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Europe - 10 years in turmoil
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By *ony 2016Man
over a year ago
Huddersfield /derby cinemas |
"Did anyone watch Europe - 10 years in turmoil last night at 9pm on BBC 2?
I though it was a thoroughly enjoyable watch, and brought back some great memories!   "
. Found it quite interesting , saw the Conservative party trying to save the Conservative party by doing what some of the Conservative party wanted them to do , ,,,and , now , after nearly 2 years since the referendum we are in a position where the Conservative party are trying to save the Conservative party by trying to do what some of the Conservative party want to do ,,,,,,,, didn't hear much (any ) concern about our country , just about the Conservative party |
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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
If mainstream media is the contemporaneous account, the programme was the first version of history.
So much to squeeze into a programme like that.
Cameron refused to be interviewed apparently. He has sold his story to a publisher.
No surprise there - he sold out a whole nation. |
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"If mainstream media is the contemporaneous account, the programme was the first version of history.
So much to squeeze into a programme like that.
Cameron refused to be interviewed apparently. He has sold his story to a publisher.
No surprise there - he sold out a whole nation."
There was a lot to squeeze in the programme, but it wasn't the only part. It's a 3 part series, looking forward to seeing part 2 next week. |
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By *ony 2016Man
over a year ago
Huddersfield /derby cinemas |
"If mainstream media is the contemporaneous account, the programme was the first version of history.
So much to squeeze into a programme like that.
Cameron refused to be interviewed apparently. He has sold his story to a publisher.
No surprise there - he sold out a whole nation.
There was a lot to squeeze in the programme, but it wasn't the only part. It's a 3 part series, looking forward to seeing part 2 next week. "
. Agree , I am also looking forward to parts 2&3 , I wonder if we get a Tory talking about our country rather than their party ??? ( 2 episodes to go --- so fingers crossed ) |
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"think next week is about the euro crisis not brexit.
Part 2 is Euro crisis
Part 3 is Immigration
Angela Merkel also refused to take part."
I wonder if Macron will come out of hiding from behind his desk in fear of the yellow vests, long enough to comment? |
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"think next week is about the euro crisis not brexit.It is a reason for brexit,one of many"
Well true what i meant was that the focus next week is on the euro and Greece what went on behind the scenes.Looking forward to that one.
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"Is this 3 part program factual, unbiased and balanced or is it pushing a narrative? "
Who knows these days but the same as everything you have to draw your own conclusions by what is said.We all know they lie.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"If mainstream media is the contemporaneous account, the programme was the first version of history.
So much to squeeze into a programme like that.
Cameron refused to be interviewed apparently. He has sold his story to a publisher.
No surprise there - he sold out a whole nation."
 ...  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Just watched part 2 earlier about the Euro crisis in the EU. Another hour of EU fuckups for everyone to enjoy, it's on BBC iplayer now. "
I must have watched a different part two to you then.
In my part two I saw the Greek self inflicted financial crisis blow up and Germany basically bailing them out, you know the same Germany many still slagg off, then Greece needing another bailout and the EU states coming together to bail Greece out again to give stability to the Euro that Greece was doing its best to destroy.
In return Greece had to hatchet their economy to try and start balancing their books.
All Greeces fault the lot of it.
If it showed if anything was the unity within the EU to tackle an international crisis.
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"Just watched part 2 earlier about the Euro crisis in the EU. Another hour of EU fuckups for everyone to enjoy, it's on BBC iplayer now.
I must have watched a different part two to you then.
In my part two I saw the Greek self inflicted financial crisis blow up and Germany basically bailing them out, you know the same Germany many still slagg off, then Greece needing another bailout and the EU states coming together to bail Greece out again to give stability to the Euro that Greece was doing its best to destroy.
In return Greece had to hatchet their economy to try and start balancing their books.
All Greeces fault the lot of it.
If it showed if anything was the unity within the EU to tackle an international crisis.
