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“We hold all the cards”
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"Once we gone ...watch the others follow ..italy within months next" its been said that the others are waiting in line but where is the preparation for the initial referendum? have any pro leaving parties got the majority in any other EU country as we speak? | |||
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"Once we gone ...watch the others follow ..italy within months next" Stick to the topic. Deflection - just because you don’t like it and have no counter position. “By September (2016) I expect Us to have close to 100 trade deals ready to sign.” David Davis - the man who famously signed off on the Irish backstop in December last year and then immediately claimed that it wasn’t legally binding. | |||
"Once we gone ...watch the others follow ..italy within months next" Werent the Dutch supposed to have left by now too? No-one is leaving other than us | |||
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"Brexit was only ever going to work if it precipitated the break up of the eu. That's what leavers counted on, that we could negotiate deals with each country separately. As it is, the EU has maintained impressive solidarity with the result that the UK is faced with negotiating with an organisation with much greater resources with predictable results. The leavers then start moaning about bullying etc. If Andorra declares war on China, it can hardly complain when it gets obliterated.. " Like the analogy! | |||
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"Once we gone ...watch the others follow ..italy within months next" Yes, I'm sure they're all watching very closely and thinking: "yes, that sort of chaos is just what we want." | |||
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"Once we gone ...watch the others follow ..italy within months next Stick to the topic. Deflection - just because you don’t like it and have no counter position. “By September (2016) I expect Us to have close to 100 trade deals ready to sign.” David Davis - the man who famously signed off on the Irish backstop in December last year and then immediately claimed that it wasn’t legally binding. " can I ask why you started this topic ? did this just come to you in yr hot tub again ? | |||
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"I would imagine a deal was agreed a while back. They are just posturing on both sides and waiting for time to announce then hand over to civil servants to sort out." Yes, it's possible to imagine all sorts of implausible scenarios. | |||
"Once we gone ...watch the others follow ..italy within months next Stick to the topic. Deflection - just because you don’t like it and have no counter position. “By September (2016) I expect Us to have close to 100 trade deals ready to sign.” David Davis - the man who famously signed off on the Irish backstop in December last year and then immediately claimed that it wasn’t legally binding. can I ask why you started this topic ? did this just come to you in yr hot tub again ?" Do I need specific permission to start a thread? If I want to start a thread I will and I am always happy to illustrate the total sham that is the so called “leadership” of our Brexit Negotiators. Never has so little been delivered over so long, with such appalling incompetence demonstrated on an almost daily basis. It is almost as if this secret plan they had they were not going to divulge didn’t actually exist at all. As Michel Barnier said in May last year, three months after A50 was signed... “I can’t negotiate with myself.” | |||
"Once we gone ...watch the others follow ..italy within months next Stick to the topic. Deflection - just because you don’t like it and have no counter position. “By September (2016) I expect Us to have close to 100 trade deals ready to sign.” David Davis - the man who famously signed off on the Irish backstop in December last year and then immediately claimed that it wasn’t legally binding. can I ask why you started this topic ? did this just come to you in yr hot tub again ? Do I need specific permission to start a thread? If I want to start a thread I will and I am always happy to illustrate the total sham that is the so called “leadership” of our Brexit Negotiators. Never has so little been delivered over so long, with such appalling incompetence demonstrated on an almost daily basis. It is almost as if this secret plan they had they were not going to divulge didn’t actually exist at all. As Michel Barnier said in May last year, three months after A50 was signed... “I can’t negotiate with myself.”" no of course you don’t it’s upto you whatever you post it’s just as I thought a thread to do more bitching about brexit crack on mate | |||
"Once we gone ...watch the others follow ..italy within months next Stick to the topic. Deflection - just because you don’t like it and have no counter position. “By September (2016) I expect Us to have close to 100 trade deals ready to sign.” David Davis - the man who famously signed off on the Irish backstop in December last year and then immediately claimed that it wasn’t legally binding. can I ask why you started this topic ? did this just come to you in yr hot tub again ? Do I need specific permission to start a thread? If I want to start a thread I will and I am always happy to illustrate the total sham that is the so called “leadership” of our Brexit Negotiators. Never has so little been delivered over so long, with such appalling incompetence demonstrated on an almost daily basis. It is almost as if this secret plan they had they were not going to divulge didn’t actually exist at all. As Michel Barnier said in May last year, three months after A50 was signed... “I can’t negotiate with myself.” no of course you don’t it’s upto you whatever you post it’s just as I thought a thread to do more bitching about brexit crack on mate " Nobody - Brexit supporter or Remainer can possibly be happy with the things that these people have said and what is actually being delivered. Our country is being embarrassed on the European and world stage. | |||
"Once we gone ...watch the others follow ..italy within months next Stick to the topic. Deflection - just because you don’t like it and have no counter position. “By September (2016) I expect Us to have close to 100 trade deals ready to sign.” David Davis - the man who famously signed off on the Irish backstop in December last year and then immediately claimed that it wasn’t legally binding. can I ask why you started this topic ? did this just come to you in yr hot tub again ? Do I need specific permission to start a thread? If I want to start a thread I will and I am always happy to illustrate the total sham that is the so called “leadership” of our Brexit Negotiators. Never has so little been delivered over so long, with such appalling incompetence demonstrated on an almost daily basis. It is almost as if this secret plan they had they were not going to divulge didn’t actually exist at all. As Michel Barnier said in May last year, three months after A50 was signed... “I can’t negotiate with myself.” no of course you don’t it’s upto you whatever you post it’s just as I thought a thread to do more bitching about brexit crack on mate Nobody - Brexit supporter or Remainer can possibly be happy with the things that these people have said and what is actually being delivered. Our country is being embarrassed on the European and world stage." agree it’s a bastard shambles but what can we do about it nothing the biggest embarrassment for me personally is the divide between leavers and remainers after two yrs still bitching at eachother point scoring name calling We ain’t having another vote we are leaving so we should just crack on and see where we are in a few yrs time | |||
"Once we gone ...watch the others follow ..italy within months next Stick to the topic. Deflection - just because you don’t like it and have no counter position. “By September (2016) I expect Us to have close to 100 trade deals ready to sign.” David Davis - the man who famously signed off on the Irish backstop in December last year and then immediately claimed that it wasn’t legally binding. can I ask why you started this topic ? did this just come to you in yr hot tub again ? Do I need specific permission to start a thread? If I want to start a thread I will and I am always happy to illustrate the total sham that is the so called “leadership” of our Brexit Negotiators. Never has so little been delivered over so long, with such appalling incompetence demonstrated on an almost daily basis. It is almost as if this secret plan they had they were not going to divulge didn’t actually exist at all. As Michel Barnier said in May last year, three months after A50 was signed... “I can’t negotiate with myself.” no of course you don’t it’s upto you whatever you post it’s just as I thought a thread to do more bitching about brexit crack on mate Nobody - Brexit supporter or Remainer can possibly be happy with the things that these people have said and what is actually being delivered. Our country is being embarrassed on the European and world stage. agree it’s a bastard shambles but what can we do about it nothing the biggest embarrassment for me personally is the divide between leavers and remainers after two yrs still bitching at eachother point scoring name calling We ain’t having another vote we are leaving so we should just crack on and see where we are in a few yrs time " imo the bigger shambles is that leavers can’t agree what leave means. I voted remain as the uncertainty of what brexit could mean seemed to have too much downside risk to offset the promise of upside. This has just got worse, not better, since the vote. The idea of crack on seems at best brave and at worst foolish. | |||
"Once we gone ...watch the others follow ..italy within months next Stick to the topic. Deflection - just because you don’t like it and have no counter position. “By September (2016) I expect Us to have close to 100 trade deals ready to sign.” David Davis - the man who famously signed off on the Irish backstop in December last year and then immediately claimed that it wasn’t legally binding. can I ask why you started this topic ? did this just come to you in yr hot tub again ? Do I need specific permission to start a thread? If I want to start a thread I will and I am always happy to illustrate the total sham that is the so called “leadership” of our Brexit Negotiators. Never has so little been delivered over so long, with such appalling incompetence demonstrated on an almost daily basis. It is almost as if this secret plan they had they were not going to divulge didn’t actually exist at all. As Michel Barnier said in May last year, three months after A50 was signed... “I can’t negotiate with myself.” no of course you don’t it’s upto you whatever you post it’s just as I thought a thread to do more bitching about brexit crack on mate Nobody - Brexit supporter or Remainer can possibly be happy with the things that these people have said and what is actually being delivered. Our country is being embarrassed on the European and world stage. agree it’s a bastard shambles but what can we do about it nothing the biggest embarrassment for me personally is the divide between leavers and remainers after two yrs still bitching at eachother point scoring name calling We ain’t having another vote we are leaving so we should just crack on and see where we are in a few yrs time imo the bigger shambles is that leavers can’t agree what leave means. I voted remain as the uncertainty of what brexit could mean seemed to have too much downside risk to offset the promise of upside. This has just got worse, not better, since the vote. The idea of crack on seems at best brave and at worst foolish. " but there’s nothing you me anyone on here can do about it so what do you suggest keeping bitching on about it how’s that help tho ? | |||
"Once we gone ...watch the others follow ..italy within months next Stick to the topic. Deflection - just because you don’t like it and have no counter position. “By September (2016) I expect Us to have close to 100 trade deals ready to sign.” David Davis - the man who famously signed off on the Irish backstop in December last year and then immediately claimed that it wasn’t legally binding. can I ask why you started this topic ? did this just come to you in yr hot tub again ? Do I need specific permission to start a thread? If I want to start a thread I will and I am always happy to illustrate the total sham that is the so called “leadership” of our Brexit Negotiators. Never has so little been delivered over so long, with such appalling incompetence demonstrated on an almost daily basis. It is almost as if this secret plan they had they were not going to divulge didn’t actually exist at all. As Michel Barnier said in May last year, three months after A50 was signed... “I can’t negotiate with myself.” no of course you don’t it’s upto you whatever you post it’s just as I thought a thread to do more bitching about brexit crack on mate Nobody - Brexit supporter or Remainer can possibly be happy with the things that these people have said and what is actually being delivered. Our country is being embarrassed on the European and world stage. agree it’s a bastard shambles but what can we do about it nothing the biggest embarrassment for me personally is the divide between leavers and remainers after two yrs still bitching at eachother point scoring name calling We ain’t having another vote we are leaving so we should just crack on and see where we are in a few yrs time imo the bigger shambles is that leavers can’t agree what leave means. I voted remain as the uncertainty of what brexit could mean seemed to have too much downside risk to offset the promise of upside. This has just got worse, not better, since the vote. The idea of crack on seems at best brave and at worst foolish. but there’s nothing you me anyone on here can do about it so what do you suggest keeping bitching on about it how’s that help tho ?" if the popular opinion was towards a second reforendum (say) and politicians felt their seat (or party) was at risk if they didn’t listen ... they’d do something. After all, this fear set the last reforendum in play ... | |||
"Once we gone ...watch the others follow ..italy within months next Stick to the topic. Deflection - just because you don’t like it and have no counter position. “By September (2016) I expect Us to have close to 100 trade deals ready to sign.” David Davis - the man who famously signed off on the Irish backstop in December last year and then immediately claimed that it wasn’t legally binding. can I ask why you started this topic ? did this just come to you in yr hot tub again ? Do I need specific permission to start a thread? If I want to start a thread I will and I am always happy to illustrate the total sham that is the so called “leadership” of our Brexit Negotiators. Never has so little been delivered over so long, with such appalling incompetence demonstrated on an almost daily basis. It is almost as if this secret plan they had they were not going to divulge didn’t actually exist at all. As Michel Barnier said in May last year, three months after A50 was signed... “I can’t negotiate with myself.” no of course you don’t it’s upto you whatever you post it’s just as I thought a thread to do more bitching about brexit crack on mate Nobody - Brexit supporter or Remainer can possibly be happy with the things that these people have said and what is actually being delivered. Our country is being embarrassed on the European and world stage. agree it’s a bastard shambles but what can we do about it nothing the biggest embarrassment for me personally is the divide between leavers and remainers after two yrs still bitching at eachother point scoring name calling We ain’t having another vote we are leaving so we should just crack on and see where we are in a few yrs time " And if it's a failure - what's your suggestion (hypothetical ) ? | |||
