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Poppies - Have we forgotten to remember?
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So, it's only 11 o'clock and some little tosspot has already pissed me off today.
Was having a wee browse at the newspapers in Sainsbury's and there was a well-dressed elderly gent selling poppies on behalf of The Royal British Legion. Overheard a man saying he wouldn't buy one because he wasnt giving money to help people he didn't know!!!
Granted, I am an old fart, but I remember a time when people were lambasted for being seen without a poppy..appearing on the BBC without one was worse than saying the 'C' word on TV... and I wonder if, following that, people wear it solely for show without any understanding of the reasons why people wear one, and the selling of poppies is just regarded as another charity looking for people's money.
I am not saying the money it raises is not relevant, but surely it is secondary to the reason for wearing a poppy. I do not know much about what the RBL do with the money raised. I certainly hope they do much more, and the funds are used in a more effective way,than the Armed Forces Covenant Trust.
I do think, in general, there is little regard for veterans in the UK. In the US veterans are often treated as heroes. Crowds cheer and whoop. Communities come together to support their local veterans.
Over here the best vetetans had to look forward to is getting a surprise visit from Nick Knowles and the DIY SOS team paying a surprise visit to their home, or they get Laurence Llewelyn-Bowen paying a visit to give their living room a new look.
We could have all been speaking German now, and I'd be buggered. The only German I know is "Wie kommen ich am besten zum Banhoff?". (Spelling?). That said... "Munch my Mushchi" is qquite poetic.
Please, remember the fallen. Lest we forget, eh?
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I spend time contemplating in both November and April. But that's my private concern. As are my charitable donations.
I fear the poppy has been turned into a spectacle, at times, one my ancestors would find repulsive. I prefer to commemorate in my own way. And if people think I'm spitting on the graves of veterans/diggers/whatever, that's firmly their problem. |
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By (user no longer on site) 28 weeks ago
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I always get one nowadays and wear it for what it means to ME, not to anyone else.
If folks judge me then they are only judging themselves in doing so. Im always grateful to the brave who stand up for people who can’t   |
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To be honest, the Poppie has lost its meaning. As a kid it was to remember those lost in WW1 & WW2
Feels like the shift to remember those in all conflicts has blurred the meaning for me
I don’t personally wear one but given the UK’s involvement in wars since WW2 (with the exception of the Falklands) all have been of an aggressive behaviour (IMHO) |
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"To be honest, the Poppie has lost its meaning. As a kid it was to remember those lost in WW1 & WW2
Feels like the shift to remember those in all conflicts has blurred the meaning for me
I don’t personally wear one but given the UK’s involvement in wars since WW2 (with the exception of the Falklands) all have been of an aggressive behaviour (IMHO)"
I choose to think about it as honouring communal spirit, doing something for the greater good. It's the only way it doesn't leave me with ash in my mouth. |
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By (user no longer on site) 28 weeks ago
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Sadly the poppy has been coopted by the flagshaggers who have claimed the St George cross. If you dont didplay one you're a traitor and should be treated as such.
Personally I dont wear a poppy, perhaps when RBL stop paying execs £79k a year, when the ones who do all the work are unpaid volunteers, then I'll reconsider.
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Not giving money to people they don't know; what about people giving their lies for people they don't know?????
Never forget, even if it just to remember that war is wasteful and those that wage it are usually never the ones that die. |
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"Ich kann ein wenig besser Deutsch sprechen, und ich befürchte, dass wir durch die Schaffung selbstgefälliger Karikaturen Gefahr laufen, zu dem zu werden, was wir verspotten."