"
Yes we must have watched different programmes, I saw the EU not fixing the problem and just putting sticking plasters on it time and again. The problem is still not properly fixed to this day. I also saw the EU forcing a democratically elected Greek Prime minister to resign so they could install their own Technocratic Europhile puppet in Athens (which the people of Greece promptly kicked out at the next available opportunity in the next election). I also saw arrogant French leaders doing the same to Italy, forcing their democratically elected leader to resign so they could install their own technocratic Europhile henchman there. Now just as in Greece, the Italian people have kicked Renzi out. The arrogance and lack of respect for democracy the EU displays is truly staggering. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Just watched part 2 earlier about the Euro crisis in the EU. Another hour of EU fuckups for everyone to enjoy, it's on BBC iplayer now.
I must have watched a different part two to you then.
In my part two I saw the Greek self inflicted financial crisis blow up and Germany basically bailing them out, you know the same Germany many still slagg off, then Greece needing another bailout and the EU states coming together to bail Greece out again to give stability to the Euro that Greece was doing its best to destroy.
In return Greece had to hatchet their economy to try and start balancing their books.
All Greeces fault the lot of it.
If it showed if anything was the unity within the EU to tackle an international crisis.
Yes we must have watched different programmes, I saw the EU not fixing the problem and just putting sticking plasters on it time and again. The problem is still not properly fixed to this day. I also saw the EU forcing a democratically elected Greek Prime minister to resign so they could install their own Technocratic Europhile puppet in Athens (which the people of Greece promptly kicked out at the next available opportunity in the next election). I also saw arrogant French leaders doing the same to Italy, forcing their democratically elected leader to resign so they could install their own technocratic Europhile henchman there. Now just as in Greece, the Italian people have kicked Renzi out. The arrogance and lack of respect for democracy the EU displays is truly staggering. "
Honestly you give the EU far too much credit for power you assume they have that they do not...
I guess you have to attribute so much misplaced power to try and back up your ludicrous claims
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By *on12xxMan
over a year ago
leeds |
All leavers belive in Britain and not being ruled by unelected Europeans
We fought 2 wars to be free
Remains to young to remember before Europe we had 4 recessions while in Europe. How can that be good!!!
the vote will be the same to leave
As people get abused for saying leave so don't say in public
How can we tell world about democracy when we don't follow it
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"All leavers belive in Britain and not being ruled by unelected Europeans
We fought 2 wars to be free
Remains to young to remember before Europe we had 4 recessions while in Europe. How can that be good!!!
the vote will be the same to leave
As people get abused for saying leave so don't say in public
How can we tell world about democracy when we don't follow it
"
Which wars did you fight old timer .You seem discusted .
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"So u happy happy ruled by europe
I'm sure some of your family fought in wars we should respect them"
I have family who survived D day and Dunkirk and members of my French family were excuted by Nazis in woods outside a small village in northern France and I have a great uncle buried in Ypres WWI in a unmarked grave.
What disgusts me and turns my stomach is scum who use their sacrifice as propaganda for brexit .
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By *on12xxMan
over a year ago
leeds |
No not propganda sorry to hear your family history
History shows us what's happens if you leave Europe to themselves war.
I'm British
I belive we should control our own country as we freed Europe from nazis which we should be proud of
What is sad is that freedom of speech is being impacted as both sides not listening to the points unfortunately people abused for saying they support brexit after a democratic vote.
I belive we should rule our own country why do I get abused for that view
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AS the clock is ticking and we are getting closer to March 29 I’ve noticed the tone from some remianers getting worse fuck knows what it will be like in March lol yr entiteled to yr opinion mate just like everyone else |
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"Let's take wars out of the equation. Sorry u were impacted by war
I don't like being ru led by Europeans who have not been elected
Even tho are mp's are poor we voted them in"
almost everyone who had grandparents and great grandparents born in the uk will of been impacted by war |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"No not propganda sorry to hear your family history
History shows us what's happens if you leave Europe to themselves war.
I'm British
I belive we should control our own country as we freed Europe from nazis which we should be proud of
What is sad is that freedom of speech is being impacted as both sides not listening to the points unfortunately people abused for saying they support brexit after a democratic vote.