"Once we gone ...watch the others follow ..italy within months next Stick to the topic. Deflection - just because you don’t like it and have no counter position. “By September (2016) I expect Us to have close to 100 trade deals ready to sign.” David Davis - the man who famously signed off on the Irish backstop in December last year and then immediately claimed that it wasn’t legally binding. can I ask why you started this topic ? did this just come to you in yr hot tub again ? Do I need specific permission to start a thread? If I want to start a thread I will and I am always happy to illustrate the total sham that is the so called “leadership” of our Brexit Negotiators. Never has so little been delivered over so long, with such appalling incompetence demonstrated on an almost daily basis. It is almost as if this secret plan they had they were not going to divulge didn’t actually exist at all. As Michel Barnier said in May last year, three months after A50 was signed... “I can’t negotiate with myself.” no of course you don’t it’s upto you whatever you post it’s just as I thought a thread to do more bitching about brexit crack on mate Nobody - Brexit supporter or Remainer can possibly be happy with the things that these people have said and what is actually being delivered. Our country is being embarrassed on the European and world stage. agree it’s a bastard shambles but what can we do about it nothing the biggest embarrassment for me personally is the divide between leavers and remainers after two yrs still bitching at eachother point scoring name calling We ain’t having another vote we are leaving so we should just crack on and see where we are in a few yrs time imo the bigger shambles is that leavers can’t agree what leave means. I voted remain as the uncertainty of what brexit could mean seemed to have too much downside risk to offset the promise of upside. This has just got worse, not better, since the vote. The idea of crack on seems at best brave and at worst foolish. but there’s nothing you me anyone on here can do about it so what do you suggest keeping bitching on about it how’s that help tho ?if the popular opinion was towards a second reforendum (say) and politicians felt their seat (or party) was at risk if they didn’t listen ... they’d do something. After all, this fear set the last reforendum in play ..." ok so you want a second vote then and if we had it and was leave again then what ? Another vote ? | |||
"Once we gone ...watch the others follow ..italy within months next Stick to the topic. Deflection - just because you don’t like it and have no counter position. “By September (2016) I expect Us to have close to 100 trade deals ready to sign.” David Davis - the man who famously signed off on the Irish backstop in December last year and then immediately claimed that it wasn’t legally binding. can I ask why you started this topic ? did this just come to you in yr hot tub again ? Do I need specific permission to start a thread? If I want to start a thread I will and I am always happy to illustrate the total sham that is the so called “leadership” of our Brexit Negotiators. Never has so little been delivered over so long, with such appalling incompetence demonstrated on an almost daily basis. It is almost as if this secret plan they had they were not going to divulge didn’t actually exist at all. As Michel Barnier said in May last year, three months after A50 was signed... “I can’t negotiate with myself.” no of course you don’t it’s upto you whatever you post it’s just as I thought a thread to do more bitching about brexit crack on mate Nobody - Brexit supporter or Remainer can possibly be happy with the things that these people have said and what is actually being delivered. Our country is being embarrassed on the European and world stage. agree it’s a bastard shambles but what can we do about it nothing the biggest embarrassment for me personally is the divide between leavers and remainers after two yrs still bitching at eachother point scoring name calling We ain’t having another vote we are leaving so we should just crack on and see where we are in a few yrs time imo the bigger shambles is that leavers can’t agree what leave means. I voted remain as the uncertainty of what brexit could mean seemed to have too much downside risk to offset the promise of upside. This has just got worse, not better, since the vote. The idea of crack on seems at best brave and at worst foolish. but there’s nothing you me anyone on here can do about it so what do you suggest keeping bitching on about it how’s that help tho ?if the popular opinion was towards a second reforendum (say) and politicians felt their seat (or party) was at risk if they didn’t listen ... they’d do something. After all, this fear set the last reforendum in play ... ok so you want a second vote then and if we had it and was leave again then what ? Another vote ?" That old chestnut. I wasn’t arguing for a second vote. Just that a second vote could happen if political pressure was applied. Anyway, I engage not because I have a strong view either way. But do care about how people come to their decisions. Brexit has shown how poorly people engage with politics and make decisions. One former poster here implied he (and others) voted brexit because of british-Pakistani sex rings. That’s scary imo | |||
"Once we gone ...watch the others follow ..italy within months next Stick to the topic. Deflection - just because you don’t like it and have no counter position. “By September (2016) I expect Us to have close to 100 trade deals ready to sign.” David Davis - the man who famously signed off on the Irish backstop in December last year and then immediately claimed that it wasn’t legally binding. can I ask why you started this topic ? did this just come to you in yr hot tub again ? Do I need specific permission to start a thread? If I want to start a thread I will and I am always happy to illustrate the total sham that is the so called “leadership” of our Brexit Negotiators. Never has so little been delivered over so long, with such appalling incompetence demonstrated on an almost daily basis. It is almost as if this secret plan they had they were not going to divulge didn’t actually exist at all. As Michel Barnier said in May last year, three months after A50 was signed... “I can’t negotiate with myself.” no of course you don’t it’s upto you whatever you post it’s just as I thought a thread to do more bitching about brexit crack on mate Nobody - Brexit supporter or Remainer can possibly be happy with the things that these people have said and what is actually being delivered. Our country is being embarrassed on the European and world stage. agree it’s a bastard shambles but what can we do about it nothing the biggest embarrassment for me personally is the divide between leavers and remainers after two yrs still bitching at eachother point scoring name calling We ain’t having another vote we are leaving so we should just crack on and see where we are in a few yrs time " Interesting point about the ongoing division between leavers and remainers. Brexit is roughly panning out as expected by most people on both sides. But I certainly didn’t think that it would have left this huge rift. In my personal life, I don’t know any leavers, (or I should say, I don’t know anyone who is openly a leaver). So I don’t have any first hand experience of this, but you see it in parliament, in the news papers and on line. I genuinely have no idea what the answer is. It seems to me that people on both sides genuinely believe they’re completely right and that there is little or no merit to the other side of the argument. I can see plenty wrong with the EU, but these things I don’t like, are rarely ever mentioned. | |||
"I don't know what you're talking about Britain absolutely does hold all the cards. Mainly because the EU is playing backgammon while they wait for us to figure out what we're doing, so the whole pack was just lying around on a side table. Now, if only the British government (or, more accurately, the Tories) could decide whether they want to play poker, bridge, whist, baccarat, gin rummy or snap, we might make a bit of progress." lol | |||
"I don't know what you're talking about Britain absolutely does hold all the cards. Mainly because the EU is playing backgammon while they wait for us to figure out what we're doing, so the whole pack was just lying around on a side table. Now, if only the British government (or, more accurately, the Tories) could decide whether they want to play poker, bridge, whist, baccarat, gin rummy or snap, we might make a bit of progress." unfortunately the only card game that this bunch of retarded righties in charge know is bottom trumps and they still haven't grasped that entirely | |||
"Once we gone ...watch the others follow ..italy within months next Stick to the topic. Deflection - just because you don’t like it and have no counter position. “By September (2016) I expect Us to have close to 100 trade deals ready to sign.” David Davis - the man who famously signed off on the Irish backstop in December last year and then immediately claimed that it wasn’t legally binding. can I ask why you started this topic ? did this just come to you in yr hot tub again ? Do I need specific permission to start a thread? If I want to start a thread I will and I am always happy to illustrate the total sham that is the so called “leadership” of our Brexit Negotiators. Never has so little been delivered over so long, with such appalling incompetence demonstrated on an almost daily basis. It is almost as if this secret plan they had they were not going to divulge didn’t actually exist at all. As Michel Barnier said in May last year, three months after A50 was signed... “I can’t negotiate with myself.” no of course you don’t it’s upto you whatever you post it’s just as I thought a thread to do more bitching about brexit crack on mate Nobody - Brexit supporter or Remainer can possibly be happy with the things that these people have said and what is actually being delivered. Our country is being embarrassed on the European and world stage. agree it’s a bastard shambles but what can we do about it nothing the biggest embarrassment for me personally is the divide between leavers and remainers after two yrs still bitching at eachother point scoring name calling We ain’t having another vote we are leaving so we should just crack on and see where we are in a few yrs time " I think that the future is very much up in the air and I don’t think anything can be ruled in or out. Parliament “should” not allow the U.K. to crash out of the EU and damage the country. There is no majority in Parliament for any version of Brexit and that should have been obvious and evident after a virtual 50/50 referendum. If Parliament cannot pass any kind of Brexit legislation - then what? The only plausible solution is for it to be passed back to the people and anything would then be possible. | |||
"Once we gone ...watch the others follow ..italy within months next Stick to the topic. Deflection - just because you don’t like it and have no counter position. “By September (2016) I expect Us to have close to 100 trade deals ready to sign.” David Davis - the man who famously signed off on the Irish backstop in December last year and then immediately claimed that it wasn’t legally binding. can I ask why you started this topic ? did this just come to you in yr hot tub again ? Do I need specific permission to start a thread? If I want to start a thread I will and I am always happy to illustrate the total sham that is the so called “leadership” of our Brexit Negotiators. Never has so little been delivered over so long, with such appalling incompetence demonstrated on an almost daily basis. It is almost as if this secret plan they had they were not going to divulge didn’t actually exist at all. As Michel Barnier said in May last year, three months after A50 was signed... “I can’t negotiate with myself.” no of course you don’t it’s upto you whatever you post it’s just as I thought a thread to do more bitching about brexit crack on mate Nobody - Brexit supporter or Remainer can possibly be happy with the things that these people have said and what is actually being delivered. Our country is being embarrassed on the European and world stage. agree it’s a bastard shambles but what can we do about it nothing the biggest embarrassment for me personally is the divide between leavers and remainers after two yrs still bitching at eachother point scoring name calling We ain’t having another vote we are leaving so we should just crack on and see where we are in a few yrs time I think that the future is very much up in the air and I don’t think anything can be ruled in or out. Parliament “should” not allow the U.K. to crash out of the EU and damage the country. There is no majority in Parliament for any version of Brexit and that should have been obvious and evident after a virtual 50/50 referendum. If Parliament cannot pass any kind of Brexit legislation - then what? The only plausible solution is for it to be passed back to the people and anything would then be possible." . What do you mean by virtual 50/50 referendum.That was not the result | |||
"Once we gone ...watch the others follow ..italy within months next Stick to the topic. Deflection - just because you don’t like it and have no counter position. “By September (2016) I expect Us to have close to 100 trade deals ready to sign.” David Davis - the man who famously signed off on the Irish backstop in December last year and then immediately claimed that it wasn’t legally binding. can I ask why you started this topic ? did this just come to you in yr hot tub again ? Do I need specific permission to start a thread? If I want to start a thread I will and I am always happy to illustrate the total sham that is the so called “leadership” of our Brexit Negotiators. Never has so little been delivered over so long, with such appalling incompetence demonstrated on an almost daily basis. It is almost as if this secret plan they had they were not going to divulge didn’t actually exist at all. As Michel Barnier said in May last year, three months after A50 was signed... “I can’t negotiate with myself.” no of course you don’t it’s upto you whatever you post it’s just as I thought a thread to do more bitching about brexit crack on mate Nobody - Brexit supporter or Remainer can possibly be happy with the things that these people have said and what is actually being delivered. Our country is being embarrassed on the European and world stage. agree it’s a bastard shambles but what can we do about it nothing the biggest embarrassment for me personally is the divide between leavers and remainers after two yrs still bitching at eachother point scoring name calling We ain’t having another vote we are leaving so we should just crack on and see where we are in a few yrs time I think that the future is very much up in the air and I don’t think anything can be ruled in or out. Parliament “should” not allow the U.K. to crash out of the EU and damage the country. There is no majority in Parliament for any version of Brexit and that should have been obvious and evident after a virtual 50/50 referendum. If Parliament cannot pass any kind of Brexit legislation - then what? The only plausible solution is for it to be passed back to the people and anything would then be possible.. What do you mean by virtual 50/50 referendum.That was not the result " You want to argue semantics or try to understand why the country is split, Parliament is split and the Govt is split? A virtual 50:50 split should have been warning enough that Parliament would not be able to pass the ultimate Brexit legislation. | |||
"Once we gone ...watch the others follow ..italy within months next Stick to the topic. Deflection - just because you don’t like it and have no counter position. “By September (2016) I expect Us to have close to 100 trade deals ready to sign.” David Davis - the man who famously signed off on the Irish backstop in December last year and then immediately claimed that it wasn’t legally binding. can I ask why you started this topic ? did this just come to you in yr hot tub again ? Do I need specific permission to start a thread? If I want to start a thread I will and I am always happy to illustrate the total sham that is the so called “leadership” of our Brexit Negotiators. Never has so little been delivered over so long, with such appalling incompetence demonstrated on an almost daily basis. It is almost as if this secret plan they had they were not going to divulge didn’t actually exist at all. As Michel Barnier said in May last year, three months after A50 was signed... “I can’t negotiate with myself.” no of course you don’t it’s upto you whatever you post it’s just as I thought a thread to do more bitching about brexit crack on mate Nobody - Brexit supporter or Remainer can possibly be happy with the things that these people have said and what is actually being delivered. Our country is being embarrassed on the European and world stage. agree it’s a bastard shambles but what can we do about it nothing the biggest embarrassment for me personally is the divide between leavers and remainers after two yrs still bitching at eachother point scoring name calling We ain’t having another vote we are leaving so we should just crack on and see where we are in a few yrs time I think that the future is very much up in the air and I don’t think anything can be ruled in or out. Parliament “should” not allow the U.K. to crash out of the EU and damage the country. There is no majority in Parliament for any version of Brexit and that should have been obvious and evident after a virtual 50/50 referendum. If Parliament cannot pass any kind of Brexit legislation - then what? The only plausible solution is for it to be passed back to the people and anything would then be possible.. What do you mean by virtual 50/50 referendum.That was not the result You want to argue semantics or try to understand why the country is split, Parliament is split and the Govt is split? A virtual 50:50 split should have been warning enough that Parliament would not be able to pass the ultimate Brexit legislation." _oo hot do you realy think that’s what’s going to happen it been passed back to the ppl ? | |||
