every time I go out and they are not safe spacing."
Yep, and that middle aged bloke out walking the dog is me, I admit it, i will not move 6 feet 6 inches away from anybody to anti social distance, if you want to walk round me because you see me as some disease ridden monster, that's fine by me, that's you choice. I don't care.I do spend most of the time dog walking in the woods and fields, mainly to keep away from the ignorant people who think 6 feet 6 inches will save their life. I just hope no one ever gets knocked over stepping into the road to get 6 feet 6 inches away from whoever they see as a disease ridden monster. because if they do, how the hell do you pick them up ?
PS, for the record i am not bad mannered or pig ignorant, that's how i see you
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By *rman82Man
over a year ago
Manchester |
"I have a low immune system, took long for the reason. Winter of 2019 normal flu and a very very bad cold.
Winter 2020 wearing a mask, though not required it's not just about me. So far I've had 1 flu and 3 colds.
For some strange reason I'm getting them more than I ever have in my life.
Yet they are saying that flu is almost wiped out not sure on colds
It's baffled me completely.
I've not had a covid19 test because when I rang a adviser from the nhs I'm not showing signs of covid
Stay safe nothing is worth the risk, so many gone. "
Maybe the mask is causing you to get them more than ever? And it seems strange that you had 3 colds and the flu but the doctor said no Covid symptoms? The Covid symptoms are pretty extensive.
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By *ady LickWoman
over a year ago
Northampton Somewhere |
"I agree with some of your thinking. I feel that if you are able to smell the aftershave, deodorant or perfume from a person as they pass - it is possible that they are too close - maybe?? However, perhaps the dose if it were Corona virus is inadequate?
I disagree with people not maintaining spacing whilst out walking. I would say the vast majority (over 90%) of people do maintain at least 2m in my experience. However, there are exceptions. I have no idea why but they always seem to be middle aged men with dogs???!!! They appear to be very bad mannered and pig ignorant. It is not all men with dogs but when we have to move quite quickly out the path of somebody - guess what - yep - its a bloke with a dog.
I do notice groups of people and people on doorsteps almost every time I go out and they are not safe spacing.
Yep, and that middle aged bloke out walking the dog is me, I admit it, i will not move 6 feet 6 inches away from anybody to anti social distance, if you want to walk round me because you see me as some disease ridden monster, that's fine by me, that's you choice. I don't care.I do spend most of the time dog walking in the woods and fields, mainly to keep away from the ignorant people who think 6 feet 6 inches will save their life. I just hope no one ever gets knocked over stepping into the road to get 6 feet 6 inches away from whoever they see as a disease ridden monster. because if they do, how the hell do you pick them up ?
PS, for the record i am not bad mannered or pig ignorant, that's how i see you
"
Well you should care.
Everyone needs to do their bit.
At the beginning of all this a man around your age approached me in a supermarket and told me I was wierd for wearing a mask amongst other stuff.
Went out for my walk earlier and there were so many joggers out. I crossed over every time. |
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A reasonable first start was made.
People are still supposed to keep a distance outdoors and not to gather. Ventilation inside and out dilutes the concentration of virus particles. They will travel indoors or out but the quantity of the virus is diffused and it remains viable for quite some time. It's the reason that only 1 person from a household should be shopping etc, as several people living together will provide multiples of the single person shed viral load when together, as they are much more likely to be infected together.
If you notice places with groups of people together, avoid using them. They are much more dangerous than a person exhaling outdoors.
The Kent variant potentially needs less of the virus to be picked up, to cause an infection. This is a greater requirement for us to evaluate what the requirements for safety should be. |
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"I agree with some of your thinking. I feel that if you are able to smell the aftershave, deodorant or perfume from a person as they pass - it is possible that they are too close - maybe?? However, perhaps the dose if it were Corona virus is inadequate?
I disagree with people not maintaining spacing whilst out walking. I would say the vast majority (over 90%) of people do maintain at least 2m in my experience. However, there are exceptions. I have no idea why but they always seem to be middle aged men with dogs???!!! They appear to be very bad mannered and pig ignorant. It is not all men with dogs but when we have to move quite quickly out the path of somebody - guess what - yep - its a bloke with a dog.
I do notice groups of people and people on doorsteps almost every time I go out and they are not safe spacing.