I belive we should rule our own country why do I get abused for that view
"
Only the British soldiers freed Europe from the Nazis? You must have forgotten who helped the British Army in the Battle of Britain. Without the Polish pilots the fate of war would be different and same like without the help of American soldiers. |
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By *on12xxMan
over a year ago
leeds |
Yes American a lies support us . Europe doesn't
polish soldiers fought in the war bravely and with great honour
Anyone not talking about this anymore as not allowed to have opioino on my court without abuse this not democracy
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By *naqMan
over a year ago
Ayrshire |
"No not propganda sorry to hear your family history
History shows us what's happens if you leave Europe to themselves war.
I'm British
I belive we should control our own country as we freed Europe from nazis which we should be proud of
And manipulated the global economy afterwards trading off other countries resources between the newly formed superpowers.
What is sad is that freedom of speech is being impacted as both sides not listening to the points unfortunately people abused for saying they support brexit after a democratic vote.
The remain camp seem to be asking a lot more questions and the leave camp are repeating themselves more and more never giving a real answer more the "trust me it'll be fine" approach while scuttling around in the dark desperately trying to "secure a deal"
I belive we should rule our own country why do I get abused for that view
Who's country White British men? The entire country is made up of a ridiculous amount of different cultures to classify people as British is a scapegoat for complete ignorance of other peoples history and culture. I'd imagine your bloodline is more than likely of european origin so i wouldn't agree with Britain for the British angle.
"
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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago
North West |
"
I belive we should control our own country as we freed Europe from nazis which we should be proud of
"
When knowledge of history is so corrupted that it leads to people to state (and presumably believe) comments like the one above - we are fucked.
"We" lost disastrously to the Nazi's in 1940 when we were routed in a matter of days and sent scuttling off to Dunkirk with our tails between our legs. This was despite the British right-wing press stating for months and months prior that Adolf would not dare take on the might of the BEF and that comparing the British armed forces to the Poles and Czechs was foolhardy. The rest is (actual) history and the BEF was all but destroyed in just a few days.
Thanks to a coalition of international and free European pilots (including the Poles of 302 & 303 fighter squadrons), the RAF managed to thwart the Nazi invasion of Britain and thereafter thanks to the Russians opening a front in the East and a combined UK/US front opening in Italy - the combined Allied forces were subsequently able to gain a foothold in N France and eventually defeat the Nazi's.
"We" did not defeat the Nazi's. The Allies defeated the Nazi's and it was due to the great sacrifices of many, many nations that the Nazi's were eventually defeated.
History is important because when you know what has happened in the past, it helps to formulate a more balanced view of what might happen in the future. How can you know where you are going, if you don't know where you have come from? |
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"
I belive we should control our own country as we freed Europe from nazis which we should be proud of
When knowledge of history is so corrupted that it leads to people to state (and presumably believe) comments like the one above - we are fucked.
"We" lost disastrously to the Nazi's in 1940 when we were routed in a matter of days and sent scuttling off to Dunkirk with our tails between our legs. This was despite the British right-wing press stating for months and months prior that Adolf would not dare take on the might of the BEF and that comparing the British armed forces to the Poles and Czechs was foolhardy. The rest is (actual) history and the BEF was all but destroyed in just a few days.
Thanks to a coalition of international and free European pilots (including the Poles of 302 & 303 fighter squadrons), the RAF managed to thwart the Nazi invasion of Britain and thereafter thanks to the Russians opening a front in the East and a combined UK/US front opening in Italy - the combined Allied forces were subsequently able to gain a foothold in N France and eventually defeat the Nazi's.
"We" did not defeat the Nazi's. The Allies defeated the Nazi's and it was due to the great sacrifices of many, many nations that the Nazi's were eventually defeated.
History is important because when you know what has happened in the past, it helps to formulate a more balanced view of what might happen in the future. How can you know where you are going, if you don't know where you have come from?"
This..
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"think next week is about the euro crisis not brexit.
It takes a 3 part series to document the EU's fuck ups over the last decade. There are too many of them to fit into one episode. "
Perhaps we could have a 10 part series to reflect on the Tory party’s fuck ups on Brexit!? & that would only scratch the surface... |
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"AS the clock is ticking and we are getting closer to March 29 I’ve noticed the tone from some remianers getting worse fuck knows what it will be like in March lol yr entiteled to yr opinion mate just like everyone else "
The tone is getting worse from remainers because they are getting more and more desperate the closer the March 29th deadline gets. Prime example is unelected Donald Tusk saying today that people who campaigned for Brexit have a special place in Hell. With Friends like him who needs enemies eh? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"AS the clock is ticking and we are getting closer to March 29 I’ve noticed the tone from some remianers getting worse fuck knows what it will be like in March lol yr entiteled to yr opinion mate just like everyone else
The tone is getting worse from remainers because they are getting more and more desperate the closer the March 29th deadline gets. Prime example is unelected Donald Tusk saying today that people who campaigned for Brexit have a special place in Hell. With Friends like him who needs enemies eh?"