"Once we gone ...watch the others follow ..italy within months next Stick to the topic. Deflection - just because you don’t like it and have no counter position. “By September (2016) I expect Us to have close to 100 trade deals ready to sign.” David Davis - the man who famously signed off on the Irish backstop in December last year and then immediately claimed that it wasn’t legally binding. can I ask why you started this topic ? did this just come to you in yr hot tub again ? Do I need specific permission to start a thread? If I want to start a thread I will and I am always happy to illustrate the total sham that is the so called “leadership” of our Brexit Negotiators. Never has so little been delivered over so long, with such appalling incompetence demonstrated on an almost daily basis. It is almost as if this secret plan they had they were not going to divulge didn’t actually exist at all. As Michel Barnier said in May last year, three months after A50 was signed... “I can’t negotiate with myself.” no of course you don’t it’s upto you whatever you post it’s just as I thought a thread to do more bitching about brexit crack on mate Nobody - Brexit supporter or Remainer can possibly be happy with the things that these people have said and what is actually being delivered. Our country is being embarrassed on the European and world stage. agree it’s a bastard shambles but what can we do about it nothing the biggest embarrassment for me personally is the divide between leavers and remainers after two yrs still bitching at eachother point scoring name calling We ain’t having another vote we are leaving so we should just crack on and see where we are in a few yrs time I think that the future is very much up in the air and I don’t think anything can be ruled in or out. Parliament “should” not allow the U.K. to crash out of the EU and damage the country. There is no majority in Parliament for any version of Brexit and that should have been obvious and evident after a virtual 50/50 referendum. If Parliament cannot pass any kind of Brexit legislation - then what? The only plausible solution is for it to be passed back to the people and anything would then be possible.. What do you mean by virtual 50/50 referendum.That was not the result You want to argue semantics or try to understand why the country is split, Parliament is split and the Govt is split? A virtual 50:50 split should have been warning enough that Parliament would not be able to pass the ultimate Brexit legislation. _oo hot do you realy think that’s what’s going to happen it been passed back to the ppl ?" I don’t think it can be ruled out anymore because of the shambolic way that the Govt has handled Negotiations. There are now far too many hostile factions in Parliament that would prevent any kind of Brexit legislation getting through. If she can’t get Brexit legislation through then Parliament has to do something - but they are too divided to decide on anything themselves. | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox" That is a blatant misquote OP. What Liam Fox actually said was "Making a deal with the EU 'should' be the easiest thing is history". Try looking up the difference between 'will' and 'should' in the dictionary. And of course what Liam Fox said was absolutely correct as the UK and the EU are both starting from the position of full regulatory alignment on Brexit day number one it 'should' gave been a fairly easy deal to do. As Liam Fox has subsequently pointed out though there has been unparalleled intransigence on the part of the EU all the way through these negotiations. Also far from being embarrassed on the world stage Britain has kept it's dignity in these negotiations while the EU has shown itself up to be undiplomatic, childish, and petulant (Tusks recent taunting instagram pic a prime example). | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox That is a blatant misquote OP. What Liam Fox actually said was "Making a deal with the EU 'should' be the easiest thing is history". Try looking up the difference between 'will' and 'should' in the dictionary. And of course what Liam Fox said was absolutely correct as the UK and the EU are both starting from the position of full regulatory alignment on Brexit day number one it 'should' gave been a fairly easy deal to do. As Liam Fox has subsequently pointed out though there has been unparalleled intransigence on the part of the EU all the way through these negotiations. Also far from being embarrassed on the world stage Britain has kept it's dignity in these negotiations while the EU has shown itself up to be undiplomatic, childish, and petulant (Tusks recent taunting instagram pic a prime example). " So basically Fox had no idea of how the EU with brexit. Way to go... | |||
"Brexit was only ever going to work if it precipitated the break up of the eu. That's what leavers counted on, that we could negotiate deals with each country separately. As it is, the EU has maintained impressive solidarity with the result that the UK is faced with negotiating with an organisation with much greater resources with predictable results. The leavers then start moaning about bullying etc. If Andorra declares war on China, it can hardly complain when it gets obliterated.. " No the EU has not maintained solidarity. Bubbling under the surface it's falling apart at the seams. You have an eastern block alliance of Poland, Hungary and Italy now aligning themselves against Brussels. Add to that the ticking time bomb of the looming Eurozone crisis and the ongoing migration crisis in the Med and as well as Brexit and you have an EU in chaos. The EU is a complete shambles. | |||
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"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox That is a blatant misquote OP. What Liam Fox actually said was "Making a deal with the EU 'should' be the easiest thing is history". Try looking up the difference between 'will' and 'should' in the dictionary. And of course what Liam Fox said was absolutely correct as the UK and the EU are both starting from the position of full regulatory alignment on Brexit day number one it 'should' gave been a fairly easy deal to do. As Liam Fox has subsequently pointed out though there has been unparalleled intransigence on the part of the EU all the way through these negotiations. Also far from being embarrassed on the world stage Britain has kept it's dignity in these negotiations while the EU has shown itself up to be undiplomatic, childish, and petulant (Tusks recent taunting instagram pic a prime example). " Says rather a lot about Dr Fox's lack of political acumen dont you think? If he, or anyone else, thought that the 27 would allow the UK to break up the whole EU tey were clearly imbeciles. The EU is looking after the interests of 27 economies as they should. Fox is a 24 carat cretin | |||
"Brexit was only ever going to work if it precipitated the break up of the eu. That's what leavers counted on, that we could negotiate deals with each country separately. As it is, the EU has maintained impressive solidarity with the result that the UK is faced with negotiating with an organisation with much greater resources with predictable results. The leavers then start moaning about bullying etc. If Andorra declares war on China, it can hardly complain when it gets obliterated.. No the EU has not maintained solidarity. Bubbling under the surface it's falling apart at the seams. You have an eastern block alliance of Poland, Hungary and Italy now aligning themselves against Brussels. Add to that the ticking time bomb of the looming Eurozone crisis and the ongoing migration crisis in the Med and as well as Brexit and you have an EU in chaos. The EU is a complete shambles. " So can you tell me the EU countries with which the UK is currently negotiating independent trade deals? | |||
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"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox That is a blatant misquote OP. What Liam Fox actually said was "Making a deal with the EU 'should' be the easiest thing is history". Try looking up the difference between 'will' and 'should' in the dictionary. And of course what Liam Fox said was absolutely correct as the UK and the EU are both starting from the position of full regulatory alignment on Brexit day number one it 'should' gave been a fairly easy deal to do. As Liam Fox has subsequently pointed out though there has been unparalleled intransigence on the part of the EU all the way through these negotiations. Also far from being embarrassed on the world stage Britain has kept it's dignity in these negotiations while the EU has shown itself up to be undiplomatic, childish, and petulant (Tusks recent taunting instagram pic a prime example). " it should have been easy but politics. Like the ireland border. And other shared agreements which sit outside FTA. None of which is new news. Or should have been unexpected. However too many majored on the simple and minored in the complications. And it is this which means we still hear farage talk about Canada plus plus as tho the only thing which needs to be repolvee is the FTA. | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox That is a blatant misquote OP. What Liam Fox actually said was "Making a deal with the EU 'should' be the easiest thing is history". Try looking up the difference between 'will' and 'should' in the dictionary. And of course what Liam Fox said was absolutely correct as the UK and the EU are both starting from the position of full regulatory alignment on Brexit day number one it 'should' gave been a fairly easy deal to do. As Liam Fox has subsequently pointed out though there has been unparalleled intransigence on the part of the EU all the way through these negotiations. Also far from being embarrassed on the world stage Britain has kept it's dignity in these negotiations while the EU has shown itself up to be undiplomatic, childish, and petulant (Tusks recent taunting instagram pic a prime example). " Not to mention the right wing press headlines - which incidently started in the campaign. A bit of "those who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones". Like to give it but don't like it when it comes back. Anyone who has been through a divorce knows only too well not to "piss off" the other side! | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox That is a blatant misquote OP. What Liam Fox actually said was "Making a deal with the EU 'should' be the easiest thing is history". Try looking up the difference between 'will' and 'should' in the dictionary. And of course what Liam Fox said was absolutely correct as the UK and the EU are both starting from the position of full regulatory alignment on Brexit day number one it 'should' gave been a fairly easy deal to do. As Liam Fox has subsequently pointed out though there has been unparalleled intransigence on the part of the EU all the way through these negotiations. Also far from being embarrassed on the world stage Britain has kept it's dignity in these negotiations while the EU has shown itself up to be undiplomatic, childish, and petulant (Tusks recent taunting instagram pic a prime example). Not to mention the right wing press headlines - which incidently started in the campaign. A bit of "those who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones". Like to give it but don't like it when it comes back. Anyone who has been through a divorce knows only too well not to "piss off" the other side!" As you well know the press is independent and is completely separate to the government's negotiating strategy. | |||
"Once we gone ...watch the others follow ..italy within months next Stick to the topic. Deflection - just because you don’t like it and have no counter position. “By September (2016) I expect Us to have close to 100 trade deals ready to sign.” David Davis - the man who famously signed off on the Irish backstop in December last year and then immediately claimed that it wasn’t legally binding. can I ask why you started this topic ? did this just come to you in yr hot tub again ? Do I need specific permission to start a thread? If I want to start a thread I will and I am always happy to illustrate the total sham that is the so called “leadership” of our Brexit Negotiators. Never has so little been delivered over so long, with such appalling incompetence demonstrated on an almost daily basis. It is almost as if this secret plan they had they were not going to divulge didn’t actually exist at all. As Michel Barnier said in May last year, three months after A50 was signed... “I can’t negotiate with myself.” no of course you don’t it’s upto you whatever you post it’s just as I thought a thread to do more bitching about brexit crack on mate Nobody - Brexit supporter or Remainer can possibly be happy with the things that these people have said and what is actually being delivered. Our country is being embarrassed on the European and world stage. agree it’s a bastard shambles but what can we do about it nothing the biggest embarrassment for me personally is the divide between leavers and remainers after two yrs still bitching at eachother point scoring name calling We ain’t having another vote we are leaving so we should just crack on and see where we are in a few yrs time imo the bigger shambles is that leavers can’t agree what leave means. I voted remain as the uncertainty of what brexit could mean seemed to have too much downside risk to offset the promise of upside. This has just got worse, not better, since the vote. The idea of crack on seems at best brave and at worst foolish. but there’s nothing you me anyone on here can do about it so what do you suggest keeping bitching on about it how’s that help tho ?" It worked pretty well for Leave, who have done nothing but bitch and complain about EU/EC/EEC since 1973. And, even though they believe we're leaving for sure, they're still bitching and complaining about it now. | |||
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"One thing I'd like to know is, are they (British government) going to sell CLUSTER BOMBS to Saudi Arabia, to KILL kids and other NON COMBATENTS in Yemen?! " I should think so - even though the cluster bomb is an illegal weapon - it’s one of the things we were very good at making and I am sure in our new free trade world there will be a big market for our weaponry! | |||
"Once we gone ...watch the others follow ..italy within months next Stick to the topic. Deflection - just because you don’t like it and have no counter position. “By September (2016) I expect Us to have close to 100 trade deals ready to sign.” David Davis - the man who famously signed off on the Irish backstop in December last year and then immediately claimed that it wasn’t legally binding. can I ask why you started this topic ? did this just come to you in yr hot tub again ? Do I need specific permission to start a thread? If I want to start a thread I will and I am always happy to illustrate the total sham that is the so called “leadership” of our Brexit Negotiators. Never has so little been delivered over so long, with such appalling incompetence demonstrated on an almost daily basis. It is almost as if this secret plan they had they were not going to divulge didn’t actually exist at all. As Michel Barnier said in May last year, three months after A50 was signed... “I can’t negotiate with myself.” no of course you don’t it’s upto you whatever you post it’s just as I thought a thread to do more bitching about brexit crack on mate Nobody - Brexit supporter or Remainer can possibly be happy with the things that these people have said and what is actually being delivered. Our country is being embarrassed on the European and world stage. agree it’s a bastard shambles but what can we do about it nothing the biggest embarrassment for me personally is the divide between leavers and remainers after two yrs still bitching at eachother point scoring name calling We ain’t having another vote we are leaving so we should just crack on and see where we are in a few yrs time imo the bigger shambles is that leavers can’t agree what leave means. I voted remain as the uncertainty of what brexit could mean seemed to have too much downside risk to offset the promise of upside. This has just got worse, not better, since the vote. The idea of crack on seems at best brave and at worst foolish. but there’s nothing you me anyone on here can do about it so what do you suggest keeping bitching on about it how’s that help tho ? It worked pretty well for Leave, who have done nothing but bitch and complain about EU/EC/EEC since 1973. And, even though they believe we're leaving for sure, they're still bitching and complaining about it now." Just not as much as you and your remainer buddies though!  | |||