Yep, and that middle aged bloke out walking the dog is me, I admit it, i will not move 6 feet 6 inches away from anybody to anti social distance, if you want to walk round me because you see me as some disease ridden monster, that's fine by me, that's you choice. I don't care.I do spend most of the time dog walking in the woods and fields, mainly to keep away from the ignorant people who think 6 feet 6 inches will save their life. I just hope no one ever gets knocked over stepping into the road to get 6 feet 6 inches away from whoever they see as a disease ridden monster. because if they do, how the hell do you pick them up ?
PS, for the record i am not bad mannered or pig ignorant, that's how i see you
"
I walk my dog and sometimes meet a couple out walking they jump out my way as if I am a monster.
Yet they went on holiday to Turkey and Spain when you are advised to stay home I live myself and only time I see other people is when am out a walk with the dog but these clowns go on holiday and think they are OK but brag about been two holidays |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"I agree with some of your thinking. I feel that if you are able to smell the aftershave, deodorant or perfume from a person as they pass - it is possible that they are too close - maybe?? However, perhaps the dose if it were Corona virus is inadequate?
I disagree with people not maintaining spacing whilst out walking. I would say the vast majority (over 90%) of people do maintain at least 2m in my experience. However, there are exceptions. I have no idea why but they always seem to be middle aged men with dogs???!!! They appear to be very bad mannered and pig ignorant. It is not all men with dogs but when we have to move quite quickly out the path of somebody - guess what - yep - its a bloke with a dog.
I do notice groups of people and people on doorsteps almost every time I go out and they are not safe spacing.
Yep, and that middle aged bloke out walking the dog is me, I admit it, i will not move 6 feet 6 inches away from anybody to anti social distance, if you want to walk round me because you see me as some disease ridden monster, that's fine by me, that's you choice. I don't care.I do spend most of the time dog walking in the woods and fields, mainly to keep away from the ignorant people who think 6 feet 6 inches will save their life. I just hope no one ever gets knocked over stepping into the road to get 6 feet 6 inches away from whoever they see as a disease ridden monster. because if they do, how the hell do you pick them up ?
PS, for the record i am not bad mannered or pig ignorant, that's how i see you
Well you should care.
Everyone needs to do their bit.
At the beginning of all this a man around your age approached me in a supermarket and told me I was wierd for wearing a mask amongst other stuff.
Went out for my walk earlier and there were so many joggers out. I crossed over every time. "
Agree. What's wrong with being considerate to others? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"We have to wear masks inside shops and enclosed spaces. Unless exempt.
We have to stick to 2 metre distancing inside and should outside too.
But, if anyone has ever seen someone smoking or vaping, exhaled breath travels far far further than 2 metres.
So, what if the problem isn't inside? What if its outside, where people take masks off, where people are exercising? Walking behind people running and cycling?
Most people relax outside, no masks, social distancing therefore is wiped out due to how far breath can travel...
Even the most stringent rule followers could easily be spreading it unless they wear a mask at all times outside their house.
Just thinking out loud...
Are the rules good enough? Or are they just in place to help people feel like they have some control over something that is essentially out of anyone's control?"
I always thought that there are way too many comfortable being in a crowd outside without a mask. Because the government never really said anything about it , but weirdly enough you see other countries who impose the face mask outside as well. So...
I do mostly wear a face mask outside when I see that bumping into people is unavoidable, but in a crowded place like London, it really makes sense that maybe not being able to stay distant enough outside, there might be infections going.
Before they started restricting mid December , I’ve been to Oxford street a few times and the stream of people (80% with no mask on)!! I kept mine on and only took it off in quiet streets... |
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By *ocbigMan
over a year ago
Birmingham |
Can I just say the idea of masks & distancing is to prevent transmission, as in I wear a mask to lessen the chance of me infecting you, I move away to lessen the chance of me infecting you, not because I think you are some kind of rolling ball of infection trying to kill me. Many posts on here seem to be coming from that angle, maybe it’s me & I accept that the end result is the same, but me protecting you by moving & distancing is a much nicer thought than me running away from you because you may infect me. |
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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago
Brighton |
I thought by now people would understand...
Wearing a mask helps protect others not me. It helps contain the droplets in our breath. If everyone wears them it contains more and reduces the volume of airborne droplets (but doesn’t eradicate them).
Being outside the airflow/wind is able to better disperse (and thin out) the expelled breath.
That reduces the potential viral load you may breath in.
That is why it IS safer outside than inside where air doesn’t disperse it just continues circulating in rooms. That is why the major places causing infection are workplaces and homes, not parks or streets. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
"A reasonable first start was made.
People are still supposed to keep a distance outdoors and not to gather. Ventilation inside and out dilutes the concentration of virus particles. They will travel indoors or out but the quantity of the virus is diffused and it remains viable for quite some time. It's the reason that only 1 person from a household should be shopping etc, as several people living together will provide multiples of the single person shed viral load when together, as they are much more likely to be infected together.