Like normal you only use the bit of quote to suit your twisted view.
He said people who campaigned without even a sketch of a plan of how to carry it out safely.
But you knew that but then if you'd quoted the full sentence it blows your point doesn't it |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"
I belive we should control our own country as we freed Europe from nazis which we should be proud of
When knowledge of history is so corrupted that it leads to people to state (and presumably believe) comments like the one above - we are fucked.
"We" lost disastrously to the Nazi's in 1940 when we were routed in a matter of days and sent scuttling off to Dunkirk with our tails between our legs. This was despite the British right-wing press stating for months and months prior that Adolf would not dare take on the might of the BEF and that comparing the British armed forces to the Poles and Czechs was foolhardy. The rest is (actual) history and the BEF was all but destroyed in just a few days.
Thanks to a coalition of international and free European pilots (including the Poles of 302 & 303 fighter squadrons), the RAF managed to thwart the Nazi invasion of Britain and thereafter thanks to the Russians opening a front in the East and a combined UK/US front opening in Italy - the combined Allied forces were subsequently able to gain a foothold in N France and eventually defeat the Nazi's.
"We" did not defeat the Nazi's. The Allies defeated the Nazi's and it was due to the great sacrifices of many, many nations that the Nazi's were eventually defeated.
History is important because when you know what has happened in the past, it helps to formulate a more balanced view of what might happen in the future. How can you know where you are going, if you don't know where you have come from?"
And dont forget all the soldiers from the commonwealth countries who fought on iur side in both world wars and so often get conveniently whitewashed out of history by the sabre rattlers who read to many war picture library comics when they were growing up. Unfortunately a lot of people like to think that life would be better if we could just ignore sections of history to tell the western story of the plucky lads who rolled up their sleeves and with a bit of help from their mates in the US and some Aussies beat the nazis by putting their backs into it and giving them what for. Truth is if Hitler had not turned on the Russians and over reached himself we would be living in a very different unified Europe these days. The US would have gone either way as they had plenty of pro nazi people who were more than willing to give a home to useful germans after the war. I could go on but who is listening |
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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago
upton wirral |
"If mainstream media is the contemporaneous account, the programme was the first version of history.
So much to squeeze into a programme like that.
Cameron refused to be interviewed apparently. He has sold his story to a publisher.
No surprise there - he sold out a whole nation.
There was a lot to squeeze in the programme, but it wasn't the only part. It's a 3 part series, looking forward to seeing part 2 next week. "
It is part three next week you missed the first |
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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago
upton wirral |
"think next week is about the euro crisis not brexit.
It takes a 3 part series to document the EU's fuck ups over the last decade. There are too many of them to fit into one episode.
Perhaps we could have a 10 part series to reflect on the Tory party’s fuck ups on Brexit!? & that would only scratch the surface..."
Ok say you hate the tories,could Labour have done better?Ha ha they have even less idea |
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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago
upton wirral |
"Democracy not being followed
We voted out not fudge deal
Out is out
So the country cares more about money then morals then democracy "
So very true remainers are greedy and selfish with no morals |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"AS the clock is ticking and we are getting closer to March 29 I’ve noticed the tone from some remianers getting worse fuck knows what it will be like in March lol yr entiteled to yr opinion mate just like everyone else
The tone is getting worse from remainers because they are getting more and more desperate the closer the March 29th deadline gets. Prime example is unelected Donald Tusk saying today that people who campaigned for Brexit have a special place in Hell. With Friends like him who needs enemies eh?
Like normal you only use the bit of quote to suit your twisted view.
He said people who campaigned without even a sketch of a plan of how to carry it out safely.