"One thing I'd like to know is, are they (British government) going to sell CLUSTER BOMBS to Saudi Arabia, to KILL kids and other NON COMBATENTS in Yemen?! I should think so - even though the cluster bomb is an illegal weapon - it’s one of the things we were very good at making and I am sure in our new free trade world there will be a big market for our weaponry!" Thought so | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox" Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. | |||
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"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way." Said the "German" & "Spanish" contigent - enjoying the "good life" Maybe they should have employed you as chief negotiator given your continental knowledge? | |||
"Brexit was only ever going to work if it precipitated the break up of the eu. That's what leavers counted on, that we could negotiate deals with each country separately. As it is, the EU has maintained impressive solidarity with the result that the UK is faced with negotiating with an organisation with much greater resources with predictable results. The leavers then start moaning about bullying etc. If Andorra declares war on China, it can hardly complain when it gets obliterated.. " I've explained this to brexiteers. Nationalist economic and trade policies only work if the bulk of people you interact with are doing the same. But they seem to think the world will just do as we say. | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way." You mean 6th largest and by this time next year probably 7th if India maintains its current trajectory. You should sell your negotiating strategy to the SNP as they could probably do with some advice on how to negotiate with a bigger and more powerful neighbour. I am sure it will work really well for them. | |||
"Brexit was only ever going to work if it precipitated the break up of the eu. That's what leavers counted on, that we could negotiate deals with each country separately. As it is, the EU has maintained impressive solidarity with the result that the UK is faced with negotiating with an organisation with much greater resources with predictable results. The leavers then start moaning about bullying etc. If Andorra declares war on China, it can hardly complain when it gets obliterated.. I've explained this to brexiteers. Nationalist economic and trade policies only work if the bulk of people you interact with are doing the same. But they seem to think the world will just do as we say. " actually if this was a proper relationship you would consider the EU to be the stable one... and the UK to be the "bipolar" one! it is keeps arguing with itself then how are they suppose to come out with a coherant plan to talk to the other party..... a different week a different plan, the tail is wagging (the dup!) one week... another bit flares (the ERG) another... you got me feeling sympathy for TM... I thought that would never happen!!! i am just waiting on reality to eventually dawn | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way." Having recent experience in both the retail and wholesale industry, I have to say that as far as the wine trade is involved, the vast majority of wine is from the new world. The days of European wine being popular here is gone. Every shop is selling wine from the US, Australia, New Zealand, Chile etc. Indeed many shops don’t sell any European wine at all. I’m not saying I’m happy about this, I’m not a fan of new world wine. I don’t like the taste of wood from their use of new oak vats. In Europe they use old sherry barrels, which makes for a smoother taste. But new world wine is cheaper and more easily available. So I grin and bare it, but then I am a wine snob. The point is still that nearly all the wine sold in the UK these days comes from the Southern Hemisphere... | |||
"Brexit was only ever going to work if it precipitated the break up of the eu. That's what leavers counted on, that we could negotiate deals with each country separately. As it is, the EU has maintained impressive solidarity with the result that the UK is faced with negotiating with an organisation with much greater resources with predictable results. The leavers then start moaning about bullying etc. If Andorra declares war on China, it can hardly complain when it gets obliterated.. I've explained this to brexiteers. Nationalist economic and trade policies only work if the bulk of people you interact with are doing the same. But they seem to think the world will just do as we say. actually if this was a proper relationship you would consider the EU to be the stable one... and the UK to be the "bipolar" one! it is keeps arguing with itself then how are they suppose to come out with a coherant plan to talk to the other party..... a different week a different plan, the tail is wagging (the dup!) one week... another bit flares (the ERG) another... you got me feeling sympathy for TM... I thought that would never happen!!! i am just waiting on reality to eventually dawn " but what do you think is going to happen if reality kicks in then ? | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Having recent experience in both the retail and wholesale industry, I have to say that as far as the wine trade is involved, the vast majority of wine is from the new world. The days of European wine being popular here is gone. Every shop is selling wine from the US, Australia, New Zealand, Chile etc. Indeed many shops don’t sell any European wine at all. I’m not saying I’m happy about this, I’m not a fan of new world wine. I don’t like the taste of wood from their use of new oak vats. In Europe they use old sherry barrels, which makes for a smoother taste. But new world wine is cheaper and more easily available. So I grin and bare it, but then I am a wine snob. The point is still that nearly all the wine sold in the UK these days comes from the Southern Hemisphere..." tosh ..... of the five biggest importers top is italy then france .... followed by australia a new zealand who combined import less than france by a third ..... fifth biggest importer is spain | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Having recent experience in both the retail and wholesale industry, I have to say that as far as the wine trade is involved, the vast majority of wine is from the new world. The days of European wine being popular here is gone. Every shop is selling wine from the US, Australia, New Zealand, Chile etc. Indeed many shops don’t sell any European wine at all. I’m not saying I’m happy about this, I’m not a fan of new world wine. I don’t like the taste of wood from their use of new oak vats. In Europe they use old sherry barrels, which makes for a smoother taste. But new world wine is cheaper and more easily available. So I grin and bare it, but then I am a wine snob. The point is still that nearly all the wine sold in the UK these days comes from the Southern Hemisphere... tosh ..... of the five biggest importers top is italy then france .... followed by australia a new zealand who combined import less than france by a third ..... fifth biggest importer is spain " Bullshit, just go to your local off licence and look at the wine racks. Or go to your local convenience store or even your local petrol station. Nearly all the wine is Southern Hemisphere. I am still working in the field, and know this as a fact. | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Having recent experience in both the retail and wholesale industry, I have to say that as far as the wine trade is involved, the vast majority of wine is from the new world. The days of European wine being popular here is gone. Every shop is selling wine from the US, Australia, New Zealand, Chile etc. Indeed many shops don’t sell any European wine at all. I’m not saying I’m happy about this, I’m not a fan of new world wine. I don’t like the taste of wood from their use of new oak vats. In Europe they use old sherry barrels, which makes for a smoother taste. But new world wine is cheaper and more easily available. So I grin and bare it, but then I am a wine snob. The point is still that nearly all the wine sold in the UK these days comes from the Southern Hemisphere... tosh ..... of the five biggest importers top is italy then france .... followed by australia a new zealand who combined import less than france by a third ..... fifth biggest importer is spain " thibk this depends on if you’re measuring by cost or volume. | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Having recent experience in both the retail and wholesale industry, I have to say that as far as the wine trade is involved, the vast majority of wine is from the new world. The days of European wine being popular here is gone. Every shop is selling wine from the US, Australia, New Zealand, Chile etc. Indeed many shops don’t sell any European wine at all. I’m not saying I’m happy about this, I’m not a fan of new world wine. I don’t like the taste of wood from their use of new oak vats. In Europe they use old sherry barrels, which makes for a smoother taste. But new world wine is cheaper and more easily available. So I grin and bare it, but then I am a wine snob. The point is still that nearly all the wine sold in the UK these days comes from the Southern Hemisphere... tosh ..... of the five biggest importers top is italy then france .... followed by australia a new zealand who combined import less than france by a third ..... fifth biggest importer is spain " Exactly - the reality outweighs the veracity of the self confessed wine snob FFS. | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Having recent experience in both the retail and wholesale industry, I have to say that as far as the wine trade is involved, the vast majority of wine is from the new world. The days of European wine being popular here is gone. Every shop is selling wine from the US, Australia, New Zealand, Chile etc. Indeed many shops don’t sell any European wine at all. I’m not saying I’m happy about this, I’m not a fan of new world wine. I don’t like the taste of wood from their use of new oak vats. In Europe they use old sherry barrels, which makes for a smoother taste. But new world wine is cheaper and more easily available. So I grin and bare it, but then I am a wine snob. The point is still that nearly all the wine sold in the UK these days comes from the Southern Hemisphere... tosh ..... of the five biggest importers top is italy then france .... followed by australia a new zealand who combined import less than france by a third ..... fifth biggest importer is spain Exactly - the reality outweighs the veracity of the self confessed wine snob FFS. " as above, I suspect he’s correct if we measure by bottles. But as it’s cheap plonk the new world stuff is less significant when measured by £. | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Having recent experience in both the retail and wholesale industry, I have to say that as far as the wine trade is involved, the vast majority of wine is from the new world. The days of European wine being popular here is gone. Every shop is selling wine from the US, Australia, New Zealand, Chile etc. Indeed many shops don’t sell any European wine at all. I’m not saying I’m happy about this, I’m not a fan of new world wine. I don’t like the taste of wood from their use of new oak vats. In Europe they use old sherry barrels, which makes for a smoother taste. But new world wine is cheaper and more easily available. So I grin and bare it, but then I am a wine snob. The point is still that nearly all the wine sold in the UK these days comes from the Southern Hemisphere..."  The uk's largest pub chain Wetherspoons already made public they were ditching all EU produced wine, beer and spirits months ago. | |||
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"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Having recent experience in both the retail and wholesale industry, I have to say that as far as the wine trade is involved, the vast majority of wine is from the new world. The days of European wine being popular here is gone. Every shop is selling wine from the US, Australia, New Zealand, Chile etc. Indeed many shops don’t sell any European wine at all. I’m not saying I’m happy about this, I’m not a fan of new world wine. I don’t like the taste of wood from their use of new oak vats. In Europe they use old sherry barrels, which makes for a smoother taste. But new world wine is cheaper and more easily available. So I grin and bare it, but then I am a wine snob. The point is still that nearly all the wine sold in the UK these days comes from the Southern Hemisphere... tosh ..... of the five biggest importers top is italy then france .... followed by australia a new zealand who combined import less than france by a third ..... fifth biggest importer is spain Exactly - the reality outweighs the veracity of the self confessed wine snob FFS. " Go and look in your local offie, the wine on sale will tell the tale. I don’t like having to shop around for my fav Spanish or Italian wine. I like French wine too, but they are hard to find and very pricey. I remember when we had the Beaujolais Nouveau races back in the day. On the third Thursday in November, and the free tasting on the day. Those days are gone I’m afraid, French wines are not as popular as they were in the 1990’s. FACT. | |||
"If you are talking corner shop, convenience store and petrol station you are working to the lowest common denominator - a lot of cheap Southern Hemisphere and American plonk that the likes of Nisa and Booker but in enormous quantity to flog to the masses. If on the other hand you go to supermarkets or better still wine shops you will find a huge amount of diversity. " A quick Google shows the following wine imports into the UK by value Italy £669 million France £665 million New Zealand £256 million Australia £244 million Spain £240 million So about 75% of the top five wine importers by value is from EU countries. But then, who needs facts.. | |||
"If you are talking corner shop, convenience store and petrol station you are working to the lowest common denominator - a lot of cheap Southern Hemisphere and American plonk that the likes of Nisa and Booker but in enormous quantity to flog to the masses. If on the other hand you go to supermarkets or better still wine shops you will find a huge amount of diversity. A quick Google shows the following wine imports into the UK by value Italy £669 million France £665 million New Zealand £256 million Australia £244 million Spain £240 million So about 75% of the top five wine importers by value is from EU countries. But then, who needs facts.. " never let them get in between the falangists and their agenda | |||
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"The conservatives want the electorate to play Russian roulette - leaving it until the eleventh hour to have a crap offer (maybe, if lucky ). The referendum wasn't about the country or the electorate - only about the conservatives and keeping power. So any old bullshit was shouted out to you, whilst a compliant media largely gave no criticism. People with very limited expertise talking up the ease of an exit agreement, the world on its knees begging to sign trade agreements so the UK could become strong and independent again, like the goode olde days. Words are cheap. The conservatives are such a pile of steaming back-stabbing ideologically driven Muppets - but desperate to cling on to the trappings of power that your vote hands to them, it's tragic that their desperation is your downfall. They were and continue to be imploding, whilst the country and its citizens future counts for nought. Keeping money for the very wealthy, allowing disaster capitalism to prosper for the few, whilst the gun is held to your head - not theirs. As their gimp, its important to continue to accept whatever BS is peddled. No need to worry your little head about a backstop to a backstop etc. They've been clear from the start - it's a piece of piss" This | |||