If you notice places with groups of people together, avoid using them. They are much more dangerous than a person exhaling outdoors.
The Kent variant potentially needs less of the virus to be picked up, to cause an infection. This is a greater requirement for us to evaluate what the requirements for safety should be. "
Thank you for your reply, it helped put a couple of puzzle pieces in place! |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
"I thought by now people would understand...
Wearing a mask helps protect others not me. It helps contain the droplets in our breath. If everyone wears them it contains more and reduces the volume of airborne droplets (but doesn’t eradicate them).
Being outside the airflow/wind is able to better disperse (and thin out) the expelled breath.
That reduces the potential viral load you may breath in.
That is why it IS safer outside than inside where air doesn’t disperse it just continues circulating in rooms. That is why the major places causing infection are workplaces and homes, not parks or streets."
The one problem I see with that is that if you look at smokers and vapers, what they are breathing out doesn't really thin out, it moves like a small cloud, and travels far. Of course this happening indoors would be far more potent, but in a place that has any heavier movement of people outside, where people are at most 2 metres apart (most of the time not even that), how diluted or thinned out would somebody's breath be in the seconds it takes to travel that distance?
Don't get me wrong, I'm in no way advocating for stricter rules, I'm just wondering if a bigger portion of blame is being put on people that are indoors, workers etc, than is actually deserved, and if it is, and a higher percentage than we think is from outdoor movement, when people are more relaxed about what they do, is this situation going to keep on reoccurring with different strains and reactions to numbers of infections taking off?
A thing that sticks with me is that outdoors most don't wear masks, plus anywhere that virus hits is potentially dangerous, so if the breath from on person travels and the next person walks through it, wouldn't they be covered in it? Couldn't it happily sit on their exposed skin and clothing? That's not just in the wind dispersing. And the distance travelled in most cases wouildnt give very much time for viral load to drop? |
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"Can I just say the idea of masks & distancing is to prevent transmission, as in I wear a mask to lessen the chance of me infecting you, I move away to lessen the chance of me infecting you, not because I think you are some kind of rolling ball of infection trying to kill me. Many posts on here seem to be coming from that angle, maybe it’s me & I accept that the end result is the same, but me protecting you by moving & distancing is a much nicer thought than me running away from you because you may infect me."
Hopefully it goes both ways. I protect you, you protect me.
I've been saying since March "it's not you, it's everyone". Nothing personal but I neither want to give you nor catch the thing, and as a fellow human you're a risk (from and to me). |
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By *ocbigMan
over a year ago
Birmingham |
"Can I just say the idea of masks & distancing is to prevent transmission, as in I wear a mask to lessen the chance of me infecting you, I move away to lessen the chance of me infecting you, not because I think you are some kind of rolling ball of infection trying to kill me. Many posts on here seem to be coming from that angle, maybe it’s me & I accept that the end result is the same, but me protecting you by moving & distancing is a much nicer thought than me running away from you because you may infect me.
Hopefully it goes both ways. I protect you, you protect me.
I've been saying since March "it's not you, it's everyone". Nothing personal but I neither want to give you nor catch the thing, and as a fellow human you're a risk (from and to me)."
Fully agree, I am one of the accursed runners & am aware I am perceived as a bigger risk, but I am happy to stop & let people pass in narrow sections, after all it isn’t as if that pause cost me the world record/gold medal, I am mostly off road & do not continue if a park is too busy, I always thank people if they step aside for me...it really is simply common courtesy virus or not. |
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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago
Brighton |
"I thought by now people would understand...
Wearing a mask helps protect others not me. It helps contain the droplets in our breath. If everyone wears them it contains more and reduces the volume of airborne droplets (but doesn’t eradicate them).
Being outside the airflow/wind is able to better disperse (and thin out) the expelled breath.
That reduces the potential viral load you may breath in.
That is why it IS safer outside than inside where air doesn’t disperse it just continues circulating in rooms. That is why the major places causing infection are workplaces and homes, not parks or streets.
The one problem I see with that is that if you look at smokers and vapers, what they are breathing out doesn't really thin out, it moves like a small cloud, and travels far. Of course this happening indoors would be far more potent, but in a place that has any heavier movement of people outside, where people are at most 2 metres apart (most of the time not even that), how diluted or thinned out would somebody's breath be in the seconds it takes to travel that distance?
