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What are we entitled to?
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What do we actually owe other people?
Ignoring the premise that fab is like a pub. (It's not. Someone approaching me on here is more likely to get a response than someone intruding on my social time in a public place. I will quite happily blank someone who's inserting themselves in my personal space without invitation in person.)
Are we obliged to acknowledge everyone who shows an interest just because they have an interest?
Are other humans, regardless of context or circumstance, always entitled to at least a smidge of your time and attention, solely on the basis that they want it?
Discuss 💜 |
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I'd say you're not entitled to have every message you send be acknowledged. People live lives outside of this app. People get flooded with messages. It happens. Just don't take it personally.
I feel you're entitled to a base level of respect. No one should be going out of their way to put others down. At least unprovoked anyway. If they're already being rude or disrespectful, that's different |
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"
Are we obliged to acknowledge everyone who shows an interest just because they have an interest?
Are other humans, regardless of context or circumstance, always entitled to at least a smidge of your time and attention, solely on the basis that they want it?
"
Via this site? No.
When out & about I’d say it’s polite to politely say no or the equivalent at least. So that would constitute a smidgen of my time I guess  |
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I don't think we owe any unsolicited attention anything. Neither should we expect anything. I think everyone's time is precious and we should respect that. So when we cast our net out and getting nothing we should be OK with that (even if we are a little disappointed). I also think the same of when people have passed a little basic interaction.
However I think once things progress to arranging a meet that changes things (based on the principle of people's time being precious again). We still don't owe anyone a meet and it's OK to change our minds or get cold feet. However if people have doubts or potential problems they should say at the earliest possibility. Even if it's an hour before. At this stage ghosting and going to ground without explanation is totally out of order.
Mr |
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"Via this site? No.
When out & about I’d say it’s polite to politely say no or the equivalent at least. So that would constitute a smidgen of my time I guess "
See, I'm the other way. Out and about I only politely acknowledge if I think that not doing so would create a threat to mine or someone else's safety.
At least on here they have a reason to think it's appropriate to approach. At a club I'll acknowledge everyone who speaks to me like a human. But on the street or shopping or drinking with friends, I do not want strangers bothering me at all, and I have a well cultivated "You can fuck off now" look for such occasions 💜 |
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"I don't think we owe any unsolicited attention anything. Neither should we expect anything. I think everyone's time is precious and we should respect that. So when we cast our net out and getting nothing we should be OK with that (even if we are a little disappointed). I also think the same of when people have passed a little basic interaction.
However I think once things progress to arranging a meet that changes things (based on the principle of people's time being precious again). We still don't owe anyone a meet and it's OK to change our minds or get cold feet. However if people have doubts or potential problems they should say at the earliest possibility. Even if it's an hour before. At this stage ghosting and going to ground without explanation is totally out of order.
Mr"
Oh of course, expectations and such are different as dynamics develop. I should probably have specified strangers in the original post 💜 |
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We are entitled to respect.
Unless we show someone disrespect, I don’t see why you shouldn’t and can’t respect them.
Furthermore, we are entitled to some manners, basic manners cost nothing, I’m entitled to that, if I don’t get that, I have no respect for them.
For anyone who says we owe nobody anything, sure, I get that, but those things I mentioned above cost me nothing to give you. ❤️ |
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"We are entitled to respect.
Unless we show someone disrespect, I don’t see why you shouldn’t and can’t respect them.
Furthermore, we are entitled to some manners, basic manners cost nothing, I’m entitled to that, if I don’t get that, I have no respect for them.
For anyone who says we owe nobody anything, sure, I get that, but those things I mentioned above cost me nothing to give you. ❤️"
What do you define as basic manners? Or demonstrating respect? |
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My opinion is... Fab is more like Facebook or Instagram than a pub. I'd say socials and clubs are more like pub scenarios where everyone is owed respect unless they do something disrespectful. Online is a whole different scenario where you get a lot of keyboard warriors and a lot more confidence behind a screen name.
On here it is fine to ignore messages and winks because it just shows that you're not interested where as in a pub scenario it is just plane rude to pretend that someone isn't stood right in front of you |
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"We are entitled to respect.
Unless we show someone disrespect, I don’t see why you shouldn’t and can’t respect them.
Furthermore, we are entitled to some manners, basic manners cost nothing, I’m entitled to that, if I don’t get that, I have no respect for them.
For anyone who says we owe nobody anything, sure, I get that, but those things I mentioned above cost me nothing to give you. ❤️"
IRL you mean is it? |
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By (user no longer on site) 10 weeks ago
|
"We are entitled to respect.
Unless we show someone disrespect, I don’t see why you shouldn’t and can’t respect them.
Furthermore, we are entitled to some manners, basic manners cost nothing, I’m entitled to that, if I don’t get that, I have no respect for them.
For anyone who says we owe nobody anything, sure, I get that, but those things I mentioned above cost me nothing to give you. ❤️"
Respect is earned. |
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"Via this site? No.
When out & about I’d say it’s polite to politely say no or the equivalent at least. So that would constitute a smidgen of my time I guess
See, I'm the other way. Out and about I only politely acknowledge if I think that not doing so would create a threat to mine or someone else's safety.
At least on here they have a reason to think it's appropriate to approach. At a club I'll acknowledge everyone who speaks to me like a human. But on the street or shopping or drinking with friends, I do not want strangers bothering me at all, and I have a well cultivated "You can fuck off now" look for such occasions 💜"
…and that is absolutely fine. Obviously you risk being judged as unfriendly & aloof but as long as you are ok with that (& it sounds like you are 😂) then it’s all good. Ultimately do what works for YOU & not what society in general may reasonably  expect! |
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"We are entitled to respect.
Unless we show someone disrespect, I don’t see why you shouldn’t and can’t respect them.