But you knew that but then if you'd quoted the full sentence it blows your point doesn't it "
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"AS the clock is ticking and we are getting closer to March 29 I’ve noticed the tone from some remianers getting worse fuck knows what it will be like in March lol yr entiteled to yr opinion mate just like everyone else
The tone is getting worse from remainers because they are getting more and more desperate the closer the March 29th deadline gets. Prime example is unelected Donald Tusk saying today that people who campaigned for Brexit have a special place in Hell. With Friends like him who needs enemies eh?
Like normal you only use the bit of quote to suit your twisted view.
He said people who campaigned without even a sketch of a plan of how to carry it out safely.
But you knew that but then if you'd quoted the full sentence it blows your point doesn't it "
The leave campaign set out a basic plan during the referendum campaign with a clear list of objectives that should happen if Leave won, so Donald Tusk hasn't got a clue what he's talking about, but not the least bit surprised to see you attempt to defend his vile comments today. It was the remainer David Cameron who was the Prime minister, he called the referendum and made no contingency plan for a Leave vote. It was the remain led Cameron government who failed to plan and had no sketch of a plan for leave.
Just to highlight how dumb Donald Tusk is he was caught giggling after he made those comments on a live mic, which he thought had been switched off. Saying people deserve a special place in Hell, and then laughing about it afterwards, he's just shown himself up for the monumental twat he really is. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"AS the clock is ticking and we are getting closer to March 29 I’ve noticed the tone from some remianers getting worse fuck knows what it will be like in March lol yr entiteled to yr opinion mate just like everyone else
The tone is getting worse from remainers because they are getting more and more desperate the closer the March 29th deadline gets. Prime example is unelected Donald Tusk saying today that people who campaigned for Brexit have a special place in Hell. With Friends like him who needs enemies eh?
Like normal you only use the bit of quote to suit your twisted view.
He said people who campaigned without even a sketch of a plan of how to carry it out safely.
But you knew that but then if you'd quoted the full sentence it blows your point doesn't it
The leave campaign set out a basic plan during the referendum campaign with a clear list of objectives that should happen if Leave won, so Donald Tusk hasn't got a clue what he's talking about, but not the least bit surprised to see you attempt to defend his vile comments today. It was the remainer David Cameron who was the Prime minister, he called the referendum and made no contingency plan for a Leave vote. It was the remain led Cameron government who failed to plan and had no sketch of a plan for leave.
Just to highlight how dumb Donald Tusk is he was caught giggling after he made those comments on a live mic, which he thought had been switched off. Saying people deserve a special place in Hell, and then laughing about it afterwards, he's just shown himself up for the monumental twat he really is. "
He knew that the microphone was on, again you write about something that you have no idea about :o  |
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"AS the clock is ticking and we are getting closer to March 29 I’ve noticed the tone from some remianers getting worse fuck knows what it will be like in March lol yr entiteled to yr opinion mate just like everyone else
The tone is getting worse from remainers because they are getting more and more desperate the closer the March 29th deadline gets. Prime example is unelected Donald Tusk saying today that people who campaigned for Brexit have a special place in Hell. With Friends like him who needs enemies eh?
Like normal you only use the bit of quote to suit your twisted view.
He said people who campaigned without even a sketch of a plan of how to carry it out safely.
But you knew that but then if you'd quoted the full sentence it blows your point doesn't it
The leave campaign set out a basic plan during the referendum campaign with a clear list of objectives that should happen if Leave won, so Donald Tusk hasn't got a clue what he's talking about, but not the least bit surprised to see you attempt to defend his vile comments today. It was the remainer David Cameron who was the Prime minister, he called the referendum and made no contingency plan for a Leave vote. It was the remain led Cameron government who failed to plan and had no sketch of a plan for leave.
Just to highlight how dumb Donald Tusk is he was caught giggling after he made those comments on a live mic, which he thought had been switched off. Saying people deserve a special place in Hell, and then laughing about it afterwards, he's just shown himself up for the monumental twat he really is. "
...what was this ‘basic plan’ you speak of? Perhaps it might help us all understand what we are arguing about  |
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"AS the clock is ticking and we are getting closer to March 29 I’ve noticed the tone from some remianers getting worse fuck knows what it will be like in March lol yr entiteled to yr opinion mate just like everyone else
The tone is getting worse from remainers because they are getting more and more desperate the closer the March 29th deadline gets. Prime example is unelected Donald Tusk saying today that people who campaigned for Brexit have a special place in Hell. With Friends like him who needs enemies eh?