Don't get me wrong, I'm in no way advocating for stricter rules, I'm just wondering if a bigger portion of blame is being put on people that are indoors, workers etc, than is actually deserved, and if it is, and a higher percentage than we think is from outdoor movement, when people are more relaxed about what they do, is this situation going to keep on reoccurring with different strains and reactions to numbers of infections taking off?
A thing that sticks with me is that outdoors most don't wear masks, plus anywhere that virus hits is potentially dangerous, so if the breath from on person travels and the next person walks through it, wouldn't they be covered in it? Couldn't it happily sit on their exposed skin and clothing? That's not just in the wind dispersing. And the distance travelled in most cases wouildnt give very much time for viral load to drop? "
I am sure there are cleverer ppl on here with actual scientific knowledge but based on a mix of widely reading (for more years than I like) and a dose of common sense and physics...
I would be surprised if outside was as dangerous as inside. For many reasons inc...
1. Airflow does disperse (though your point on smokers etc is right).
2. Inside the droplets settle on surfaces and we touch them.
3. Unless standing closely face-to-face outside then you won’t be repeatedly rebreathing the same air.
4. Somebody walking/running past you is only exposing you briefly to their breath whereas standing/sitting having a conversation (especially inside) is repeated exposure to many breaths.
One thing is clear - it is exposure to a higher viral load that makes people get more seriously ill.
Made up numbers but say each breath of an infected person had 10 viruses in it then:
1. Outside the air dilutes this to 5
2. Someone walking past exposes you to one breath so you get 5 (assuming you breathe in their whole breath)
3. Someone inside exposes you to 10 undiluted breaths = 100
Standing around in groups outside chatting and not keeping at least 2m does increase exposure but likely still not as dangerous as doing that inside. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"I thought by now people would understand...
Wearing a mask helps protect others not me. It helps contain the droplets in our breath. If everyone wears them it contains more and reduces the volume of airborne droplets (but doesn’t eradicate them).
Being outside the airflow/wind is able to better disperse (and thin out) the expelled breath.
That reduces the potential viral load you may breath in.
That is why it IS safer outside than inside where air doesn’t disperse it just continues circulating in rooms. That is why the major places causing infection are workplaces and homes, not parks or streets.
The one problem I see with that is that if you look at smokers and vapers, what they are breathing out doesn't really thin out, it moves like a small cloud, and travels far. Of course this happening indoors would be far more potent, but in a place that has any heavier movement of people outside, where people are at most 2 metres apart (most of the time not even that), how diluted or thinned out would somebody's breath be in the seconds it takes to travel that distance?
Don't get me wrong, I'm in no way advocating for stricter rules, I'm just wondering if a bigger portion of blame is being put on people that are indoors, workers etc, than is actually deserved, and if it is, and a higher percentage than we think is from outdoor movement, when people are more relaxed about what they do, is this situation going to keep on reoccurring with different strains and reactions to numbers of infections taking off?
A thing that sticks with me is that outdoors most don't wear masks, plus anywhere that virus hits is potentially dangerous, so if the breath from on person travels and the next person walks through it, wouldn't they be covered in it? Couldn't it happily sit on their exposed skin and clothing? That's not just in the wind dispersing. And the distance travelled in most cases wouildnt give very much time for viral load to drop?
I am sure there are cleverer ppl on here with actual scientific knowledge but based on a mix of widely reading (for more years than I like) and a dose of common sense and physics...
I would be surprised if outside was as dangerous as inside. For many reasons inc...
1. Airflow does disperse (though your point on smokers etc is right).
2. Inside the droplets settle on surfaces and we touch them.
3. Unless standing closely face-to-face outside then you won’t be repeatedly rebreathing the same air.
4. Somebody walking/running past you is only exposing you briefly to their breath whereas standing/sitting having a conversation (especially inside) is repeated exposure to many breaths.
One thing is clear - it is exposure to a higher viral load that makes people get more seriously ill.
Made up numbers but say each breath of an infected person had 10 viruses in it then:
1. Outside the air dilutes this to 5
2. Someone walking past exposes you to one breath so you get 5 (assuming you breathe in their whole breath)
3. Someone inside exposes you to 10 undiluted breaths = 100
Standing around in groups outside chatting and not keeping at least 2m does increase exposure but likely still not as dangerous as doing that inside."
Exactly, but still dangerous if none wears a mask outside, maybe the percentage of infection is small, but not 0% ... even if it’s 10%...
hmmm
Also droplets don’t dissolve as quickly or as easy as in the summer heat in the Mediterranean were if you talked, they would vaporise soon as they come out ur mouth.