Furthermore, we are entitled to some manners, basic manners cost nothing, I’m entitled to that, if I don’t get that, I have no respect for them.
For anyone who says we owe nobody anything, sure, I get that, but those things I mentioned above cost me nothing to give you. ❤️
What do you define as basic manners? Or demonstrating respect?"
I don’t know, but I know it when I see it.
I’m only answering your post at the start, it’s not an argument or any hidden message. 🙏 |
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By (user no longer on site) 10 weeks ago
|
"Absolutely nothing, we aren't entitled to anything from anyone unless there's some prior agreement in place (eg work etc)
Nothing at all? Care to expand? "
Expand on nothing? I'm not sure how I can expand on that.
No one is "entitled" to anything. |
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"We are entitled to respect.
Unless we show someone disrespect, I don’t see why you shouldn’t and can’t respect them.
Furthermore, we are entitled to some manners, basic manners cost nothing, I’m entitled to that, if I don’t get that, I have no respect for them.
For anyone who says we owe nobody anything, sure, I get that, but those things I mentioned above cost me nothing to give you. ❤️
What do you define as basic manners? Or demonstrating respect?
I don’t know, but I know it when I see it.
I’m only answering your post at the start, it’s not an argument or any hidden message. 🙏"
How can someone owe you something that you can't even define though? |
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By *amsubMan 10 weeks ago
hyde |
If someone wants to talk to me I talk back I am not so stuck up to think I am more important than anyone else I am not worried if I go out or scared I don't have my personal space it's everyone's space to share . Its nice to be important but its more important to be nice. |
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"Absolutely nothing, we aren't entitled to anything from anyone unless there's some prior agreement in place (eg work etc)
Nothing at all? Care to expand?
Expand on nothing? I'm not sure how I can expand on that.
No one is "entitled" to anything."
Not even basic respect? |
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By (user no longer on site) 10 weeks ago
|
"We are entitled to respect.
Unless we show someone disrespect, I don’t see why you shouldn’t and can’t respect them.
Furthermore, we are entitled to some manners, basic manners cost nothing, I’m entitled to that, if I don’t get that, I have no respect for them.
For anyone who says we owe nobody anything, sure, I get that, but those things I mentioned above cost me nothing to give you. ❤️
Respect is earned."
Does that work for men messaging women all the sex stuff? We have to earn their respect before they are respectful ? As a female , are we entitled for men to be respectful in a message? Are we entitled for them to read our profile? Are we entitled for only those that fit what we are looking for to message us? |
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"If someone wants to talk to me I talk back I am not so stuck up to think I am more important than anyone else I am not worried if I go out or scared I don't have my personal space it's everyone's space to share . Its nice to be important but its more important to be nice. "
Why do you equate it to self importance or being stuck up rather than someone simply not wanting the attention of a stranger? |
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"Absolutely nothing, we aren't entitled to anything from anyone unless there's some prior agreement in place (eg work etc)
Nothing at all? Care to expand?
Expand on nothing? I'm not sure how I can expand on that.
No one is "entitled" to anything.
Not even basic respect? "
Define basic respect 💜 |
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By *tr8MrEMan 10 weeks ago
somewhere near Sheffield |
It's rarely shown on fab but I do think we should at most all be entitled to respect....but judging from what I'm reading in some threads and status updates it's in very short supply |
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"We are entitled to respect.
Unless we show someone disrespect, I don’t see why you shouldn’t and can’t respect them.
Furthermore, we are entitled to some manners, basic manners cost nothing, I’m entitled to that, if I don’t get that, I have no respect for them.
For anyone who says we owe nobody anything, sure, I get that, but those things I mentioned above cost me nothing to give you. ❤️
Respect is earned.
Does that work for men messaging women all the sex stuff? We have to earn their respect before they are respectful ? As a female , are we entitled for men to be respectful in a message? Are we entitled for them to read our profile? Are we entitled for only those that fit what we are looking for to message us? "
This is why I posted my response like I did if you saw it.
A screen gives a lot of confidence to everyone. If people reported disrespect messages and unwanted d pics etc. The site would be a lot less toxic maybe? |
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"We are entitled to respect.
Unless we show someone disrespect, I don’t see why you shouldn’t and can’t respect them.
Furthermore, we are entitled to some manners, basic manners cost nothing, I’m entitled to that, if I don’t get that, I have no respect for them.
For anyone who says we owe nobody anything, sure, I get that, but those things I mentioned above cost me nothing to give you. ❤️
What do you define as basic manners? Or demonstrating respect?
I don’t know, but I know it when I see it.
I’m only answering your post at the start, it’s not an argument or any hidden message. 🙏
How can someone owe you something that you can't even define though?"
I cant describe or define a lot of things that haven’t happened, but when I see it, I’ll point at it.
I could give past examples, but that’s all they are.
You are clever Prey, you know disrespect and lack of manners when you see it. Xx
|
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"Absolutely nothing, we aren't entitled to anything from anyone unless there's some prior agreement in place (eg work etc)
Nothing at all? Care to expand?
Expand on nothing? I'm not sure how I can expand on that.
No one is "entitled" to anything.
Not even basic respect?
Define basic respect 💜"
I'd define basic respect as not thinking that everyone is bad before gauging your own opinion. Such as men on here. Men have a very bad reputation due to other men being very disrespectful and overall toxic.
Online I understand the ignoring messages as we owe nobody a response if we're not interested. I do it plenty just like most people do.
If you read my first response to this post you'd maybe get an idea of my opinion |
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By (user no longer on site) 10 weeks ago
|
"We are entitled to respect.
Unless we show someone disrespect, I don’t see why you shouldn’t and can’t respect them.
Furthermore, we are entitled to some manners, basic manners cost nothing, I’m entitled to that, if I don’t get that, I have no respect for them.
For anyone who says we owe nobody anything, sure, I get that, but those things I mentioned above cost me nothing to give you. ❤️
Respect is earned.