"If you are talking corner shop, convenience store and petrol station you are working to the lowest common denominator - a lot of cheap Southern Hemisphere and American plonk that the likes of Nisa and Booker but in enormous quantity to flog to the masses. If on the other hand you go to supermarkets or better still wine shops you will find a huge amount of diversity. A quick Google shows the following wine imports into the UK by value Italy £669 million France £665 million New Zealand £256 million Australia £244 million Spain £240 million So about 75% of the top five wine importers by value is from EU countries. But then, who needs facts.. never let them get in between the falangists and their agenda "Until you agree on which metric to measure by, you’re arguing at cross purposes. Given preacehaven seemed to be talking about amount (volume) not amount (monetary) he seems to have his facts right. Or at least you haven’t counterproven his point. | |||
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"If you are talking corner shop, convenience store and petrol station you are working to the lowest common denominator - a lot of cheap Southern Hemisphere and American plonk that the likes of Nisa and Booker but in enormous quantity to flog to the masses. If on the other hand you go to supermarkets or better still wine shops you will find a huge amount of diversity. A quick Google shows the following wine imports into the UK by value Italy £669 million France £665 million New Zealand £256 million Australia £244 million Spain £240 million So about 75% of the top five wine importers by value is from EU countries. But then, who needs facts.. never let them get in between the falangists and their agenda
Until you agree on which metric to measure by, you’re arguing at cross purposes. Given preacehaven seemed to be talking about amount (volume) not amount (monetary) he seems to have his facts right. Or at least you haven’t counterproven his point. "nope ... he's just relayed how it appears from the shelves of bargain booze ... no figures | |||
"If you are talking corner shop, convenience store and petrol station you are working to the lowest common denominator - a lot of cheap Southern Hemisphere and American plonk that the likes of Nisa and Booker but in enormous quantity to flog to the masses. If on the other hand you go to supermarkets or better still wine shops you will find a huge amount of diversity. A quick Google shows the following wine imports into the UK by value Italy £669 million France £665 million New Zealand £256 million Australia £244 million Spain £240 million So about 75% of the top five wine importers by value is from EU countries. But then, who needs facts.. " I don’t care what google says, I am in a cash and carry that sells new world wine all day long every day. I’m not googling, I’m in a position to see the volume of sales. Nobody is buying European wine. Not the shops, and more importantly not the restaurants. Fact, whether you or I like it or not! | |||
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"Data published jointly by Vinexpo and IWSR shows that Australia exports the most still wine to the UK, by volume. In 2016, the UK imported 24.5 million nine litre cases of Australian wines, equivalent to nearly 300 million bottles of wine. This was followed by the US, which accounted for 15.7 million nine litre cases of wine imported, closely followed by France at 15 million cases. " I rest my case! | |||
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"out of date figures .... good work " That was just the start, new world wines are even more popular now than they were in 2016. | |||
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"out of date figures .... good work That was just the start, new world wines are even more popular now than they were in 2016." maybe ... but still smaller market share | |||
" out of date figures .... good work That was just the start, new world wines are even more popular now than they were in 2016. maybe ... but still smaller market share " No way, it is what it is. | |||
" No way, it is what it is." ... and it is bollocks | |||
" No way, it is what it is. ... and it is bollocks " Nah, I know what I’m talking about, you are just going by what you are looking for on google. You are the one talking bollocks... | |||
" No way, it is what it is. ... and it is bollocks Nah, I know what I’m talking about, you are just going by what you are looking for on google. You are the one talking bollocks... " I have 75,000 worth of domain de la romance conti aside from an extensive investment in other vinyards ...you have had a quick look at a shelf in bookers ... you're talking twaddle about a subject of which you clearly know diddly squat | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way." We are the 6th largest economy now and dropping down the league table. Your negotiating strategy would have been as utterly useless as that deployed by the current shower | |||
" No way, it is what it is. ... and it is bollocks Nah, I know what I’m talking about, you are just going by what you are looking for on google. You are the one talking bollocks... I have 75,000 worth of domain de la romance conti aside from an extensive investment in other vinyards ...you have had a quick look at a shelf in bookers ... you're talking twaddle about a subject of which you clearly know diddly squat " A quick look? I’m working in the trade, im involved in the wholesale selling of wine to shops and restaurants. I know what is selling and what is not. The sad truth is that European wine is nowhere near as popular as it was. I remember when Bulgarian wine was all the rage, and even German wine Liebfraumilch was immensely popular, those days are gone. | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Having recent experience in both the retail and wholesale industry, I have to say that as far as the wine trade is involved, the vast majority of wine is from the new world. The days of European wine being popular here is gone. Every shop is selling wine from the US, Australia, New Zealand, Chile etc. Indeed many shops don’t sell any European wine at all. I’m not saying I’m happy about this, I’m not a fan of new world wine. I don’t like the taste of wood from their use of new oak vats. In Europe they use old sherry barrels, which makes for a smoother taste. But new world wine is cheaper and more easily available. So I grin and bare it, but then I am a wine snob. The point is still that nearly all the wine sold in the UK these days comes from the Southern Hemisphere..." Ok so let's say you're right ? Surely you're only illustrating a point that the UK is NOT a significant market for their wine ? Thus not an ace Also it seems clear that those with money in the UK don't care how much , they like to pay more for'the European names they like , thus no ace there As for cars , the UK is only a gear in the big machine As mentioned money will'buy European prestige , made almost exclusively not from UK And those put together in UK , currently have frictionless part movement and crossovers from the eu , leaving will have two results , one less made in UK , two prices go up | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Having recent experience in both the retail and wholesale industry, I have to say that as far as the wine trade is involved, the vast majority of wine is from the new world. The days of European wine being popular here is gone. Every shop is selling wine from the US, Australia, New Zealand, Chile etc. Indeed many shops don’t sell any European wine at all. I’m not saying I’m happy about this, I’m not a fan of new world wine. I don’t like the taste of wood from their use of new oak vats. In Europe they use old sherry barrels, which makes for a smoother taste. But new world wine is cheaper and more easily available. So I grin and bare it, but then I am a wine snob. The point is still that nearly all the wine sold in the UK these days comes from the Southern Hemisphere... Ok so let's say you're right ? Surely you're only illustrating a point that the UK is NOT a significant market for their wine ? Thus not an ace Also it seems clear that those with money in the UK don't care how much , they like to pay more for'the European names they like , thus no ace there As for cars , the UK is only a gear in the big machine As mentioned money will'buy European prestige , made almost exclusively not from UK And those put together in UK , currently have frictionless part movement and crossovers from the eu , leaving will have two results , one less made in UK , two prices go up " It won’t make a difference, not to the wine trade. European wine is still not as popular as it once was here. BREXIT will not have much impact on wine, everybody seems to be buying new world wine anyway. Good luck with your business though, as I already said, I personally prefer European wine. | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Having recent experience in both the retail and wholesale industry, I have to say that as far as the wine trade is involved, the vast majority of wine is from the new world. The days of European wine being popular here is gone. Every shop is selling wine from the US, Australia, New Zealand, Chile etc. Indeed many shops don’t sell any European wine at all. I’m not saying I’m happy about this, I’m not a fan of new world wine. I don’t like the taste of wood from their use of new oak vats. In Europe they use old sherry barrels, which makes for a smoother taste. But new world wine is cheaper and more easily available. So I grin and bare it, but then I am a wine snob. The point is still that nearly all the wine sold in the UK these days comes from the Southern Hemisphere... Ok so let's say you're right ? Surely you're only illustrating a point that the UK is NOT a significant market for their wine ? Thus not an ace Also it seems clear that those with money in the UK don't care how much , they like to pay more for'the European names they like , thus no ace there As for cars , the UK is only a gear in the big machine As mentioned money will'buy European prestige , made almost exclusively not from UK And those put together in UK , currently have frictionless part movement and crossovers from the eu , leaving will have two results , one less made in UK , two prices go up It won’t make a difference, not to the wine trade. European wine is still not as popular as it once was here. BREXIT will not have much impact on wine, everybody seems to be buying new world wine anyway. Good luck with your business though, as I already said, I personally prefer European wine." european wine still has the bigest market share despite your bookers cash and carry nonsense | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Having recent experience in both the retail and wholesale industry, I have to say that as far as the wine trade is involved, the vast majority of wine is from the new world. The days of European wine being popular here is gone. Every shop is selling wine from the US, Australia, New Zealand, Chile etc. Indeed many shops don’t sell any European wine at all. I’m not saying I’m happy about this, I’m not a fan of new world wine. I don’t like the taste of wood from their use of new oak vats. In Europe they use old sherry barrels, which makes for a smoother taste. But new world wine is cheaper and more easily available. So I grin and bare it, but then I am a wine snob. The point is still that nearly all the wine sold in the UK these days comes from the Southern Hemisphere... Ok so let's say you're right ? Surely you're only illustrating a point that the UK is NOT a significant market for their wine ? Thus not an ace Also it seems clear that those with money in the UK don't care how much , they like to pay more for'the European names they like , thus no ace there As for cars , the UK is only a gear in the big machine As mentioned money will'buy European prestige , made almost exclusively not from UK And those put together in UK , currently have frictionless part movement and crossovers from the eu , leaving will have two results , one less made in UK , two prices go up It won’t make a difference, not to the wine trade. European wine is still not as popular as it once was here. BREXIT will not have much impact on wine, everybody seems to be buying new world wine anyway. Good luck with your business though, as I already said, I personally prefer European wine. european wine still has the bigest market share despite your bookers cash and carry nonsense "You have no proof, I’m on the front line and posting facts... | |||
"Once we gone ...watch the others follow ..italy within months next Werent the Dutch supposed to have left by now too? No-one is leaving other than us " We have not left yet!!!We may not leave for a few years I think maybe | |||
"Once we gone ...watch the others follow ..italy within months next Werent the Dutch supposed to have left by now too? No-one is leaving other than us We have not left yet!!!We may not leave for a few years I think maybe" I hope you are wrong about that, the sooner we leave the better. | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Having recent experience in both the retail and wholesale industry, I have to say that as far as the wine trade is involved, the vast majority of wine is from the new world. The days of European wine being popular here is gone. Every shop is selling wine from the US, Australia, New Zealand, Chile etc. Indeed many shops don’t sell any European wine at all. I’m not saying I’m happy about this, I’m not a fan of new world wine. I don’t like the taste of wood from their use of new oak vats. In Europe they use old sherry barrels, which makes for a smoother taste. But new world wine is cheaper and more easily available. So I grin and bare it, but then I am a wine snob. The point is still that nearly all the wine sold in the UK these days comes from the Southern Hemisphere... Ok so let's say you're right ? Surely you're only illustrating a point that the UK is NOT a significant market for their wine ? Thus not an ace Also it seems clear that those with money in the UK don't care how much , they like to pay more for'the European names they like , thus no ace there As for cars , the UK is only a gear in the big machine As mentioned money will'buy European prestige , made almost exclusively not from UK And those put together in UK , currently have frictionless part movement and crossovers from the eu , leaving will have two results , one less made in UK , two prices go up It won’t make a difference, not to the wine trade. European wine is still not as popular as it once was here. BREXIT will not have much impact on wine, everybody seems to be buying new world wine anyway. Good luck with your business though, as I already said, I personally prefer European wine. european wine still has the bigest market share despite your bookers cash and carry nonsense
You have no proof, I’m on the front line and posting facts..."clearly not | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Having recent experience in both the retail and wholesale industry, I have to say that as far as the wine trade is involved, the vast majority of wine is from the new world. The days of European wine being popular here is gone. Every shop is selling wine from the US, Australia, New Zealand, Chile etc. Indeed many shops don’t sell any European wine at all. I’m not saying I’m happy about this, I’m not a fan of new world wine. I don’t like the taste of wood from their use of new oak vats. In Europe they use old sherry barrels, which makes for a smoother taste. But new world wine is cheaper and more easily available. So I grin and bare it, but then I am a wine snob. The point is still that nearly all the wine sold in the UK these days comes from the Southern Hemisphere... Ok so let's say you're right ? Surely you're only illustrating a point that the UK is NOT a significant market for their wine ? Thus not an ace Also it seems clear that those with money in the UK don't care how much , they like to pay more for'the European names they like , thus no ace there As for cars , the UK is only a gear in the big machine As mentioned money will'buy European prestige , made almost exclusively not from UK And those put together in UK , currently have frictionless part movement and crossovers from the eu , leaving will have two results , one less made in UK , two prices go up It won’t make a difference, not to the wine trade. European wine is still not as popular as it once was here. BREXIT will not have much impact on wine, everybody seems to be buying new world wine anyway. Good luck with your business though, as I already said, I personally prefer European wine. european wine still has the bigest market share despite your bookers cash and carry nonsense
You have no proof, I’m on the front line and posting facts...