Apparently some words can project these droplets a few meters away, or so I’ve read studies about it. |
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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago
Brighton |
The “projection” of breath is one reason for concerts and singing being stopped (and big crowds).
Runners obviously breathe heavier but as they pass a walker/stander they expose you to only a few breaths.
In winter the droplets on outside surfaces are more likely to be washed away by rain/snow.
Similarly rain in the air will “wash” or “push” down droplets in the air.
The main reason for winter increase is more people indoors with poorer ventilation.
Nothing in life is 0% risk but the combination of actions cumulatively mitigate risk. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"The “projection” of breath is one reason for concerts and singing being stopped (and big crowds).
Runners obviously breathe heavier but as they pass a walker/stander they expose you to only a few breaths.
In winter the droplets on outside surfaces are more likely to be washed away by rain/snow.
Similarly rain in the air will “wash” or “push” down droplets in the air.
The main reason for winter increase is more people indoors with poorer ventilation.
Nothing in life is 0% risk but the combination of actions cumulatively mitigate risk."
I pretty much hold my breath when I run past people now, and look the other way. Only way to avoid the dirty looks.
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"I agree with some of your thinking. I feel that if you are able to smell the aftershave, deodorant or perfume from a person as they pass - it is possible that they are too close - maybe?? However, perhaps the dose if it were Corona virus is inadequate?
I disagree with people not maintaining spacing whilst out walking. I would say the vast majority (over 90%) of people do maintain at least 2m in my experience. However, there are exceptions. I have no idea why but they always seem to be middle aged men with dogs???!!! They appear to be very bad mannered and pig ignorant. It is not all men with dogs but when we have to move quite quickly out the path of somebody - guess what - yep - its a bloke with a dog.
I do notice groups of people and people on doorsteps almost every time I go out and they are not safe spacing.
Yep, and that middle aged bloke out walking the dog is me, I admit it, i will not move 6 feet 6 inches away from anybody to anti social distance, if you want to walk round me because you see me as some disease ridden monster, that's fine by me, that's you choice. I don't care.I do spend most of the time dog walking in the woods and fields, mainly to keep away from the ignorant people who think 6 feet 6 inches will save their life. I just hope no one ever gets knocked over stepping into the road to get 6 feet 6 inches away from whoever they see as a disease ridden monster. because if they do, how the hell do you pick them up ?
PS, for the record i am not bad mannered or pig ignorant, that's how i see you
"
And this is why we are having problems. No more needs to be said. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I love wearing my mask in cold weather. Happily wear one to walk the dogs, and it's useful on narrow roads and paths where we pass others closer than I would like.
I also see many older people wearing them to walk in the woods.
I don't think it should be mandatory outdoors, but I'm glad to see that some people do it anyway. |
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I run daily. I try and avoid people and most others do the same. I will move onto the road to avoid anyone in my path if I have to, especially anyone elderly who might struggle to change direction.
I don't expect others to move for me. Its common courtesy in my opinion to give people ample space. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I agree with some of your thinking. I feel that if you are able to smell the aftershave, deodorant or perfume from a person as they pass - it is possible that they are too close - maybe?? However, perhaps the dose if it were Corona virus is inadequate?
I disagree with people not maintaining spacing whilst out walking. I would say the vast majority (over 90%) of people do maintain at least 2m in my experience. However, there are exceptions. I have no idea why but they always seem to be middle aged men with dogs???!!! They appear to be very bad mannered and pig ignorant. It is not all men with dogs but when we have to move quite quickly out the path of somebody - guess what - yep - its a bloke with a dog.
I do notice groups of people and people on doorsteps almost every time I go out and they are not safe spacing.
Yep, and that middle aged bloke out walking the dog is me, I admit it, i will not move 6 feet 6 inches away from anybody to anti social distance, if you want to walk round me because you see me as some disease ridden monster, that's fine by me, that's you choice. I don't care.I do spend most of the time dog walking in the woods and fields, mainly to keep away from the ignorant people who think 6 feet 6 inches will save their life. I just hope no one ever gets knocked over stepping into the road to get 6 feet 6 inches away from whoever they see as a disease ridden monster. because if they do, how the hell do you pick them up ?
PS, for the record i am not bad mannered or pig ignorant, that's how i see you
And this is why we are having problems. No more needs to be said."