Does that work for men messaging women all the sex stuff? We have to earn their respect before they are respectful ? As a female , are we entitled for men to be respectful in a message? Are we entitled for them to read our profile? Are we entitled for only those that fit what we are looking for to message us?
This is why I posted my response like I did if you saw it.
A screen gives a lot of confidence to everyone. If people reported disrespect messages and unwanted d pics etc. The site would be a lot less toxic maybe?"
Is it toxic? I don't think it is really, maybe just full of overly entitled people.... |
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"What do we actually owe other people?
Ignoring the premise that fab is like a pub. (It's not. Someone approaching me on here is more likely to get a response than someone intruding on my social time in a public place. I will quite happily blank someone who's inserting themselves in my personal space without invitation in person.)
Are we obliged to acknowledge everyone who shows an interest just because they have an interest?
Are other humans, regardless of context or circumstance, always entitled to at least a smidge of your time and attention, solely on the basis that they want it?
Discuss 💜"
Firstly, I haven't read the other replies yet but I will go back and read them and readjust should something move my thinking on this AND
Secondly ..... NEVER put Discuss - I'm entitled to a command free zone 
Are we obliged to acknowledge everyone who shows an interest - No , we are not obliged to but I do believe that considering the feelings of the other or not is a great marker of the self and who I am.
Are other humans, regardless of context or circumstance, always entitled to at least a smidge of your time and attention, solely on the basis that they want it? No, However I may choose to give them that smidge for the reasons stated above.
That 'obligated smidge' may be in the form of politely worded 'suck it up' disclaimer on my profile, so that i've said beforehand
After that, their feelings are their own to handle but I feel it would make me a lesser person to consider myself responding to another or worse - to be annoyed or agitated because someone messaged me.
|
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"
This is why I posted my response like I did if you saw it.
A screen gives a lot of confidence to everyone. If people reported disrespect messages and unwanted d pics etc. The site would be a lot less toxic maybe?
Is it toxic? I don't think it is really, maybe just full of overly entitled people...."
That I can agree with and that is what makes it toxic in my opinion. I've also seen/heard and had my fair share of messages from disrespectful guys that send messages without giving a profile a look. My profile states that I am straight yet I get messages from guys and I've had couples reach out asking to have sex with guys. |
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"Define basic respect 💜
I'd define basic respect as not thinking that everyone is bad before gauging your own opinion. Such as men on here. Men have a very bad reputation due to other men being very disrespectful and overall toxic.
Online I understand the ignoring messages as we owe nobody a response if we're not interested. I do it plenty just like most people do.
If you read my first response to this post you'd maybe get an idea of my opinion "
As in my original post and other comments, I'm more likely to blank someone out in person than on here or at a swingers club.
Why do you think people are owed more in person?
And why do you think the lack of it is because 'men bad' rather than simply because someone isn't interested? 💜 |
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By (user no longer on site) 10 weeks ago
|
"
This is why I posted my response like I did if you saw it.
A screen gives a lot of confidence to everyone. If people reported disrespect messages and unwanted d pics etc. The site would be a lot less toxic maybe?
Is it toxic? I don't think it is really, maybe just full of overly entitled people....
That I can agree with and that is what makes it toxic in my opinion. I've also seen/heard and had my fair share of messages from disrespectful guys that send messages without giving a profile a look. My profile states that I am straight yet I get messages from guys and I've had couples reach out asking to have sex with guys. "
Are you entitled for them to read your profile before messaging? |
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"After that, their feelings are their own to handle but I feel it would make me a lesser person to consider myself above responding to another or worse - to be annoyed or agitated because someone messaged me."
Why is it considering yourself above or being annoyed or agitated, rather than simply cracking on with your life as if the unsolicited intrusion hadn't happened? |
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"Define basic respect 💜
I'd define basic respect as not thinking that everyone is bad before gauging your own opinion. Such as men on here. Men have a very bad reputation due to other men being very disrespectful and overall toxic.
Online I understand the ignoring messages as we owe nobody a response if we're not interested. I do it plenty just like most people do.
If you read my first response to this post you'd maybe get an idea of my opinion
As in my original post and other comments, I'm more likely to blank someone out in person than on here or at a swingers club.
Why do you think people are owed more in person?
And why do you think the lack of it is because 'men bad' rather than simply because someone isn't interested? 💜"
I never meant for it to be interpreted that way. On my original post I stated that it was fine to ignore people on here.
In person I'd say that as long as they're respectful to you then you could either politely turn them down or continue the conversation if you're interested. |
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"
This is why I posted my response like I did if you saw it.
A screen gives a lot of confidence to everyone. If people reported disrespect messages and unwanted d pics etc. The site would be a lot less toxic maybe?
Is it toxic? I don't think it is really, maybe just full of overly entitled people....
That I can agree with and that is what makes it toxic in my opinion. I've also seen/heard and had my fair share of messages from disrespectful guys that send messages without giving a profile a look. My profile states that I am straight yet I get messages from guys and I've had couples reach out asking to have sex with guys.
Are you entitled for them to read your profile before messaging? "
Not entitled but I'd label that as basic respect |
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My experience over 9 years on fab is that regardless of what may be said in public on the forums there are people on here who don't take kindly to not getting what they expect and that includes my time and attention.
The majority of negative experiences on fab have been a result of not jumping when instructed to or not siding with someone when they are the instigator of fab drama.
The only people entitled to my time and effort are those who are prepared to match it unconditionally.
I've been at group socials where I've been approached and told that a particular fabber wished to speak to me and would I be so kind as to make myself known to her?
My response has always been that if they were so keen they could come and talk to me rather than holding court in the corner and expecting everyone to come to them.
I've never been rude enough to tell anyone to fuck off but as far as I'm concerned anyone with a sense of entitlement can fuck off. |
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"We are entitled to respect.