gut gesacht jungefrau
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I think that the choice to wear a Poppy shows an individual appreciates the sacrifice made by people who were perhaps a lot less selfish than we as a society have become. Despite what the nay sayers think the RBL does an excellent job in supporting ex-servicemen. As with everything it is down to personal choice. |
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The thing is there’s a large difference between supporting soldiers who died in WW1 and 2 and supporting the modern military. I don’t support the modern military personally and think the term veteran has become watered down. |
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By *vaRoseWoman 28 weeks ago
Ankh-Morpork |
There is a lot of specialised support for veterans, and the RBL is only one part of it. There is a wide network of support available for veterans in the UK, extending beyond the Royal British Legion. The government’s Office for Veterans’ Affairs coordinates many services, including priority access to social housing and the Veterans’ Gateway, a 24-hour helpline connecting ex-service members to relevant organisations. The NHS Veterans Mental Health and Wellbeing Service (Op COURAGE) provides specialist psychological and psychiatric care, while Combat Stress focuses on PTSD and trauma support. Charities such as SSAFA, Help for Heroes, and Walking With The Wounded assist with rehabilitation, employment, and family welfare. Veterans also benefit from schemes offering education funding, retraining, and pension advice, as well as targeted programmes for homelessness, substance misuse, and criminal justice rehabilitation. To suggest that the U.K. is behind the USA in its support of veterans is laughable.
It’s worth remembering that the freedoms our veterans fought for include the freedom to choose not to mark the day in any way. Many of our veterans weren’t joining up out of noble patriotism, they were forced to by conscription or social pressure. The constant rhetoric that it was a noble choice dishonours those who were forced to fight.
Some feel the poppy has been co-opted as a symbol of patriotism rather than remembrance. When it’s used alongside right-wing propaganda, it can appear to celebrate war or glorify military power, rather than mourn its human cost. It can be seen as only those of the allied forces were worth remembering or that those in the extended colonial troops, civilians and other countries who sacrificed so much. For those people, refusing the symbol is a quiet protest against that distortion.
In recent years, social and media pressure to wear a poppy has become intense. Public figures are criticised for appearing without one. That’s frankly coercion, and it runs contrary to the poppy’s original purpose of freedom and quiet remembrance. Some people reject it because they resent being told how to demonstrate respect.
TLDR… let people be, they have their reasons |
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"I always get one nowadays and wear it for what it means to ME, not to anyone else.
If folks judge me then they are only judging themselves in doing so. Im always grateful to the brave who stand up for people who can’t "
Same sentiments here  |
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"There is a lot of specialised support for veterans, and the RBL is only one part of it. There is a wide network of support available for veterans in the UK, extending beyond the Royal British Legion. The government’s Office for Veterans’ Affairs coordinates many services, including priority access to social housing and the Veterans’ Gateway, a 24-hour helpline connecting ex-service members to relevant organisations. The NHS Veterans Mental Health and Wellbeing Service (Op COURAGE) provides specialist psychological and psychiatric care, while Combat Stress focuses on PTSD and trauma support. Charities such as SSAFA, Help for Heroes, and Walking With The Wounded assist with rehabilitation, employment, and family welfare. Veterans also benefit from schemes offering education funding, retraining, and pension advice, as well as targeted programmes for homelessness, substance misuse, and criminal justice rehabilitation. To suggest that the U.K. is behind the USA in its support of veterans is laughable.
It’s worth remembering that the freedoms our veterans fought for include the freedom to choose not to mark the day in any way. Many of our veterans weren’t joining up out of noble patriotism, they were forced to by conscription or social pressure. The constant rhetoric that it was a noble choice dishonours those who were forced to fight.
Some feel the poppy has been co-opted as a symbol of patriotism rather than remembrance. When it’s used alongside right-wing propaganda, it can appear to celebrate war or glorify military power, rather than mourn its human cost. It can be seen as only those of the allied forces were worth remembering or that those in the extended colonial troops, civilians and other countries who sacrificed so much. For those people, refusing the symbol is a quiet protest against that distortion.
In recent years, social and media pressure to wear a poppy has become intense. Public figures are criticised for appearing without one. That’s frankly coercion, and it runs contrary to the poppy’s original purpose of freedom and quiet remembrance. Some people reject it because they resent being told how to demonstrate respect.
TLDR… let people be, they have their reasons "
Very well said. |
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We are fortunate to have lived in an era where conscription and national service don't exist.
The work of the RBL, as with all charities, is to fill the gap that the government doesn't. That was the purpose of the Haig Fund.
Remembrance is a very personal matter. I saw a veteran (probably from Afghanistan) sat on the steps of a Cenotaph, can of lager in his hand, torn and ragged clothes,on a Remembrance Sunday half an hour before a parade was due. He finished his can then patted the steps before moving himself on.