 . Incredible how so many ranters on here see all the problems as being somebody else’s fault. The man walking the dog is in my way. He isn’t staying far enough away from me. If you feel so sure that anyone even for a second who is too close to you is going to kill you then simple. Stay out of peoples way. Actually try being responsible for your own safety . Ever thought of that ???? |
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" Incredible how so many ranters on here see all the problems as being somebody else’s fault. The man walking the dog is in my way. He isn’t staying far enough away from me. If you feel so sure that anyone even for a second who is too close to you is going to kill you then simple. Stay out of peoples way. Actually try being responsible for your own safety . Ever thought of that ???? "
Sure have
It's why I leave the apartment once a week to buy groceries (can't get a delivery slot), and maybe twice more to check the mail and take the bin out.
Some of us are doing our bit  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I think when you put it into the context of this virus having the possibility of mutating beyond the reach of a vaccine, to be infinitely more infectious and dangerous to all ages and to affect prenatal babies as well as young children, wearing a mask and social distancing is not too hard. |
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"I think when you put it into the context of this virus having the possibility of mutating beyond the reach of a vaccine, to be infinitely more infectious and dangerous to all ages and to affect prenatal babies as well as young children, wearing a mask and social distancing is not too hard. "
I don't know how far mutation can go, but things are not in a good place at the moment, it would seem.
We need to look to ourselves and what we can do as individuals.
We also need to ask if government policies are sufficient to protect us all. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I agree with some of your thinking. I feel that if you are able to smell the aftershave, deodorant or perfume from a person as they pass - it is possible that they are too close - maybe?? However, perhaps the dose if it were Corona virus is inadequate?
I disagree with people not maintaining spacing whilst out walking. I would say the vast majority (over 90%) of people do maintain at least 2m in my experience. However, there are exceptions. I have no idea why but they always seem to be middle aged men with dogs???!!! They appear to be very bad mannered and pig ignorant. It is not all men with dogs but when we have to move quite quickly out the path of somebody - guess what - yep - its a bloke with a dog.
I do notice groups of people and people on doorsteps almost every time I go out and they are not safe spacing.
Yep, and that middle aged bloke out walking the dog is me, I admit it, i will not move 6 feet 6 inches away from anybody to anti social distance, if you want to walk round me because you see me as some disease ridden monster, that's fine by me, that's you choice. I don't care.I do spend most of the time dog walking in the woods and fields, mainly to keep away from the ignorant people who think 6 feet 6 inches will save their life. I just hope no one ever gets knocked over stepping into the road to get 6 feet 6 inches away from whoever they see as a disease ridden monster. because if they do, how the hell do you pick them up ?
PS, for the record i am not bad mannered or pig ignorant, that's how i see you
And this is why we are having problems. No more needs to be said. . Incredible how so many ranters on here see all the problems as being somebody else’s fault. The man walking the dog is in my way. He isn’t staying far enough away from me. If you feel so sure that anyone even for a second who is too close to you is going to kill you then simple. Stay out of peoples way. Actually try being responsible for your own safety . Ever thought of that ???? "
Yeah but it's the government's fault............  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I agree with some of your thinking. I feel that if you are able to smell the aftershave, deodorant or perfume from a person as they pass - it is possible that they are too close - maybe?? However, perhaps the dose if it were Corona virus is inadequate?
I disagree with people not maintaining spacing whilst out walking. I would say the vast majority (over 90%) of people do maintain at least 2m in my experience. However, there are exceptions. I have no idea why but they always seem to be middle aged men with dogs???!!! They appear to be very bad mannered and pig ignorant. It is not all men with dogs but when we have to move quite quickly out the path of somebody - guess what - yep - its a bloke with a dog.
I do notice groups of people and people on doorsteps almost every time I go out and they are not safe spacing.
Yep, and that middle aged bloke out walking the dog is me, I admit it, i will not move 6 feet 6 inches away from anybody to anti social distance, if you want to walk round me because you see me as some disease ridden monster, that's fine by me, that's you choice. I don't care.I do spend most of the time dog walking in the woods and fields, mainly to keep away from the ignorant people who think 6 feet 6 inches will save their life. I just hope no one ever gets knocked over stepping into the road to get 6 feet 6 inches away from whoever they see as a disease ridden monster. because if they do, how the hell do you pick them up ?
PS, for the record i am not bad mannered or pig ignorant, that's how i see you
And this is why we are having problems. No more needs to be said. . Incredible how so many ranters on here see all the problems as being somebody else’s fault. The man walking the dog is in my way. He isn’t staying far enough away from me. If you feel so sure that anyone even for a second who is too close to you is going to kill you then simple. Stay out of peoples way. Actually try being responsible for your own safety . Ever thought of that ????