Unless we show someone disrespect, I don’t see why you shouldn’t and can’t respect them.
Furthermore, we are entitled to some manners, basic manners cost nothing, I’m entitled to that, if I don’t get that, I have no respect for them.
For anyone who says we owe nobody anything, sure, I get that, but those things I mentioned above cost me nothing to give you. ❤️
What do you define as basic manners? Or demonstrating respect?
I don’t know, but I know it when I see it.
I’m only answering your post at the start, it’s not an argument or any hidden message. 🙏
How can someone owe you something that you can't even define though?
I cant describe or define a lot of things that haven’t happened, but when I see it, I’ll point at it.
I could give past examples, but that’s all they are.
You are clever Prey, you know disrespect and lack of manners when you see it. Xx
"
Are you saying Respect and Manners are universals ? |
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"I never meant for it to be interpreted that way. On my original post I stated that it was fine to ignore people on here.
In person I'd say that as long as they're respectful to you then you could either politely turn them down or continue the conversation if you're interested."
How do you define respectful to you when it comes to being approached? And if it isn't respectful, what's the alternative response you have for that situation? |
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By (user no longer on site) 10 weeks ago
|
"Absolutely nothing, we aren't entitled to anything from anyone unless there's some prior agreement in place (eg work etc)
Nothing at all? Care to expand?
Expand on nothing? I'm not sure how I can expand on that.
No one is "entitled" to anything.
Not even basic respect? "
No, respect is earned.
We aren't entitled to anything, yes basic respect, manners and such are nice and luckily most humans are good with that, but no we aren't entitled to them just because we live and breath. |
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"After that, their feelings are their own to handle but I feel it would make me a lesser person to consider myself above responding to another or worse - to be annoyed or agitated because someone messaged me.
Why is it considering yourself above or being annoyed or agitated, rather than simply cracking on with your life as if the unsolicited intrusion hadn't happened?"
I didn't say 'it' was - I said it would make ME a lesser person if I was to consider myself above responding ... etc etc |
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On here I like to respond to all messages. It's how I am.
I shuttered my account because ill health meant I was unable to respond to everyone, and decided I wasn't well enough for new encounters.
How I operate my profile is my business, and how others operate theirs is not. |
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"I cant describe or define a lot of things that haven’t happened, but when I see it, I’ll point at it.
I could give past examples, but that’s all they are.
You are clever Prey, you know disrespect and lack of manners when you see it. Xx
"
Do I?
Clearly I have different interpretations of respect and manners to other people, this is why I'm asking for clarity.
I've been told I'm a rude cunt for literally using the words "No thank you" and nothing else. I've been approached in places I consider wildly inappropriate and disrespectful to be approached at all, but obviously the other person didn't think that they were or that apologising for doing so while still choosing to do so somehow negated it.
I ask not as some kind of gotcha thing. I'm asking because I genuinely seek clarity on what other people mean by manners and respect 💜 |
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I personally don’t believe strangers are entitled to anything at all from me.
That doesn’t mean I don’t try to treat people with respect if I feel it’s warranted but that doesn’t make someone entitled to it.
Donna |
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By *host63Man 10 weeks ago
Bedfont Feltham |
I think honesty at the. Very least.
I would just for on my e like to arrange a meeting with a woman on here without on the day of the visit her contacting me aski for money the latest was for money for a computer game to keep her nephew o copied while she went away for a weekend with me arranged 2 weeks in advance.
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By *aizyWoman 10 weeks ago
west midlands |
"I think honesty at the. Very least.
I would just for on my e like to arrange a meeting with a woman on here without on the day of the visit her contacting me aski for money the latest was for money for a computer game to keep her nephew o copied while she went away for a weekend with me arranged 2 weeks in advance.
"
Did you go away for the weekend with her? |
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"I think honesty at the. Very least.
I would just for on my e like to arrange a meeting with a woman on here without on the day of the visit her contacting me aski for money the latest was for money for a computer game to keep her nephew o copied while she went away for a weekend with me arranged 2 weeks in advance.
"
What happened to kids kicking a ball around to occupy themselves  |
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"I never meant for it to be interpreted that way. On my original post I stated that it was fine to ignore people on here.
In person I'd say that as long as they're respectful to you then you could either politely turn them down or continue the conversation if you're interested.
How do you define respectful to you when it comes to being approached? And if it isn't respectful, what's the alternative response you have for that situation?"
I'd say just being nice, not pushy but being polite and respecting if someone is or isn't interested |
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"Absolutely nothing, we aren't entitled to anything from anyone unless there's some prior agreement in place (eg work etc)
Nothing at all? Care to expand?
Expand on nothing? I'm not sure how I can expand on that.
No one is "entitled" to anything.
Not even basic respect?
No, respect is earned.
We aren't entitled to anything, yes basic respect, manners and such are nice and luckily most humans are good with that, but no we aren't entitled to them just because we live and breath."
You've said that twice now.
I don't agree that respect needs to be earned. For me , respect is a given. |
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"Absolutely nothing, we aren't entitled to anything from anyone unless there's some prior agreement in place (eg work etc)
Nothing at all? Care to expand?
Expand on nothing? I'm not sure how I can expand on that.
No one is "entitled" to anything.
Not even basic respect?
No, respect is earned.
We aren't entitled to anything, yes basic respect, manners and such are nice and luckily most humans are good with that, but no we aren't entitled to them just because we live and breath."
I go by respect is given unless there is a reason for it to be taken away. To say that respect is earned means that you are going into situations with a prejudice that the person is disrespectful |
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"I cant describe or define a lot of things that haven’t happened, but when I see it, I’ll point at it.
I could give past examples, but that’s all they are.
You are clever Prey, you know disrespect and lack of manners when you see it. Xx
Do I?
Clearly I have different interpretations of respect and manners to other people, this is why I'm asking for clarity.