Like normal you only use the bit of quote to suit your twisted view.
He said people who campaigned without even a sketch of a plan of how to carry it out safely.
But you knew that but then if you'd quoted the full sentence it blows your point doesn't it
The leave campaign set out a basic plan during the referendum campaign with a clear list of objectives that should happen if Leave won, so Donald Tusk hasn't got a clue what he's talking about, but not the least bit surprised to see you attempt to defend his vile comments today. It was the remainer David Cameron who was the Prime minister, he called the referendum and made no contingency plan for a Leave vote. It was the remain led Cameron government who failed to plan and had no sketch of a plan for leave.
Just to highlight how dumb Donald Tusk is he was caught giggling after he made those comments on a live mic, which he thought had been switched off. Saying people deserve a special place in Hell, and then laughing about it afterwards, he's just shown himself up for the monumental twat he really is. "
Well said Donald, so very true. |
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"AS the clock is ticking and we are getting closer to March 29 I’ve noticed the tone from some remianers getting worse fuck knows what it will be like in March lol yr entiteled to yr opinion mate just like everyone else
The tone is getting worse from remainers because they are getting more and more desperate the closer the March 29th deadline gets. Prime example is unelected Donald Tusk saying today that people who campaigned for Brexit have a special place in Hell. With Friends like him who needs enemies eh?
Like normal you only use the bit of quote to suit your twisted view.
He said people who campaigned without even a sketch of a plan of how to carry it out safely.
But you knew that but then if you'd quoted the full sentence it blows your point doesn't it
The leave campaign set out a basic plan during the referendum campaign with a clear list of objectives that should happen if Leave won, so Donald Tusk hasn't got a clue what he's talking about, but not the least bit surprised to see you attempt to defend his vile comments today. It was the remainer David Cameron who was the Prime minister, he called the referendum and made no contingency plan for a Leave vote. It was the remain led Cameron government who failed to plan and had no sketch of a plan for leave.
Just to highlight how dumb Donald Tusk is he was caught giggling after he made those comments on a live mic, which he thought had been switched off. Saying people deserve a special place in Hell, and then laughing about it afterwards, he's just shown himself up for the monumental twat he really is. "
A list of objectives is not a plan.
Example, my objective is to be a billionaire.
Do I have a plan?
No, f*ck it. Some other mug can figure that out. |
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"AS the clock is ticking and we are getting closer to March 29 I’ve noticed the tone from some remianers getting worse fuck knows what it will be like in March lol yr entiteled to yr opinion mate just like everyone else
The tone is getting worse from remainers because they are getting more and more desperate the closer the March 29th deadline gets. Prime example is unelected Donald Tusk saying today that people who campaigned for Brexit have a special place in Hell. With Friends like him who needs enemies eh?
Like normal you only use the bit of quote to suit your twisted view.
He said people who campaigned without even a sketch of a plan of how to carry it out safely.
But you knew that but then if you'd quoted the full sentence it blows your point doesn't it
The leave campaign set out a basic plan during the referendum campaign with a clear list of objectives that should happen if Leave won, so Donald Tusk hasn't got a clue what he's talking about, but not the least bit surprised to see you attempt to defend his vile comments today. It was the remainer David Cameron who was the Prime minister, he called the referendum and made no contingency plan for a Leave vote. It was the remain led Cameron government who failed to plan and had no sketch of a plan for leave.
Just to highlight how dumb Donald Tusk is he was caught giggling after he made those comments on a live mic, which he thought had been switched off. Saying people deserve a special place in Hell, and then laughing about it afterwards, he's just shown himself up for the monumental twat he really is.
A list of objectives is not a plan.
Example, my objective is to be a billionaire.
Do I have a plan?
No, f*ck it. Some other mug can figure that out."
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"Just watched part 2 earlier about the Euro crisis in the EU. Another hour of EU fuckups for everyone to enjoy, it's on BBC iplayer now.
I must have watched a different part two to you then.