clearly not "Ha, clearly so, but I’ve had enough of this circle jerk. I made my point and am getting fed up of going round and round. You just keep on fooling yourself. | |||
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"Once we gone ...watch the others follow ..italy within months next Werent the Dutch supposed to have left by now too? No-one is leaving other than us We have not left yet!!!We may not leave for a few years I think maybe I hope you are wrong about that, the sooner we leave the better." We are leaving on March 29th. It'll be a fuck up | |||
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"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Having recent experience in both the retail and wholesale industry, I have to say that as far as the wine trade is involved, the vast majority of wine is from the new world. The days of European wine being popular here is gone. Every shop is selling wine from the US, Australia, New Zealand, Chile etc. Indeed many shops don’t sell any European wine at all. I’m not saying I’m happy about this, I’m not a fan of new world wine. I don’t like the taste of wood from their use of new oak vats. In Europe they use old sherry barrels, which makes for a smoother taste. But new world wine is cheaper and more easily available. So I grin and bare it, but then I am a wine snob. The point is still that nearly all the wine sold in the UK these days comes from the Southern Hemisphere... The uk's largest pub chain Wetherspoons already made public they were ditching all EU produced wine, beer and spirits months ago. "Another good reason why not to go to a Wetherspoons. | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Having recent experience in both the retail and wholesale industry, I have to say that as far as the wine trade is involved, the vast majority of wine is from the new world. The days of European wine being popular here is gone. Every shop is selling wine from the US, Australia, New Zealand, Chile etc. Indeed many shops don’t sell any European wine at all. I’m not saying I’m happy about this, I’m not a fan of new world wine. I don’t like the taste of wood from their use of new oak vats. In Europe they use old sherry barrels, which makes for a smoother taste. But new world wine is cheaper and more easily available. So I grin and bare it, but then I am a wine snob. The point is still that nearly all the wine sold in the UK these days comes from the Southern Hemisphere... tosh ..... of the five biggest importers top is italy then france .... followed by australia a new zealand who combined import less than france by a third ..... fifth biggest importer is spain Exactly - the reality outweighs the veracity of the self confessed wine snob FFS. Go and look in your local offie, the wine on sale will tell the tale. I don’t like having to shop around for my fav Spanish or Italian wine. I like French wine too, but they are hard to find and very pricey. I remember when we had the Beaujolais Nouveau races back in the day. On the third Thursday in November, and the free tasting on the day. Those days are gone I’m afraid, French wines are not as popular as they were in the 1990’s. FACT." Or it could be that people finally started to realise that Beaujolais Nouveau is, generally, pretty awful. | |||
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" Or it could be that people finally started to realise that Beaujolais Nouveau is, generally, pretty awful. " Great for getting oil stains off the drive though | |||
"Once we gone ...watch the others follow ..italy within months next Werent the Dutch supposed to have left by now too? No-one is leaving other than us We have not left yet!!!We may not leave for a few years I think maybe I hope you are wrong about that, the sooner we leave the better. We are leaving on March 29th. It'll be a fuck up" Talks tonight that the transition will be extended from 21 months to 3 years | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Said the "German" & "Spanish" contigent - enjoying the "good life" Maybe they should have employed you as chief negotiator given your continental knowledge? " I couldn't do much worse. Oh yes, and loving the good life, currently in central France on our way down south. | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Said the "German" & "Spanish" contigent - enjoying the "good life" Maybe they should have employed you as chief negotiator given your continental knowledge? I couldn't do much worse. Oh yes, and loving the good life, currently in central France on our way down south. "What suprises me is that you fall for the same old rhetoric - we buy more from them. You live in Germany you know they often refer to us as "island monkey's " and they get pissed off that we "always get the sausage " and they have had enough - the UK isn't going to get its own way this time! As for we buy more - just Google how many cars Germany sell to France, Netherlands etc etc and add them up - then subtract the amount sold to the UK and you have answer! | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Said the "German" & "Spanish" contigent - enjoying the "good life" Maybe they should have employed you as chief negotiator given your continental knowledge? I couldn't do much worse. Oh yes, and loving the good life, currently in central France on our way down south.
What suprises me is that you fall for the same old rhetoric - we buy more from them.
You live in Germany you know they often refer to us as "island monkey's " and they get pissed off that we "always get the sausage " and they have had enough - the UK isn't going to get its own way this time! As for we buy more - just Google how many cars Germany sell to France, Netherlands etc etc and add them up - then subtract the amount sold to the UK and you have answer!"Less than 10% of BMW production sells in UK...the biggest market is China. (That's from their own data set). | |||
"Referring back to peace haven and his cash and carry business model, it still holds true that the wine he is selling is lowest common denominator and I imagine most of the restaurants that he’s talking about are not high end either. Does anybody remember that edition of the apprentice where some silly sod bought loads of cheap cheese from bookers and tried to sell it as high end quality English fare and not to put too fine a point on it he was fired. This seems to be the same argument to me. Pile it high and sell it cheap low quality product that is aimed at people who would never pay more than a fiver for plonk. It may well be true that more people buy it because the corner shops, curry houses, etc can make more margin and therefore the volume sold is greater but is that going to stay the same after brexit when the pound may well be worth less and will real restaurants change to new world wines or will wine just become more and more expensive? I suppose we will all be brewing up our own bathtub hooch by then though or we will be back to drinking mothers ruin ( a la Hogarth)" For some reason wines like Jackobs Creek,Gallo Wines and Casillero Del Diablo sell better than a decent Rioja we sell at around the same price. I’m not talking about my taste in wine, I buy the Rioja every time. It just so happens that other people don’t. There are many French appellation wines, but they are forever gathering dust, unless I buy some. What matters is what sells, and Joe Public seems not to care about the better standard of European wine. As for an earlier accusation that I only glance at the wine in the c&c, not true, it is my department, and I used to work for a large wine merchant and have certificates from the Wines and Spirits Education Trust. | |||
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"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Said the "German" & "Spanish" contigent - enjoying the "good life" Maybe they should have employed you as chief negotiator given your continental knowledge? I couldn't do much worse. Oh yes, and loving the good life, currently in central France on our way down south.
What suprises me is that you fall for the same old rhetoric - we buy more from them.
You live in Germany you know they often refer to us as "island monkey's " and they get pissed off that we "always get the sausage " and they have had enough - the UK isn't going to get its own way this time! As for we buy more - just Google how many cars Germany sell to France, Netherlands etc etc and add them up - then subtract the amount sold to the UK and you have answer!"The Germans also refer to the UK as 'Treasure island' for the record. | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Said the "German" & "Spanish" contigent - enjoying the "good life" Maybe they should have employed you as chief negotiator given your continental knowledge? I couldn't do much worse. Oh yes, and loving the good life, currently in central France on our way down south.
What suprises me is that you fall for the same old rhetoric - we buy more from them.
You live in Germany you know they often refer to us as "island monkey's " and they get pissed off that we "always get the sausage " and they have had enough - the UK isn't going to get its own way this time! As for we buy more - just Google how many cars Germany sell to France, Netherlands etc etc and add them up - then subtract the amount sold to the UK and you have answer!"I didn't say "we buy more from them" but Britain certainly buys enough to focus minds. Also, from someone who is actually on the ground in Germany, the Germans are getting very jittery about what will happen if it's a no deal. | |||
"Aren't the wune export figures for Italy and France somewhat inflated by the sales of Prosecco and Champagne? " Maybe, maybe not. But last time I looked Champagne and Prosecco were classed as, yep you guessed it, wine. BTW for wine exports Britain is France's biggest market, including Champagne of course. | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Said the "German" & "Spanish" contigent - enjoying the "good life" Maybe they should have employed you as chief negotiator given your continental knowledge? I couldn't do much worse. Oh yes, and loving the good life, currently in central France on our way down south.
What suprises me is that you fall for the same old rhetoric - we buy more from them.
You live in Germany you know they often refer to us as "island monkey's " and they get pissed off that we "always get the sausage " and they have had enough - the UK isn't going to get its own way this time! As for we buy more - just Google how many cars Germany sell to France, Netherlands etc etc and add them up - then subtract the amount sold to the UK and you have answer!"Oh I missed that "Britain getting its own way" bit. There is no getting anyone's "own way" they either want to do business or not. The problem at the moment is that Barnier and co are too busy playing petty politics and posturing to be seen to punish Britain for having the audacity to actually leave. Macron has also done a bit of posturing lately but that is for domestic consumption. At home he is about as popular as a fart in a phone box. | |||
" Less than 10% of BMW production sells in UK...the biggest market is China. (That's from their own data set). " I suspect someone in the UK who can afford to buy a new BMW today will still buy a new BMW, tariffs or no tariffs. Same with Mercedes and the rest of them. It's a red herring. | |||
" Less than 10% of BMW production sells in UK...the biggest market is China. (That's from their own data set). I suspect someone in the UK who can afford to buy a new BMW today will still buy a new BMW, tariffs or no tariffs. Same with Mercedes and the rest of them. It's a red herring. " Are you talking as someone who has bought a new mercedes or BMW in the past or are you just having a guess!? I seem to recall you saying you didn't have a car so probably likely that you haven't, in which case it's just a guess! | |||
" Less than 10% of BMW production sells in UK...the biggest market is China. (That's from their own data set). I suspect someone in the UK who can afford to buy a new BMW today will still buy a new BMW, tariffs or no tariffs. Same with Mercedes and the rest of them. It's a red herring. Are you talking as someone who has bought a new mercedes or BMW in the past or are you just having a guess!? I seem to recall you saying you didn't have a car so probably likely that you haven't, in which case it's just a guess! "I can validate it is more than an educated guess Exactly the same as iPhone buyers have not been put off by their love , being inflated greatly the pound dollar situation | |||
" Less than 10% of BMW production sells in UK...the biggest market is China. (That's from their own data set). I suspect someone in the UK who can afford to buy a new BMW today will still buy a new BMW, tariffs or no tariffs. Same with Mercedes and the rest of them. It's a red herring. Are you talking as someone who has bought a new mercedes or BMW in the past or are you just having a guess!? I seem to recall you saying you didn't have a car so probably likely that you haven't, in which case it's just a guess!
I can validate it is more than an educated guess
Exactly the same as iPhone buyers have not been put off by their love , being inflated greatly the pound dollar situation
"How can you validate it!? | |||
" Less than 10% of BMW production sells in UK...the biggest market is China. (That's from their own data set). I suspect someone in the UK who can afford to buy a new BMW today will still buy a new BMW, tariffs or no tariffs. Same with Mercedes and the rest of them. It's a red herring. Are you talking as someone who has bought a new mercedes or BMW in the past or are you just having a guess!? I seem to recall you saying you didn't have a car so probably likely that you haven't, in which case it's just a guess! "Are you saying it is a bad guess? Or just wanting evidence ? Generally speaking luxury items are price insensitive (to low movements at least) Where BMW may be hit is if there is a wider reduction in disposable income in middle England.... | |||
" Less than 10% of BMW production sells in UK...the biggest market is China. (That's from their own data set). I suspect someone in the UK who can afford to buy a new BMW today will still buy a new BMW, tariffs or no tariffs. Same with Mercedes and the rest of them. It's a red herring. Are you talking as someone who has bought a new mercedes or BMW in the past or are you just having a guess!? I seem to recall you saying you didn't have a car so probably likely that you haven't, in which case it's just a guess! "I've not bought a new car in my life. I've not driven anything for 5 years. Until a bought a new Vespa on Tuesday. Thought I should get one before they slap tariffs on Italian imports | |||
" Less than 10% of BMW production sells in UK...the biggest market is China. (That's from their own data set). I suspect someone in the UK who can afford to buy a new BMW today will still buy a new BMW, tariffs or no tariffs. Same with Mercedes and the rest of them. It's a red herring. Are you talking as someone who has bought a new mercedes or BMW in the past or are you just having a guess!? I seem to recall you saying you didn't have a car so probably likely that you haven't, in which case it's just a guess! Are you saying it is a bad guess? Or just wanting evidence ? Generally speaking luxury items are price insensitive (to low movements at least)
Where BMW may be hit is if there is a wider reduction in disposable income in middle England...."It's a guess as you have no idea what the price increase may be, any increase in cost will always affect sales. A car is a much higher value purchase than the iphones it was compared with so not a good comparison as any % increase will be much greater. | |||
" Less than 10% of BMW production sells in UK...the biggest market is China. (That's from their own data set). I suspect someone in the UK who can afford to buy a new BMW today will still buy a new BMW, tariffs or no tariffs. Same with Mercedes and the rest of them. It's a red herring. Are you talking as someone who has bought a new mercedes or BMW in the past or are you just having a guess!? I seem to recall you saying you didn't have a car so probably likely that you haven't, in which case it's just a guess!
I've not bought a new car in my life.
I've not driven anything for 5 years.
Until a bought a new Vespa on Tuesday.