I've been told I'm a rude cunt for literally using the words "No thank you" and nothing else. I've been approached in places I consider wildly inappropriate and disrespectful to be approached at all, but obviously the other person didn't think that they were or that apologising for doing so while still choosing to do so somehow negated it.
I ask not as some kind of gotcha thing. I'm asking because I genuinely seek clarity on what other people mean by manners and respect 💜"
What would you consider a inappropriate or disrespectful place? |
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"Absolutely nothing, we aren't entitled to anything from anyone unless there's some prior agreement in place (eg work etc)
Nothing at all? Care to expand?
Expand on nothing? I'm not sure how I can expand on that.
No one is "entitled" to anything.
Not even basic respect?
No, respect is earned.
We aren't entitled to anything, yes basic respect, manners and such are nice and luckily most humans are good with that, but no we aren't entitled to them just because we live and breath.
You've said that twice now.
I don't agree that respect needs to be earned. For me , respect is a given."
Common decency, at the least. |
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"Absolutely nothing, we aren't entitled to anything from anyone unless there's some prior agreement in place (eg work etc)
Nothing at all? Care to expand?
Expand on nothing? I'm not sure how I can expand on that.
No one is "entitled" to anything.
Not even basic respect?
No, respect is earned.
We aren't entitled to anything, yes basic respect, manners and such are nice and luckily most humans are good with that, but no we aren't entitled to them just because we live and breath.
You've said that twice now.
I don't agree that respect needs to be earned. For me , respect is a given.
Common decency, at the least."
Quite Nanna. Quite |
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"No-one is worthy of my respect until they've earnt it. Everyone is entitled to courtesy, until they're not."
Now that is an interesting thought - the difference between respect and courtesy.
I stand by what I said tho ...... From me, respect is a given |
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For the people saying that respect is earned... My reply is that you are already going into the meeting with prejudice that the person is disrespectful. How can someone earn your respect if they're already seen as disrespectful? There is no point in having the interaction if you already think the person is disrespectful |
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"What would you consider a inappropriate or disrespectful place?"
Anywhere vanilla where my company may be my partner, or where I'm alone and clearly not seeking company.
The particular thought in the previous post was at a wake for someone I loved. But it doesn't have to go that far to class as disrespectful to me. |
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"What would you consider a inappropriate or disrespectful place?
Anywhere vanilla where my company may be my partner, or where I'm alone and clearly not seeking company.
The particular thought in the previous post was at a wake for someone I loved. But it doesn't have to go that far to class as disrespectful to me."
Yeah I get that. But off of fab... How would someone know that you're attached or into the lifestyle? Maybe they just think you're an attractive woman and want to shoot their shot? I hear a lot of this from single women on social media... Like, don't approach at the gym, work, nights out, shopping etc. Doesn't leave many options if they're wanting to meet someone.
But in my experience it's more about who's approaching rather than the approach all together. Like funerals and hospitals yeah that's a no go |
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"Yeah I get that. But off of fab... How would someone know that you're attached or into the lifestyle? Maybe they just think you're an attractive woman and want to shoot their shot? I hear a lot of this from single women on social media... Like, don't approach at the gym, work, nights out, shopping etc. Doesn't leave many options if they're wanting to meet someone.
But in my experience it's more about who's approaching rather than the approach all together. Like funerals and hospitals yeah that's a no go "
I didn't make it swinging specific.
If you're aware that women don't want to be approached at the gym, work, etc. and you choose to do so anyway, is that being respectful?
I can honestly say it wouldn't have mattered who was approaching in that circumstance 💜 |
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"Yeah I get that. But off of fab... How would someone know that you're attached or into the lifestyle? Maybe they just think you're an attractive woman and want to shoot their shot? I hear a lot of this from single women on social media... Like, don't approach at the gym, work, nights out, shopping etc. Doesn't leave many options if they're wanting to meet someone.
But in my experience it's more about who's approaching rather than the approach all together. Like funerals and hospitals yeah that's a no go
I didn't make it swinging specific.
If you're aware that women don't want to be approached at the gym, work, etc. and you choose to do so anyway, is that being respectful?
I can honestly say it wouldn't have mattered who was approaching in that circumstance 💜"
You don't know that specific person in that specific location... How can you know that you're being disrespectful? A couple 1000 women don't speak for billions right? |
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"You don't know that specific person in that specific location... How can you know that you're being disrespectful? A couple 1000 women don't speak for billions right?"
I don't. And neither do you. But your earlier comment says you're aware of what's said by (some) women about being approached in such places. Maybe that one won't mind. Maybe a quick fingerbang would have helped speed through the grieving. You never know unless you try right 💜 |
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"You don't know that specific person in that specific location... How can you know that you're being disrespectful? A couple 1000 women don't speak for billions right?
I don't. And neither do you. But your earlier comment says you're aware of what's said by (some) women about being approached in such places. Maybe that one won't mind. Maybe a quick fingerbang would have helped speed through the grieving. You never know unless you try right 💜"
I guess haha |
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"What do we actually owe other people?
Ignoring the premise that fab is like a pub. (It's not. Someone approaching me on here is more likely to get a response than someone intruding on my social time in a public place. I will quite happily blank someone who's inserting themselves in my personal space without invitation in person.)
"
That’s interesting. I’m much more likely to engage with someone in person. On here a message is just a message, plus usually they’re either dull (“hi”) or lewd. So it’s easy to ignore.
Whereas in person I feel obligated to be polite if someone speaks to me. And I often like the interaction.
That being said, I’m not a woman so my experience is probably totally different.
|
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For me it's to be treated with respect and not abused.
HOWEVER that doesn't mean you are entitled to a reply to a message. If people don't reply take it as a no thanks and move on
The amount of people who feel entitled to a response isn't cool imho
C |
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"What do we actually owe other people?