In my part two I saw the Greek self inflicted financial crisis blow up and Germany basically bailing them out, you know the same Germany many still slagg off, then Greece needing another bailout and the EU states coming together to bail Greece out again to give stability to the Euro that Greece was doing its best to destroy.
In return Greece had to hatchet their economy to try and start balancing their books.
All Greeces fault the lot of it.
If it showed if anything was the unity within the EU to tackle an international crisis.
Yes we must have watched different programmes, I saw the EU not fixing the problem and just putting sticking plasters on it time and again. The problem is still not properly fixed to this day. I also saw the EU forcing a democratically elected Greek Prime minister to resign so they could install their own Technocratic Europhile puppet in Athens (which the people of Greece promptly kicked out at the next available opportunity in the next election). I also saw arrogant French leaders doing the same to Italy, forcing their democratically elected leader to resign so they could install their own technocratic Europhile henchman there. Now just as in Greece, the Italian people have kicked Renzi out. The arrogance and lack of respect for democracy the EU displays is truly staggering. "
Nobody forced them to resign. They resigned because they chose to.
Also, Greece could have decided to leave the EU. But it didn't. I wonder why?
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"AS the clock is ticking and we are getting closer to March 29 I’ve noticed the tone from some remianers getting worse fuck knows what it will be like in March lol yr entiteled to yr opinion mate just like everyone else
The tone is getting worse from remainers because they are getting more and more desperate the closer the March 29th deadline gets. Prime example is unelected Donald Tusk saying today that people who campaigned for Brexit have a special place in Hell. With Friends like him who needs enemies eh?
Like normal you only use the bit of quote to suit your twisted view.
He said people who campaigned without even a sketch of a plan of how to carry it out safely.
But you knew that but then if you'd quoted the full sentence it blows your point doesn't it
The leave campaign set out a basic plan during the referendum campaign with a clear list of objectives that should happen if Leave won, so Donald Tusk hasn't got a clue what he's talking about, but not the least bit surprised to see you attempt to defend his vile comments today. It was the remainer David Cameron who was the Prime minister, he called the referendum and made no contingency plan for a Leave vote. It was the remain led Cameron government who failed to plan and had no sketch of a plan for leave.
Just to highlight how dumb Donald Tusk is he was caught giggling after he made those comments on a live mic, which he thought had been switched off. Saying people deserve a special place in Hell, and then laughing about it afterwards, he's just shown himself up for the monumental twat he really is.
He knew that the microphone was on, again you write about something that you have no idea about :o "
The vid on the Ft certainly seemed to look like it was part of a speech. They must have cut away from the chuckle. |
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"AS the clock is ticking and we are getting closer to March 29 I’ve noticed the tone from some remianers getting worse fuck knows what it will be like in March lol yr entiteled to yr opinion mate just like everyone else
The tone is getting worse from remainers because they are getting more and more desperate the closer the March 29th deadline gets. Prime example is unelected Donald Tusk saying today that people who campaigned for Brexit have a special place in Hell. With Friends like him who needs enemies eh?
Like normal you only use the bit of quote to suit your twisted view.
He said people who campaigned without even a sketch of a plan of how to carry it out safely.
But you knew that but then if you'd quoted the full sentence it blows your point doesn't it
The leave campaign set out a basic plan during the referendum campaign with a clear list of objectives that should happen if Leave won, so Donald Tusk hasn't got a clue what he's talking about, but not the least bit surprised to see you attempt to defend his vile comments today. It was the remainer David Cameron who was the Prime minister, he called the referendum and made no contingency plan for a Leave vote. It was the remain led Cameron government who failed to plan and had no sketch of a plan for leave.
Just to highlight how dumb Donald Tusk is he was caught giggling after he made those comments on a live mic, which he thought had been switched off. Saying people deserve a special place in Hell, and then laughing about it afterwards, he's just shown himself up for the monumental twat he really is.
...what was this ‘basic plan’ you speak of? Perhaps it might help us all understand what we are arguing about "
For a start Ukip had been saying for years the first thing you do when you want to leave the EU is repeal the 1972 European communities act.
Was that listened to and done though? No it wasn't.