Thought I should get one before they slap tariffs on Italian imports
"So as I said you are not a BMW or Mercedes customer so not really in a position to say if they would pay the extra money, you just guessed they would! | |||
" Less than 10% of BMW production sells in UK...the biggest market is China. (That's from their own data set). I suspect someone in the UK who can afford to buy a new BMW today will still buy a new BMW, tariffs or no tariffs. Same with Mercedes and the rest of them. It's a red herring. Are you talking as someone who has bought a new mercedes or BMW in the past or are you just having a guess!? I seem to recall you saying you didn't have a car so probably likely that you haven't, in which case it's just a guess!
I've not bought a new car in my life.
I've not driven anything for 5 years.
Until a bought a new Vespa on Tuesday.
Thought I should get one before they slap tariffs on Italian imports
So as I said you are not a BMW or Mercedes customer so not really in a position to say if they would pay the extra money, you just guessed they would! "The broader question is... Who really cares about BMW anyway? What is the point of debating if people will or won’t pay more for a BMW. | |||
" Less than 10% of BMW production sells in UK...the biggest market is China. (That's from their own data set). I suspect someone in the UK who can afford to buy a new BMW today will still buy a new BMW, tariffs or no tariffs. Same with Mercedes and the rest of them. It's a red herring. Are you talking as someone who has bought a new mercedes or BMW in the past or are you just having a guess!? I seem to recall you saying you didn't have a car so probably likely that you haven't, in which case it's just a guess!
I've not bought a new car in my life.
I've not driven anything for 5 years.
Until a bought a new Vespa on Tuesday.
Thought I should get one before they slap tariffs on Italian imports
So as I said you are not a BMW or Mercedes customer so not really in a position to say if they would pay the extra money, you just guessed they would!
The broader question is... Who really cares about BMW anyway? What is the point of debating if people will or won’t pay more for a BMW."Who cares what you think in your hot tub but you keep posting telling us all about it! | |||
" Less than 10% of BMW production sells in UK...the biggest market is China. (That's from their own data set). I suspect someone in the UK who can afford to buy a new BMW today will still buy a new BMW, tariffs or no tariffs. Same with Mercedes and the rest of them. It's a red herring. Are you talking as someone who has bought a new mercedes or BMW in the past or are you just having a guess!? I seem to recall you saying you didn't have a car so probably likely that you haven't, in which case it's just a guess!
I've not bought a new car in my life.
I've not driven anything for 5 years.
Until a bought a new Vespa on Tuesday.
Thought I should get one before they slap tariffs on Italian imports
So as I said you are not a BMW or Mercedes customer so not really in a position to say if they would pay the extra money, you just guessed they would!
The broader question is... Who really cares about BMW anyway? What is the point of debating if people will or won’t pay more for a BMW.
Who cares what you think in your hot tub but you keep posting telling us all about it! "The point being is that it is irrelevant what U.K. consumers do. It is how BMW react to the Brexit deal that matters. | |||
" Less than 10% of BMW production sells in UK...the biggest market is China. (That's from their own data set). I suspect someone in the UK who can afford to buy a new BMW today will still buy a new BMW, tariffs or no tariffs. Same with Mercedes and the rest of them. It's a red herring. Are you talking as someone who has bought a new mercedes or BMW in the past or are you just having a guess!? I seem to recall you saying you didn't have a car so probably likely that you haven't, in which case it's just a guess!
I've not bought a new car in my life.
I've not driven anything for 5 years.
Until a bought a new Vespa on Tuesday.
Thought I should get one before they slap tariffs on Italian imports
So as I said you are not a BMW or Mercedes customer so not really in a position to say if they would pay the extra money, you just guessed they would!
The broader question is... Who really cares about BMW anyway? What is the point of debating if people will or won’t pay more for a BMW.
Who cares what you think in your hot tub but you keep posting telling us all about it!
The point being is that it is irrelevant what U.K. consumers do. It is how BMW react to the Brexit deal that matters."Tell that to your remainer buddies who seem to know every outcome. I doubt many businesses see their customers as an irrelevance in the real world! | |||
" The point being is that it is irrelevant what U.K. consumers do. It is how BMW react to the Brexit deal that matters." Nah. If the opinion or needs of business mattered, there would not have been a referendum in the first place. This is politics. And the EU leaders, Germany included, have been crystal clear from day one. The single market exists for the benefit of the EU members - the UK cannot expect the benefits without membership of the EU. It amazes me that people still think the UK can give up membership and keep the benefits. | |||
" The point being is that it is irrelevant what U.K. consumers do. It is how BMW react to the Brexit deal that matters. Nah. If the opinion or needs of business mattered, there would not have been a referendum in the first place. This is politics. And the EU leaders, Germany included, have been crystal clear from day one. The single market exists for the benefit of the EU members - the UK cannot expect the benefits without membership of the EU. It amazes me that people still think the UK can give up membership and keep the benefits. " That,s a great post | |||
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"Didn’t this all start because there is a view Bmw will tell Germany who will tell the EU to bend over and accept our demands? Are we now saying BMWs view doesn’t matter ? That’s an ace gone. " You got me,well done | |||
" The point being is that it is irrelevant what U.K. consumers do. It is how BMW react to the Brexit deal that matters. Nah. If the opinion or needs of business mattered, there would not have been a referendum in the first place. This is politics. And the EU leaders, Germany included, have been crystal clear from day one. The single market exists for the benefit of the EU members - the UK cannot expect the benefits without membership of the EU. It amazes me that people still think the UK can give up membership and keep the benefits. " That was another David Davis classic quote. “Once we are outside the EU, we will have at least the same benefits with the EU, or better than what we have now.” Yes right Mr Davis. | |||
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"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Said the "German" & "Spanish" contigent - enjoying the "good life" Maybe they should have employed you as chief negotiator given your continental knowledge? I couldn't do much worse. Oh yes, and loving the good life, currently in central France on our way down south.
What suprises me is that you fall for the same old rhetoric - we buy more from them.
You live in Germany you know they often refer to us as "island monkey's " and they get pissed off that we "always get the sausage " and they have had enough - the UK isn't going to get its own way this time! As for we buy more - just Google how many cars Germany sell to France, Netherlands etc etc and add them up - then subtract the amount sold to the UK and you have answer!
Oh I missed that "Britain getting its own way" bit.
There is no getting anyone's "own way" they either want to do business or not.
The problem at the moment is that Barnier and co are too busy playing petty politics and posturing to be seen to punish Britain for having the audacity to actually leave.
Macron has also done a bit of posturing lately but that is for domestic consumption. At home he is about as popular as a fart in a phone box."Yes he is not popular with some (Macron) - but France needs change and he is doing that. However that's a diversion let's get back to facts "we buy more " 2017 German cars exported in value in billions of €: UK 2nd to USA worth 25€bn EU exports; France 16.4 Italy 12.4 Spain 9.7 Bel 7.9 Aust 7.6 Pol 7.0 Neth 7.0 Czec 5.6 Swed 5.4 Total 79.0 - 25 = 54€bn on only 9 EU country's sales - 18 still to go. There is your answer German car industry like UK but the other 27 are worth a lot more. They're going to for single market! | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Said the "German" & "Spanish" contigent - enjoying the "good life" Maybe they should have employed you as chief negotiator given your continental knowledge? I couldn't do much worse. Oh yes, and loving the good life, currently in central France on our way down south.
What suprises me is that you fall for the same old rhetoric - we buy more from them.
You live in Germany you know they often refer to us as "island monkey's " and they get pissed off that we "always get the sausage " and they have had enough - the UK isn't going to get its own way this time! As for we buy more - just Google how many cars Germany sell to France, Netherlands etc etc and add them up - then subtract the amount sold to the UK and you have answer!
Oh I missed that "Britain getting its own way" bit.
There is no getting anyone's "own way" they either want to do business or not.
The problem at the moment is that Barnier and co are too busy playing petty politics and posturing to be seen to punish Britain for having the audacity to actually leave.
Macron has also done a bit of posturing lately but that is for domestic consumption. At home he is about as popular as a fart in a phone box.
Yes he is not popular with some (Macron) - but France needs change and he is doing that. However that's a diversion let's get back to facts "we buy more "
2017 German cars exported in value in billions of €:
UK 2nd to USA worth 25€bn
EU exports;
France 16.4
Italy 12.4
Spain 9.7
Bel 7.9
Aust 7.6
Pol 7.0
Neth 7.0
Czec 5.6
Swed 5.4
Total 79.0 - 25 = 54€bn on only 9 EU country's sales - 18 still to go.
There is your answer German car industry like UK but the other 27 are worth a lot more. They're going to for single market!
"Oh no! Something else that shows a BREXIT argument is totally illogical and wrong. Must be fake news. | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Said the "German" & "Spanish" contigent - enjoying the "good life" Maybe they should have employed you as chief negotiator given your continental knowledge? I couldn't do much worse. Oh yes, and loving the good life, currently in central France on our way down south.
What suprises me is that you fall for the same old rhetoric - we buy more from them.
You live in Germany you know they often refer to us as "island monkey's " and they get pissed off that we "always get the sausage " and they have had enough - the UK isn't going to get its own way this time! As for we buy more - just Google how many cars Germany sell to France, Netherlands etc etc and add them up - then subtract the amount sold to the UK and you have answer!
Oh I missed that "Britain getting its own way" bit.
There is no getting anyone's "own way" they either want to do business or not.
The problem at the moment is that Barnier and co are too busy playing petty politics and posturing to be seen to punish Britain for having the audacity to actually leave.
Macron has also done a bit of posturing lately but that is for domestic consumption. At home he is about as popular as a fart in a phone box.
Yes he is not popular with some (Macron) - but France needs change and he is doing that. However that's a diversion let's get back to facts "we buy more "
2017 German cars exported in value in billions of €:
UK 2nd to USA worth 25€bn
EU exports;
France 16.4
Italy 12.4
Spain 9.7
Bel 7.9
Aust 7.6
Pol 7.0
Neth 7.0
Czec 5.6
Swed 5.4
Total 79.0 - 25 = 54€bn on only 9 EU country's sales - 18 still to go.
There is your answer German car industry like UK but the other 27 are worth a lot more. They're going to for single market!
Oh no! Something else that shows a BREXIT argument is totally illogical and wrong. Must be fake news."That's making the assumption that the German's would be quite happy to write off current sales of £25bn against the possible sales to other countries. | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Said the "German" & "Spanish" contigent - enjoying the "good life" Maybe they should have employed you as chief negotiator given your continental knowledge? I couldn't do much worse. Oh yes, and loving the good life, currently in central France on our way down south.
What suprises me is that you fall for the same old rhetoric - we buy more from them.
You live in Germany you know they often refer to us as "island monkey's " and they get pissed off that we "always get the sausage " and they have had enough - the UK isn't going to get its own way this time! As for we buy more - just Google how many cars Germany sell to France, Netherlands etc etc and add them up - then subtract the amount sold to the UK and you have answer!
Oh I missed that "Britain getting its own way" bit.
There is no getting anyone's "own way" they either want to do business or not.
The problem at the moment is that Barnier and co are too busy playing petty politics and posturing to be seen to punish Britain for having the audacity to actually leave.
Macron has also done a bit of posturing lately but that is for domestic consumption. At home he is about as popular as a fart in a phone box.
Yes he is not popular with some (Macron) - but France needs change and he is doing that. However that's a diversion let's get back to facts "we buy more "
2017 German cars exported in value in billions of €:
UK 2nd to USA worth 25€bn
EU exports;
France 16.4
Italy 12.4
Spain 9.7
Bel 7.9
Aust 7.6
Pol 7.0
Neth 7.0
Czec 5.6
Swed 5.4
Total 79.0 - 25 = 54€bn on only 9 EU country's sales - 18 still to go.
There is your answer German car industry like UK but the other 27 are worth a lot more. They're going to for single market!
Oh no! Something else that shows a BREXIT argument is totally illogical and wrong. Must be fake news.
That's making the assumption that the German's would be quite happy to write off current sales of £25bn against the possible sales to other countries.
"Now that is what I call the ultimate "spin" - unbelievable considering all the above figures are ACTUAL figures not maybe or could be. UK sales were 25€bn, sales to just 9 EU 79€bn which is actually 54€bn larger!!! Perhaps you can justify your comment - you switch between "part historical" figures to "potential future" - the sales figures are a year old - 2018 sales maybe more or maybe less. You can't make statements which are based on two different senarios and make exact comparisons! Finally the Germans won't lose 25€bn as they will still sell cars to the UK under WTO assuming the Brits still want an alternative to the "home" market - or are we all going to be driving Nissan, Toyota, Honda and JLR? | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Said the "German" & "Spanish" contigent - enjoying the "good life" Maybe they should have employed you as chief negotiator given your continental knowledge? I couldn't do much worse. Oh yes, and loving the good life, currently in central France on our way down south.