Ignoring the premise that fab is like a pub. (It's not. Someone approaching me on here is more likely to get a response than someone intruding on my social time in a public place. I will quite happily blank someone who's inserting themselves in my personal space without invitation in person.)
That’s interesting. I’m much more likely to engage with someone in person. On here a message is just a message, plus usually they’re either dull (“hi”) or lewd. So it’s easy to ignore.
Whereas in person I feel obligated to be polite if someone speaks to me. And I often like the interaction.
That being said, I’m not a woman so my experience is probably totally different.
"
I think most people are more likely to engage in person.
The conditioning women in particular have to be polite and not upset people is a lot harder to break in direct human interaction.
I was just mentioning it as I'm sick of seeing the "you wouldn't just blank someone who said hi in a pub" argument, because first off I would, and second the entire context is so far removed from a site like this it's laughable. |
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By *bi HaiveMan 10 weeks ago
Forum Mod Cheeseville, Somerset |
"No-one is worthy of my respect until they've earnt it. Everyone is entitled to courtesy, until they're not.
Now that is an interesting thought - the difference between respect and courtesy.
I stand by what I said tho ...... From me, respect is a given"
A tricky one for me.
I'll give anyone courtesy until it's not deserved. Even those I don't respect in the slightest.
I'd agree respect is earned though. There are people I've never met and never will that I have zero respect for, based on their words, thoughts and deeds.
Respect is a funny word.
I'll respect people's right to have a certain view or opinion, even if I don't respect that view or opinion and it will probably determine whether I have respect for that person too. I respect people's rights to make individual choices, yet if those choices go against my own personal beliefs and morals then the odds on me having any respect for them is pretty much zero.
Courtesy is much easier. That's a given until a reason not to offer it arrives. I can be polite to people I don't respect. Often just to make life much easier and keep the peace. |
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"I think we're all entitled to respect. That's a two way thing.
What exactly is the respect that's owed, and what conditions apply? 💜"
On fab I think we should respect the right of people to contact us without being abusive and they should respect our right to not respond.
The condition I would make is that everyone enables appropriate filters.
No one is obliged to acknowledge interest from someone else but it might be useful to lessen the ability of others to show that interest. |
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By (user no longer on site) 10 weeks ago
|
The truth is, for me, you’re entitled to nothing
You can hope for something
But to be entitled to it means that everyone would have to think the same as you and sadly they don’t
Just my thoughts |
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By (user no longer on site) 10 weeks ago
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"Absolutely nothing, we aren't entitled to anything from anyone unless there's some prior agreement in place (eg work etc)
Nothing at all? Care to expand?
Expand on nothing? I'm not sure how I can expand on that.
No one is "entitled" to anything.
Not even basic respect?
No, respect is earned.
We aren't entitled to anything, yes basic respect, manners and such are nice and luckily most humans are good with that, but no we aren't entitled to them just because we live and breath.
You've said that twice now.
I don't agree that respect needs to be earned. For me , respect is a given."
It maybe to you, but it's not something anyone is "entitled" to. |
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By (user no longer on site) 10 weeks ago
|
"No-one is worthy of my respect until they've earnt it. Everyone is entitled to courtesy, until they're not.
Now that is an interesting thought - the difference between respect and courtesy.
I stand by what I said tho ...... From me, respect is a given
A tricky one for me.
I'll give anyone courtesy until it's not deserved. Even those I don't respect in the slightest.
I'd agree respect is earned though. There are people I've never met and never will that I have zero respect for, based on their words, thoughts and deeds.
Respect is a funny word.
I'll respect people's right to have a certain view or opinion, even if I don't respect that view or opinion and it will probably determine whether I have respect for that person too. I respect people's rights to make individual choices, yet if those choices go against my own personal beliefs and morals then the odds on me having any respect for them is pretty much zero.
Courtesy is much easier. That's a given until a reason not to offer it arrives. I can be polite to people I don't respect. Often just to make life much easier and keep the peace. "
Now this I agree with, I think the word respect is getting a little lost in translation.
No one is entitled to my respect when I don't know them, some people don't have it and I don't know them, some people do through their thoughts and opinions, no one at all is entitled to it. |
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"No-one is worthy of my respect until they've earnt it. Everyone is entitled to courtesy, until they're not.
Now that is an interesting thought - the difference between respect and courtesy.
I stand by what I said tho ...... From me, respect is a given
A tricky one for me.
I'll give anyone courtesy until it's not deserved. Even those I don't respect in the slightest.
I'd agree respect is earned though. There are people I've never met and never will that I have zero respect for, based on their words, thoughts and deeds.
Respect is a funny word.
I'll respect people's right to have a certain view or opinion, even if I don't respect that view or opinion and it will probably determine whether I have respect for that person too. I respect people's rights to make individual choices, yet if those choices go against my own personal beliefs and morals then the odds on me having any respect for them is pretty much zero.
Courtesy is much easier. That's a given until a reason not to offer it arrives. I can be polite to people I don't respect. Often just to make life much easier and keep the peace. "
I'll save myself all the typing and agree with this because it's pretty much how I see it. |
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"Absolutely nothing, we aren't entitled to anything from anyone unless there's some prior agreement in place (eg work etc)
Nothing at all? Care to expand?
Expand on nothing? I'm not sure how I can expand on that.
No one is "entitled" to anything.
Not even basic respect?
No, respect is earned.
We aren't entitled to anything, yes basic respect, manners and such are nice and luckily most humans are good with that, but no we aren't entitled to them just because we live and breath.
You've said that twice now.
I don't agree that respect needs to be earned. For me , respect is a given.
It maybe to you, but it's not something anyone is "entitled" to."
They are by dint of the fact that I give it. It's less about what they are entitled to and more about who I am or what my values and principles are.