The locals who know him know he lost good friends out there and know he'll be out of the way before the VIPs arrive.
The "patriots" would probably kick off. The same "patriots" who nearly joined up if it weren't for a minor medical condition.
We should educate the young so that they do not repeat our mistakes. We should also expect those that hold public office have a duty to remember on our behalf. Preferably with a mandatory 1 month shift working for a veterans charity rather than the typical ½ hour photo call.
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As an Irishman I've never bought or worn one for obvious reasons.
I have no issue with anyone else displaying them and respect their decision to do so.
I do however take issue with anyone who tells me that I should be ashamed of myself for not buying one as a citizen of Northern Ireland.
I'm not a fan of James McCLean at all and believe he should keep his mouth shut at times but the abuse that he and his family have suffered over the years for to his stand on poppies is beyond belief. |
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By (user no longer on site) 28 weeks ago
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I’m ex-services, some would call me a veteran although I personally don’t feel comfortable calling myself that as I didn’t do anything of note while serving.
I will be wearing a poppy because I know people that have served and ended up damaged or dead because of it, it’s to remember them and what they did.
However…. I have absolutely no issue with someone who doesn’t wish to wear a poppy or participate in Remembrance Day in any way, we’re not (yet) living in a fascist state where pseudo “Patriots” require us to.
The day that someone makes it a requirement to wear one, is the day that I will stop wearing one myself |
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"I think that the choice to wear a Poppy shows an individual appreciates the sacrifice made by people who were perhaps a lot less selfish than we as a society have become. Despite what the nay sayers think the RBL does an excellent job in supporting ex-servicemen. As with everything it is down to personal choice."
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"The thing is there’s a large difference between supporting soldiers who died in WW1 and 2 and supporting the modern military. I don’t support the modern military personally and think the term veteran has become watered down. "
a serving soldier isn't a vet, I personally pay £8.50 a month to RBL and also buy poppies, I attend my local memorial service every year to remember fallen comrades, personally I don't give two fukcs if you don't donate towards the RBL who do a fabulous job.
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I'm fully aware of the horrors those men, women and animals went through in both world wars. I also appreciate how in the last war those people died fighting fascists. I have a very distant relative buried in Flanders and have been out to his grave a couple of times.
I'll still wear a poppy to remember their sacrifice but Rememberence Sunday is becoming increasingly politicised by the far right, they've taken our flag and they are stealing our right to remember. I normally go to our local memorial service but this year it's surrounded by tatty Chinese made Union flags and St George's flags put there to intimadte. For the first times in years I think I'll go elsewhere to pay my respects. |
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"I'm fully aware of the horrors those men, women and animals went through in both world wars. I also appreciate how in the last war those people died fighting fascists. I have a very distant relative buried in Flanders and have been out to his grave a couple of times.
I'll still wear a poppy to remember their sacrifice but Rememberence Sunday is becoming increasingly politicised by the far right, they've taken our flag and they are stealing our right to remember. I normally go to our local memorial service but this year it's surrounded by tatty Chinese made Union flags and St George's flags put there to intimadte. For the first times in years I think I'll go elsewhere to pay my respects. "
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"As an Irishman I've never bought or worn one for obvious reasons.
I have no issue with anyone else displaying them and respect their decision to do so.
I do however take issue with anyone who tells me that I should be ashamed of myself for not buying one as a citizen of Northern Ireland.
I'm not a fan of James McCLean at all and believe he should keep his mouth shut at times but the abuse that he and his family have suffered over the years for to his stand on poppies is beyond belief. "
More to do with his sectarianism and pro ira ballix to be honest.
Hes an attention seeking, sectarian rat. |
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"As an Irishman I've never bought or worn one for obvious reasons.
I have no issue with anyone else displaying them and respect their decision to do so.
I do however take issue with anyone who tells me that I should be ashamed of myself for not buying one as a citizen of Northern Ireland.
I'm not a fan of James McCLean at all and believe he should keep his mouth shut at times but the abuse that he and his family have suffered over the years for to his stand on poppies is beyond belief.
More to do with his sectarianism and pro ira ballix to be honest.