Yeah but it's the government's fault............ "
. Yes exactly, to all the simpletons and ranters who need the government to run their lives for them. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I think most of them just want leadership.
What they don’t want are rules being then set then almost immediately broken by those who dictated them. Don’t travel- but Durham is all right. Don’t go to other countries- but the PM is ok to go. Don’t take risks with infected areas- but it’s ok for the PM to visit a factory that had confirmed new cases in January.....it’s almost as though they are wanting herd infection and old and people with comorbidities people to die.....Now.... what would be the point of that? Money perchance? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I thought by now people would understand...
Wearing a mask helps protect others not me. It helps contain the droplets in our breath. If everyone wears them it contains more and reduces the volume of airborne droplets (but doesn’t eradicate them).
Being outside the airflow/wind is able to better disperse (and thin out) the expelled breath.
That reduces the potential viral load you may breath in.
That is why it IS safer outside than inside where air doesn’t disperse it just continues circulating in rooms. That is why the major places causing infection are workplaces and homes, not parks or streets.
The one problem I see with that is that if you look at smokers and vapers, what they are breathing out doesn't really thin out, it moves like a small cloud, and travels far. Of course this happening indoors would be far more potent, but in a place that has any heavier movement of people outside, where people are at most 2 metres apart (most of the time not even that), how diluted or thinned out would somebody's breath be in the seconds it takes to travel that distance?
Don't get me wrong, I'm in no way advocating for stricter rules, I'm just wondering if a bigger portion of blame is being put on people that are indoors, workers etc, than is actually deserved, and if it is, and a higher percentage than we think is from outdoor movement, when people are more relaxed about what they do, is this situation going to keep on reoccurring with different strains and reactions to numbers of infections taking off?
A thing that sticks with me is that outdoors most don't wear masks, plus anywhere that virus hits is potentially dangerous, so if the breath from on person travels and the next person walks through it, wouldn't they be covered in it? Couldn't it happily sit on their exposed skin and clothing? That's not just in the wind dispersing. And the distance travelled in most cases wouildnt give very much time for viral load to drop?
I am sure there are cleverer ppl on here with actual scientific knowledge but based on a mix of widely reading (for more years than I like) and a dose of common sense and physics...
I would be surprised if outside was as dangerous as inside. For many reasons inc...
1. Airflow does disperse (though your point on smokers etc is right).
2. Inside the droplets settle on surfaces and we touch them.
3. Unless standing closely face-to-face outside then you won’t be repeatedly rebreathing the same air.
4. Somebody walking/running past you is only exposing you briefly to their breath whereas standing/sitting having a conversation (especially inside) is repeated exposure to many breaths.
One thing is clear - it is exposure to a higher viral load that makes people get more seriously ill.
Made up numbers but say each breath of an infected person had 10 viruses in it then:
1. Outside the air dilutes this to 5
2. Someone walking past exposes you to one breath so you get 5 (assuming you breathe in their whole breath)
3. Someone inside exposes you to 10 undiluted breaths = 100
Standing around in groups outside chatting and not keeping at least 2m does increase exposure but likely still not as dangerous as doing that inside.
Exactly, but still dangerous if none wears a mask outside, maybe the percentage of infection is small, but not 0% ... even if it’s 10%...
hmmm
Also droplets don’t dissolve as quickly or as easy as in the summer heat in the Mediterranean were if you talked, they would vaporise soon as they come out ur mouth.
Apparently some words can project these droplets a few meters away, or so I’ve read studies about it. "
Yes, 'Chris Whitty' had something to say about the spread by using some words (sorry mods if I'm breaking a rule with this link) ... https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=931753724026961&id=195770143786043.  |
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"I agree with some of your thinking. I feel that if you are able to smell the aftershave, deodorant or perfume from a person as they pass - it is possible that they are too close - maybe?? However, perhaps the dose if it were Corona virus is inadequate?
I disagree with people not maintaining spacing whilst out walking. I would say the vast majority (over 90%) of people do maintain at least 2m in my experience. However, there are exceptions. I have no idea why but they always seem to be middle aged men with dogs???!!! They appear to be very bad mannered and pig ignorant. It is not all men with dogs but when we have to move quite quickly out the path of somebody - guess what - yep - its a bloke with a dog.
I do notice groups of people and people on doorsteps almost every time I go out and they are not safe spacing.