What suprises me is that you fall for the same old rhetoric - we buy more from them.
You live in Germany you know they often refer to us as "island monkey's " and they get pissed off that we "always get the sausage " and they have had enough - the UK isn't going to get its own way this time! As for we buy more - just Google how many cars Germany sell to France, Netherlands etc etc and add them up - then subtract the amount sold to the UK and you have answer!
Oh I missed that "Britain getting its own way" bit.
There is no getting anyone's "own way" they either want to do business or not.
The problem at the moment is that Barnier and co are too busy playing petty politics and posturing to be seen to punish Britain for having the audacity to actually leave.
Macron has also done a bit of posturing lately but that is for domestic consumption. At home he is about as popular as a fart in a phone box.
Yes he is not popular with some (Macron) - but France needs change and he is doing that. However that's a diversion let's get back to facts "we buy more "
2017 German cars exported in value in billions of €:
UK 2nd to USA worth 25€bn
EU exports;
France 16.4
Italy 12.4
Spain 9.7
Bel 7.9
Aust 7.6
Pol 7.0
Neth 7.0
Czec 5.6
Swed 5.4
Total 79.0 - 25 = 54€bn on only 9 EU country's sales - 18 still to go.
There is your answer German car industry like UK but the other 27 are worth a lot more. They're going to for single market!
Oh no! Something else that shows a BREXIT argument is totally illogical and wrong. Must be fake news.
That's making the assumption that the German's would be quite happy to write off current sales of £25bn against the possible sales to other countries.
"That's assuming they would be assuming that the UK would not buy any cars The more likely assumption is they are deciding whether to be happy or not for losing x percentage of 25 billion sales An arbitrary 10 percent reduction would be a 2.5 billions , that indeed could be tolerable ? | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Said the "German" & "Spanish" contigent - enjoying the "good life" Maybe they should have employed you as chief negotiator given your continental knowledge? I couldn't do much worse. Oh yes, and loving the good life, currently in central France on our way down south.
What suprises me is that you fall for the same old rhetoric - we buy more from them.
You live in Germany you know they often refer to us as "island monkey's " and they get pissed off that we "always get the sausage " and they have had enough - the UK isn't going to get its own way this time! As for we buy more - just Google how many cars Germany sell to France, Netherlands etc etc and add them up - then subtract the amount sold to the UK and you have answer!
Oh I missed that "Britain getting its own way" bit.
There is no getting anyone's "own way" they either want to do business or not.
The problem at the moment is that Barnier and co are too busy playing petty politics and posturing to be seen to punish Britain for having the audacity to actually leave.
Macron has also done a bit of posturing lately but that is for domestic consumption. At home he is about as popular as a fart in a phone box.
Yes he is not popular with some (Macron) - but France needs change and he is doing that. However that's a diversion let's get back to facts "we buy more "
2017 German cars exported in value in billions of €:
UK 2nd to USA worth 25€bn
EU exports;
France 16.4
Italy 12.4
Spain 9.7
Bel 7.9
Aust 7.6
Pol 7.0
Neth 7.0
Czec 5.6
Swed 5.4
Total 79.0 - 25 = 54€bn on only 9 EU country's sales - 18 still to go.
There is your answer German car industry like UK but the other 27 are worth a lot more. They're going to for single market!
Oh no! Something else that shows a BREXIT argument is totally illogical and wrong. Must be fake news.
That's making the assumption that the German's would be quite happy to write off current sales of £25bn against the possible sales to other countries.
Now that is what I call the ultimate "spin" - unbelievable considering all the above figures are ACTUAL figures not maybe or could be. UK sales were 25€bn, sales to just 9 EU 79€bn which is actually 54€bn larger!!!
Perhaps you can justify your comment - you switch between "part historical" figures to "potential future" - the sales figures are a year old - 2018 sales maybe more or maybe less. You can't make statements which are based on two different senarios and make exact comparisons!
Finally the Germans won't lose 25€bn as they will still sell cars to the UK under WTO assuming the Brits still want an alternative to the "home" market - or are we all going to be driving Nissan, Toyota, Honda and JLR?"If I forecast years into the future, then I would be a very rich man indeed. But that hypothetical scenario exists. German carmakers "could" lose sales of £25bn. It's unlikely but any business, be it BMW or Shufflebottoms nuts and bolts, knows that existing business share is infinitely more valuable than possible potential market share elsewhere. It's not spin, just straight business facts. The UK will continue to buy German cars but their market share may well fall. | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Said the "German" & "Spanish" contigent - enjoying the "good life" Maybe they should have employed you as chief negotiator given your continental knowledge? I couldn't do much worse. Oh yes, and loving the good life, currently in central France on our way down south.
What suprises me is that you fall for the same old rhetoric - we buy more from them.
You live in Germany you know they often refer to us as "island monkey's " and they get pissed off that we "always get the sausage " and they have had enough - the UK isn't going to get its own way this time! As for we buy more - just Google how many cars Germany sell to France, Netherlands etc etc and add them up - then subtract the amount sold to the UK and you have answer!
Oh I missed that "Britain getting its own way" bit.
There is no getting anyone's "own way" they either want to do business or not.
The problem at the moment is that Barnier and co are too busy playing petty politics and posturing to be seen to punish Britain for having the audacity to actually leave.
Macron has also done a bit of posturing lately but that is for domestic consumption. At home he is about as popular as a fart in a phone box.
Yes he is not popular with some (Macron) - but France needs change and he is doing that. However that's a diversion let's get back to facts "we buy more "
2017 German cars exported in value in billions of €:
UK 2nd to USA worth 25€bn
EU exports;
France 16.4
Italy 12.4
Spain 9.7
Bel 7.9
Aust 7.6
Pol 7.0
Neth 7.0
Czec 5.6
Swed 5.4
Total 79.0 - 25 = 54€bn on only 9 EU country's sales - 18 still to go.
There is your answer German car industry like UK but the other 27 are worth a lot more. They're going to for single market!
Oh no! Something else that shows a BREXIT argument is totally illogical and wrong. Must be fake news.
That's making the assumption that the German's would be quite happy to write off current sales of £25bn against the possible sales to other countries.
Now that is what I call the ultimate "spin" - unbelievable considering all the above figures are ACTUAL figures not maybe or could be. UK sales were 25€bn, sales to just 9 EU 79€bn which is actually 54€bn larger!!!
Perhaps you can justify your comment - you switch between "part historical" figures to "potential future" - the sales figures are a year old - 2018 sales maybe more or maybe less. You can't make statements which are based on two different senarios and make exact comparisons!
Finally the Germans won't lose 25€bn as they will still sell cars to the UK under WTO assuming the Brits still want an alternative to the "home" market - or are we all going to be driving Nissan, Toyota, Honda and JLR?
If I forecast years into the future, then I would be a very rich man indeed. But that hypothetical scenario exists. German carmakers "could" lose sales of £25bn. It's unlikely but any business, be it BMW or Shufflebottoms nuts and bolts, knows that existing business share is infinitely more valuable than possible potential market share elsewhere.
It's not spin, just straight business facts. The UK will continue to buy German cars but their market share may well fall.""If its and buts were pots and pan's there wouldn't be any need for tinkers". Your statement of losing 25€bn is based on past figures - not current actual figures which may well be significantly less than the previous years actual sales- fact 1. Fact 2 was based on assumption that German cars wouldn't sell in the future - nobody knows the 3rd largest market is China at 21€bn - they could increase sales there or even to India which was not showing in the top 15 countries! The whole point of taking the time to get the facts about German sales was to prove to brexiteers "we buy more from them" argument is and always had been flawed! As the figures prove UK is an important market but compared to just 9 of the 26 (excluding Germany) - the UK market is well short. Also if you add in EEA countries there are two significant economics Norway & Switzerland who incidently were number 15 in the list at 5€bn worth of sales! Fact is fact - unless of course your name is Trump but who would you rather do business with 1 country or 27? | |||
"“Making a deal with the EU will be the easiest thing in history.” Things they wish they had never said part 2 With thanks to Michael Gove and Liam Fox Does Britain hold all the cards? Of course not, but it does have a couple of aces if only the fucking idiots in the Conservative party knew how (or had the balls) to play them. I say that as a lifelong Tory BTW. Ace number one should have been played early. Instead of cobbling together futile offers to the EU (Chequers for example). We should have said "we are leaving, so what are YOU going to do so that YOU can carry on selling us your cars, wine, produce" Etc Etc Etc. That would have focused a few minds in Munich, Stuttgart, and Bordeaux. But no. Since day one the narrative has been "oh sorry we are leaving how can we make it up to you" Britain should tell them to fuck off. Oh that's not diplomatic you may say. Well guess what, the obnoxious, intransigent Barnier has said exactly that to Britain since the beginning. WHY? because May and co have let him get away with it. Worst ways up it will be no deal, and that does now seem more and more likely. So why not grow a pair and say to them. "Sod all this how much do we have to pay you, tell us how much you will pay us to do business with the 5th largest economy in the world". And if they don't like it tell the to go and fuck themselves. It will still be WTO whichever way. Said the "German" & "Spanish" contigent - enjoying the "good life" Maybe they should have employed you as chief negotiator given your continental knowledge? I couldn't do much worse. Oh yes, and loving the good life, currently in central France on our way down south.
What suprises me is that you fall for the same old rhetoric - we buy more from them.
You live in Germany you know they often refer to us as "island monkey's " and they get pissed off that we "always get the sausage " and they have had enough - the UK isn't going to get its own way this time! As for we buy more - just Google how many cars Germany sell to France, Netherlands etc etc and add them up - then subtract the amount sold to the UK and you have answer!
Oh I missed that "Britain getting its own way" bit.
There is no getting anyone's "own way" they either want to do business or not.
The problem at the moment is that Barnier and co are too busy playing petty politics and posturing to be seen to punish Britain for having the audacity to actually leave.
Macron has also done a bit of posturing lately but that is for domestic consumption. At home he is about as popular as a fart in a phone box.
Yes he is not popular with some (Macron) - but France needs change and he is doing that. However that's a diversion let's get back to facts "we buy more "
2017 German cars exported in value in billions of €:
UK 2nd to USA worth 25€bn
EU exports;
France 16.4
Italy 12.4
Spain 9.7
Bel 7.9
Aust 7.6
Pol 7.0
Neth 7.0
Czec 5.6
Swed 5.4
Total 79.0 - 25 = 54€bn on only 9 EU country's sales - 18 still to go.
There is your answer German car industry like UK but the other 27 are worth a lot more. They're going to for single market!
Oh no! Something else that shows a BREXIT argument is totally illogical and wrong. Must be fake news.
That's making the assumption that the German's would be quite happy to write off current sales of £25bn against the possible sales to other countries.
Now that is what I call the ultimate "spin" - unbelievable considering all the above figures are ACTUAL figures not maybe or could be. UK sales were 25€bn, sales to just 9 EU 79€bn which is actually 54€bn larger!!!
Perhaps you can justify your comment - you switch between "part historical" figures to "potential future" - the sales figures are a year old - 2018 sales maybe more or maybe less. You can't make statements which are based on two different senarios and make exact comparisons!
Finally the Germans won't lose 25€bn as they will still sell cars to the UK under WTO assuming the Brits still want an alternative to the "home" market - or are we all going to be driving Nissan, Toyota, Honda and JLR?
If I forecast years into the future, then I would be a very rich man indeed. But that hypothetical scenario exists. German carmakers "could" lose sales of £25bn. It's unlikely but any business, be it BMW or Shufflebottoms nuts and bolts, knows that existing business share is infinitely more valuable than possible potential market share elsewhere.
It's not spin, just straight business facts. The UK will continue to buy German cars but their market share may well fall.
"If its and buts were pots and pan's there wouldn't be any need for tinkers".
Your statement of losing 25€bn is based on past figures - not current actual figures which may well be significantly less than the previous years actual sales- fact 1.
Fact 2 was based on assumption that German cars wouldn't sell in the future - nobody knows the 3rd largest market is China at 21€bn - they could increase sales there or even to India which was not showing in the top 15 countries!
The whole point of taking the time to get the facts about German sales was to prove to brexiteers "we buy more from them" argument is and always had been flawed! As the figures prove UK is an important market but compared to just 9 of the 26 (excluding Germany) - the UK market is well short. Also if you add in EEA countries there are two significant economics Norway & Switzerland who incidently were number 15 in the list at 5€bn worth of sales!
Fact is fact - unless of course your name is Trump but who would you rather do business with 1 country or 27? "I've never bought into the "we need them more than they need us" arguement. Truth is we all need eachother. Automotive is in a huge quandary at the moment. It has Brexit, USA trade wars, over production, diesel and emissions, and future electric vehicle production to contend with. Recent sales figures are showing a marked decline, and that's a worry. It could be that Automotive is heading for a massive "reset" in the near future. | |||
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