Hes an attention seeking, sectarian rat. "
I've seen people in Sprucefield put money in the tin but decline the poppy. I suspect it is to avoid tension in their home community. |
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By *recticWoman 28 weeks ago
taunton |
Conscientious objection I guess. When it was to commemorate the first and second world wars people acknowledged it more. Since they changed it to commemorate all conflicts that’s when people started objecting. I know plenty of Irish people who will have nothing to do with it, I would imagine the Middle East conflict has the same ring to it as people didn’t agree with it |
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"As an Irishman I've never bought or worn one for obvious reasons.
I have no issue with anyone else displaying them and respect their decision to do so.
I do however take issue with anyone who tells me that I should be ashamed of myself for not buying one as a citizen of Northern Ireland.
I'm not a fan of James McCLean at all and believe he should keep his mouth shut at times but the abuse that he and his family have suffered over the years for to his stand on poppies is beyond belief. "
definitely not from the Shankill Road, lol |
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"As an Irishman I've never bought or worn one for obvious reasons.
I have no issue with anyone else displaying them and respect their decision to do so.
I do however take issue with anyone who tells me that I should be ashamed of myself for not buying one as a citizen of Northern Ireland.
I'm not a fan of James McCLean at all and believe he should keep his mouth shut at times but the abuse that he and his family have suffered over the years for to his stand on poppies is beyond belief. definitely not from the Shankill Road, lol"
Lol.
Best wee road in the UK.
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"What on earth is a flagshagger? "
Its a teem of abusr used by scumbags against people who fly their own countrys flag.
Yet they dont hsve an issue with foreign flags being flown and varried, usually by scumbags who call others flagshaggers. |
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By (user no longer on site) 28 weeks ago
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"What on earth is a flagshagger?
Its a teem of abusr used by scumbags against people who fly their own countrys flag.
Yet they dont hsve an issue with foreign flags being flown and varried, usually by scumbags who call others flagshaggers."
Collective name for the dumb fucks who swallow the Russian sponsored shit the traitor Farage spouts.
They support a foriegn power and think they're patriots, again because the Russian asset Farage tells them they are. |
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"What on earth is a flagshagger?
Its a teem of abusr used by scumbags against people who fly their own countrys flag.
Yet they dont hsve an issue with foreign flags being flown and varried, usually by scumbags who call others flagshaggers.
Collective name for the dumb fucks who swallow the Russian sponsored shit the traitor Farage spouts.
They support a foriegn power and think they're patriots, again because the Russian asset Farage tells them they are. "
Youre absolutely wired to the moon. |
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"What on earth is a flagshagger?
Its a teem of abusr used by scumbags against people who fly their own countrys flag.
Yet they dont hsve an issue with foreign flags being flown and varried, usually by scumbags who call others flagshaggers.
Collective name for the dumb fucks who swallow the Russian sponsored shit the traitor Farage spouts.
They support a foriegn power and think they're patriots, again because the Russian asset Farage tells them they are. "
youre basically describing tge palestine terrorist sympathisers.
British people waving foreign flags. |
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"What on earth is a flagshagger?
Its a teem of abusr used by scumbags against people who fly their own countrys flag.
Yet they dont hsve an issue with foreign flags being flown and varried, usually by scumbags who call others flagshaggers."
What's a scumbag? |
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By *etra43TV/TS 28 weeks ago
Gillingham |
It seems more likely an age thing too, I'm in my 80's now, so was born during the war so it's relevant to me as my father served and was one of the lucky ones that returned, injured but alive, when I was old enough I enlisted too, so it's relevant to me, to most people nowerdays it's something that happened in the past or have no connection to it, or the family tree of information to the younger generations is not being passed down through the family. Our time in the Falklands seem to be a skirmish in comparison to ww1 and 2 and doesn't carry so much weight and people forget easily, I do buy a lapel poppy pin yearly and proudly wear it all year round because the sacrifices were enormous.
Every one to their own how they remember and why. |
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"Never in the field of human conflict has so much been owed by so many to so few"
"They shall grow not old, as we that are left grow old:
Age shall not weary them, nor the years condemn.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning
We will remember them"!
I always buy poppies every year regardless of conflict,to remember those who gave their oath and ultimately gave their life...
At the very least "I will remember them"!❤️ |
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