Yep, and that middle aged bloke out walking the dog is me, I admit it, i will not move 6 feet 6 inches away from anybody to anti social distance, if you want to walk round me because you see me as some disease ridden monster, that's fine by me, that's you choice. I don't care.I do spend most of the time dog walking in the woods and fields, mainly to keep away from the ignorant people who think 6 feet 6 inches will save their life. I just hope no one ever gets knocked over stepping into the road to get 6 feet 6 inches away from whoever they see as a disease ridden monster. because if they do, how the hell do you pick them up ?
PS, for the record i am not bad mannered or pig ignorant, that's how i see you
And this is why we are having problems. No more needs to be said. . Incredible how so many ranters on here see all the problems as being somebody else’s fault. The man walking the dog is in my way. He isn’t staying far enough away from me. If you feel so sure that anyone even for a second who is too close to you is going to kill you then simple. Stay out of peoples way. Actually try being responsible for your own safety . Ever thought of that ???? "
No you are wrong. We regularly walk along a road with one pavement and there is an unwritten rule that 90% of all people with respect stick to. That is that if you are walking towards the traffic, you step out into the road when it is safe because it is easy to see and judge the traffic. When you walk in the other direction people step out for you.
This works perfectly unless you are a middle aged man with a dog for some reason, they don't have any respect for anybody. It isn't all middle aged men but it is a high number. |
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"I run daily. I try and avoid people and most others do the same. I will move onto the road to avoid anyone in my path if I have to, especially anyone elderly who might struggle to change direction.
I don't expect others to move for me. Its common courtesy in my opinion to give people ample space."
Yep good for you and you are not alone. I'd say 90% of people do the same but we all know how it is i.e., There are about 10% - the idiots - that aren't as thoughtful as the rest of us. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I went into a big Tescos today and over heard this conversation between the door person and a couple about to enter the store 'Hi are you shopping together?'
'Yes we are'
'Are you from the same household?'
'No we are from separate households'
'Oh thats ok then'
After asking I found out 2 people who live together/are married or whatever, have to shop alone. i.e. only one allowed in the store. However 2 people from different households who claim they share a 'bubble' can shop together. if this is not utterly bonkers I dont know what is! "
I guess it's about if it's necessary. Why have two people from same household go out shopping together? It's about restricting movement and only doing necessary trips so I understand their logic.
Two going out to together from same house doubles the risk of being it back into the same house. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I agree with some of your thinking. I feel that if you are able to smell the aftershave, deodorant or perfume from a person as they pass - it is possible that they are too close - maybe?? However, perhaps the dose if it were Corona virus is inadequate?
I disagree with people not maintaining spacing whilst out walking. I would say the vast majority (over 90%) of people do maintain at least 2m in my experience. However, there are exceptions. I have no idea why but they always seem to be middle aged men with dogs???!!! They appear to be very bad mannered and pig ignorant. It is not all men with dogs but when we have to move quite quickly out the path of somebody - guess what - yep - its a bloke with a dog.
I do notice groups of people and people on doorsteps almost every time I go out and they are not safe spacing.
Yep, and that middle aged bloke out walking the dog is me, I admit it, i will not move 6 feet 6 inches away from anybody to anti social distance, if you want to walk round me because you see me as some disease ridden monster, that's fine by me, that's you choice. I don't care.I do spend most of the time dog walking in the woods and fields, mainly to keep away from the ignorant people who think 6 feet 6 inches will save their life. I just hope no one ever gets knocked over stepping into the road to get 6 feet 6 inches away from whoever they see as a disease ridden monster. because if they do, how the hell do you pick them up ?
PS, for the record i am not bad mannered or pig ignorant, that's how i see you
And this is why we are having problems. No more needs to be said. . Incredible how so many ranters on here see all the problems as being somebody else’s fault. The man walking the dog is in my way. He isn’t staying far enough away from me. If you feel so sure that anyone even for a second who is too close to you is going to kill you then simple. Stay out of peoples way. Actually try being responsible for your own safety . Ever thought of that ????
No you are wrong. We regularly walk along a road with one pavement and there is an unwritten rule that 90% of all people with respect stick to. That is that if you are walking towards the traffic, you step out into the road when it is safe because it is easy to see and judge the traffic. When you walk in the other direction people step out for you.
This works perfectly unless you are a middle aged man with a dog for some reason, they don't have any respect for anybody. It isn't all middle aged men but it is a high number."
I agree.
It's common decency to give people space.
People are trying to do the right thing yet some feel the need to be entitled, I find it shocking that someone wouldn't move out of somebody's way especially if that person is elderly or disabled simply because they don't believe in the virus. I don't think it is about expecting people to move out of your way I just think it is about being courteous and a decent human being. |
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