It maybe our understandings or meaning of the word overlaps..
e.g. Treat all with respect. Respect all. ( i'm the former ) so the respect comes from me. |
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People aren't entitled to anything except respect. They may be entitled to getting blocked though, if they are absolutely not going to be respectful or appropriate for engagement.
Fab couldn't be clearer that no reply= no thanks. But many people somehow choose to miss this. When in Rome, do as the Romans  |
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Treating someone with respect means:
showing regard for their abilities and worth.
valuing their feelings and their views, even if you don't necessarily agree with them.
accepting them on an equal basis and giving them the same consideration you would expect for yourself.
Why would you not what to treat other human beings this way?
|
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"What do we actually owe other people?
...
Are we obliged to acknowledge everyone who shows an interest just because they have an interest?
"
There's 3 different words here. I'd say no one's entitled to anyone's time and by the same logic, do not owe anyone their time.
However, if they are obliged to acknowledge is an interesting one. I'd say yes if you think someone has put in a modicum of effort/care into their approach. On here, that'd mean a non-generic message - the bar as to what one would consider non-generic is subjective of course. Ignoring winks, yeah, no problem with that imo. Goes without saying that "no" is a perfectly valid response.
I realise I lack the experience of actually facing this dilemma in practice, so it may be easier for me to mark this as a reasonable obligation. |
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"I cant describe or define a lot of things that haven’t happened, but when I see it, I’ll point at it.
I could give past examples, but that’s all they are.
You are clever Prey, you know disrespect and lack of manners when you see it. Xx
Do I?
Clearly I have different interpretations of respect and manners to other people, this is why I'm asking for clarity.
I've been told I'm a rude cunt for literally using the words "No thank you" and nothing else. I've been approached in places I consider wildly inappropriate and disrespectful to be approached at all, but obviously the other person didn't think that they were or that apologising for doing so while still choosing to do so somehow negated it.
I ask not as some kind of gotcha thing. I'm asking because I genuinely seek clarity on what other people mean by manners and respect 💜"
No thank you - sounds like good manners and respect.
You’re a rude cunt - sounds like someone who I wouldn’t respect.
People know what these words mean, (respect and manners) they just choose to spin things to how they see things for whatever reason.
We are all adults. Xx
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That’s a very good question Prey and I don’t feel there is a singular answer that applies to all situations. Everything is highly contextual and subjective as you rightly conclude at the end.
.
But taken at the most basic level, if a being shares some commonality with another being, then whilst there is no obligation for “recognition”, there might be some polite reciprocity in “acknowledgement”.
.
I use active and intentional acknowledgement as part of a session, because it enables the recipient to feel “seen” and “valued”. Seen and accepted.
I don’t “have to” acknowledge. I am not obliged to. But I do because I desire to do so. Because it’s important to them in that situation and by extension to me as well.
.
I feel that is the crux of the matter. Should people feel “obliged” to give a moment of their time and attention ? No. There is no obligation. Only desire, and ultimately will.
.
When we acknowledge others, we briefly take a moment to acknowledge ourselves, and intuitively make an “alignment consideration”. That still does not obligate an “acknowledgement”. |
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By (user no longer on site) 9 weeks ago
|
"Absolutely nothing, we aren't entitled to anything from anyone unless there's some prior agreement in place (eg work etc)
Nothing at all? Care to expand?
Expand on nothing? I'm not sure how I can expand on that.
No one is "entitled" to anything.
Not even basic respect?
No, respect is earned.
We aren't entitled to anything, yes basic respect, manners and such are nice and luckily most humans are good with that, but no we aren't entitled to them just because we live and breath.
You've said that twice now.
I don't agree that respect needs to be earned. For me , respect is a given.
It maybe to you, but it's not something anyone is "entitled" to.
They are by dint of the fact that I give it. It's less about what they are entitled to and more about who I am or what my values and principles are.
It maybe our understandings or meaning of the word overlaps..
e.g. Treat all with respect. Respect all. ( i'm the former ) so the respect comes from me. "
That's great, but the thread is what are people entitled to, not what do we give freely.
Again no one is entitled to respect, does that mean I don't give it, no.
They just aren't entitled to it, no one is entitled to anything. |
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Having read some of tge posts on here and the different interpretations of it, I will articulate my answer as best as I can.
Everyone should have an expectation to be respected until they give reason not too. And yes it does often come down to manners and behaviour too. People often do behave in very disrespectful way either directly or indirectly and often in a selfish manner and not considering how that affects anyone else. There are really minimum levels of respect that is, or at least should be, the norm that people expect. Whether that is what you call entitlement, I am not sure. |
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"Absolutely nothing, we aren't entitled to anything from anyone unless there's some prior agreement in place (eg work etc)
Nothing at all? Care to expand?
Expand on nothing? I'm not sure how I can expand on that.
No one is "entitled" to anything.
Not even basic respect?
No, respect is earned.
We aren't entitled to anything, yes basic respect, manners and such are nice and luckily most humans are good with that, but no we aren't entitled to them just because we live and breath.
You've said that twice now.
I don't agree that respect needs to be earned. For me , respect is a given.
It maybe to you, but it's not something anyone is "entitled" to.
They are by dint of the fact that I give it. It's less about what they are entitled to and more about who I am or what my values and principles are.
It maybe our understandings or meaning of the word overlaps..
e.g. Treat all with respect. Respect all. ( i'm the former ) so the respect comes from me.
That's great, but the thread is what are people entitled to, not what do we give freely.
Again no one is entitled to respect, does that mean I don't give it, no.
They just aren't entitled to it, no one is entitled to anything."
I know what the thread is about. I responded to your belief that respect must be earned. We may be coming from different perspectives as I do firmly believe that respect is a basic that we should give to any other human being and they are indeed entitled to it. BUT if the word respect is being used by someone to be manipulative e.g. demand they are replied to then that is a different matter. I don't hold that they are entitled to a reply simply because they deem a reply to be an essential of 'respect'. |
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"Treating someone with respect means:
showing regard for their abilities and worth.
valuing their feelings and their views, even if you don't necessarily agree with them.
accepting them on an equal basis and giving them the same consideration you would expect for yourself.
Why would you not what to treat other human beings this way?
"
|
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Not entitled to anything. I didn't respond to someone's message the other day, I get loads of messages mostly a waste of my time so I'm not going to reply to every one. And a man then got shitty and said I deserve to be ghosted by men after sex his words were I deserve everything I get.. and compared me ignoring his message to being blanked after being intimate.
I didn't owe him anything and nobody owes me anything. Being ignored after sex is hurtful but I will just delete their number and carry on with life |
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By (user no longer on site) 9 weeks ago
|
"Absolutely nothing, we aren't entitled to anything from anyone unless there's some prior agreement in place (eg work etc)
Nothing at all? Care to expand?
Expand on nothing? I'm not sure how I can expand on that.
No one is "entitled" to anything.
Not even basic respect?
No, respect is earned.
We aren't entitled to anything, yes basic respect, manners and such are nice and luckily most humans are good with that, but no we aren't entitled to them just because we live and breath.
You've said that twice now.
I don't agree that respect needs to be earned. For me , respect is a given.
It maybe to you, but it's not something anyone is "entitled" to.
They are by dint of the fact that I give it. It's less about what they are entitled to and more about who I am or what my values and principles are.
It maybe our understandings or meaning of the word overlaps..
e.g. Treat all with respect. Respect all. ( i'm the former ) so the respect comes from me.
That's great, but the thread is what are people entitled to, not what do we give freely.
Again no one is entitled to respect, does that mean I don't give it, no.
They just aren't entitled to it, no one is entitled to anything.
I know what the thread is about. I responded to your belief that respect must be earned. We may be coming from different perspectives as I do firmly believe that respect is a basic that we should give to any other human being and they are indeed entitled to it. BUT if the word respect is being used by someone to be manipulative e.g. demand they are replied to then that is a different matter. I don't hold that they are entitled to a reply simply because they deem a reply to be an essential of 'respect'. "
We'll have to agree to disagree, no one is entitled to my respect that doesn't mean I don't give it, they just aren't entitled to it, no one is entitled to anything from me.
Good manner, respect, compassion are all amazing human responses but they are not entitled to it, and yes for me respect is earned, not everyone deserves respect, in fact many don't.
|
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I used the term "elevated levels of respect" a few months ago in regard to how I see some people on fab and I stand by it.
I firmly believe that some people expect and to some degree demand respect based on race, colour, creed or gender over and above basic respect as a human being.
None of the above matter to me when I'm speaking to someone but all too often I've seen comments here talking about degrees of respect which I don't believe anyone is entitled to. |
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How are you defining your boundaries of personal space online?
I would be more likely to respond to people in a pub, due to the physical immediacy.
I consider it an essential freedom for people to have individual beliefs on this subject and to be able to live in a accordance with their beliefs. The purpose of rules, is to set outer limits on what is unacceptable behaviour.
Fab has rules that set those outer limits. I have consented to abide by those rules, as have other users. Providing users do, I have no reasonable grounds to expect people to know what my personal beliefs, values or expectations are without communicating them. I certainly wouldn't expect anyone to automatically comply with them, because it's what I believe.
If I choose to voluntarily associate with an individual then there will be a mutual respect for our beliefs and values that forms over time. No one needs an invitation to approach me. The most likely outcome is that what they get from me is a product of what they put in. |
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"Having read some of tge posts on here and the different interpretations of it, I will articulate my answer as best as I can.
Everyone should have an expectation to be respected until they give reason not too. And yes it does often come down to manners and behaviour too. People often do behave in very disrespectful way either directly or indirectly and often in a selfish manner and not considering how that affects anyone else. There are really minimum levels of respect that is, or at least should be, the norm that people expect. Whether that is what you call entitlement, I am not sure. "
I think I misread or misunderstood this andcwas talking how I genetally behave with others and my expectation for civility and good mannets here as in real life. On here abiding by the rukes and being respectful to others is also essential. Unless someone clearly demonstrated they don't deserve it, good manners is also appropriate. As for replying or not to messages etc, that is up to individuals how they manage their inbox and nobody is entitled to a responce, again as per the site's rules and advice. If that is met with abusive comments then again can be reported and dealt with. Is quite simple really, imo anyway. I had a rather abusive message myself recently and I was annoyed that I let it upset me when I should just report, delete and just be me. Lesson learned. |
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I think it would be nice if this was a community where you could give a response to everyone who showed an interest, but I think that’s just too idealistic. Unfortunately, there are far too many people that make it more like my spam folder than a community.
As it is currently, we don’t owe anybody anything no reply means no and being blocked should not be taken personally, it just means we don’t want to risk chatting to you because you’re not our type or we don’t find you attractive |
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"I used the term "elevated levels of respect" a few months ago in regard to how I see some people on fab and I stand by it.
I firmly believe that some people expect and to some degree demand respect based on race, colour, creed or gender over and above basic respect as a human being.
None of the above matter to me when I'm speaking to someone but all too often I've seen comments here talking about degrees of respect which I don't believe anyone is entitled to. "
I’m never quite sure what people mean when they say we should ‘respect each other’. I think people use this term loosely without even knowing what they mean & probably mean a myriad of different things to different people.
I think we owe it to ourselves to conduct ourselves respectfully , that’s self-respect and to me that comes first. I hope I never purposely go out my way to an offend or hurt someone’s feelings. I don’t need to set anybody straight on anything or get into online debates on a hookup site - their views and their profile isn’t my business. Isn’t it just as simple as that? Why should there be any need for friction or to worry about someone’s race colour sexuality when posting on a forum |
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