Vote Leave listed a clear set of proposals should leave win the referendum being we leave the single market, leave the customs union, end free movement of people, end payments to the EU budget, end the jurisdiction of the ECJ in the UK, and take back the ability to strike our own trade deals around the rest of the world. Those proposals form a basic sketch of a plan for leaving. There is no half in/half out Brexit which it is becoming increasingly clear Theresa May wants to fudge together. It won't work, Leave won the referendum so we need to fully Leave, sorry if remainers dont like that but that's the way it is. Once article 50 was triggered Nigel Farage said the very next day that we should now start preparing for a no deal exit, again wasn't listened to by the government. |
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"AS the clock is ticking and we are getting closer to March 29 I’ve noticed the tone from some remianers getting worse fuck knows what it will be like in March lol yr entiteled to yr opinion mate just like everyone else
The tone is getting worse from remainers because they are getting more and more desperate the closer the March 29th deadline gets. Prime example is unelected Donald Tusk saying today that people who campaigned for Brexit have a special place in Hell. With Friends like him who needs enemies eh?
Like normal you only use the bit of quote to suit your twisted view.
He said people who campaigned without even a sketch of a plan of how to carry it out safely.
But you knew that but then if you'd quoted the full sentence it blows your point doesn't it
The leave campaign set out a basic plan during the referendum campaign with a clear list of objectives that should happen if Leave won, so Donald Tusk hasn't got a clue what he's talking about, but not the least bit surprised to see you attempt to defend his vile comments today. It was the remainer David Cameron who was the Prime minister, he called the referendum and made no contingency plan for a Leave vote. It was the remain led Cameron government who failed to plan and had no sketch of a plan for leave.
Just to highlight how dumb Donald Tusk is he was caught giggling after he made those comments on a live mic, which he thought had been switched off. Saying people deserve a special place in Hell, and then laughing about it afterwards, he's just shown himself up for the monumental twat he really is.
A list of objectives is not a plan.
Example, my objective is to be a billionaire.
Do I have a plan?
No, f*ck it. Some other mug can figure that out."
The exact term Donald Tusk used was "basic sketch of a plan". Those proposals form a basic sketch of a plan. |
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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
Lololol you really do not have a clue, do you.
There was no plan. There never was.
Just sound-bytes and slogans.
How big do you think the GANTT chart for something this monumental might look?
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"AS the clock is ticking and we are getting closer to March 29 I’ve noticed the tone from some remianers getting worse fuck knows what it will be like in March lol yr entiteled to yr opinion mate just like everyone else
The tone is getting worse from remainers because they are getting more and more desperate the closer the March 29th deadline gets. Prime example is unelected Donald Tusk saying today that people who campaigned for Brexit have a special place in Hell. With Friends like him who needs enemies eh?
Like normal you only use the bit of quote to suit your twisted view.
He said people who campaigned without even a sketch of a plan of how to carry it out safely.
But you knew that but then if you'd quoted the full sentence it blows your point doesn't it
The leave campaign set out a basic plan during the referendum campaign with a clear list of objectives that should happen if Leave won, so Donald Tusk hasn't got a clue what he's talking about, but not the least bit surprised to see you attempt to defend his vile comments today. It was the remainer David Cameron who was the Prime minister, he called the referendum and made no contingency plan for a Leave vote. It was the remain led Cameron government who failed to plan and had no sketch of a plan for leave.
Just to highlight how dumb Donald Tusk is he was caught giggling after he made those comments on a live mic, which he thought had been switched off. Saying people deserve a special place in Hell, and then laughing about it afterwards, he's just shown himself up for the monumental twat he really is.
A list of objectives is not a plan.
Example, my objective is to be a billionaire.
Do I have a plan?
No, f*ck it. Some other mug can figure that out.
The exact term Donald Tusk used was "basic sketch of a plan". Those proposals form a basic sketch of a plan. "
So no one should be offended. Why is everyone getting so triggered. Remainers are meant to be the snowflakes. |
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"AS the clock is ticking and we are getting closer to March 29 I’ve noticed the tone from some remianers getting worse fuck knows what it will be like in March lol yr entiteled to yr opinion mate just like everyone else
The tone is getting worse from remainers because they are getting more and more desperate the closer the March 29th deadline gets. Prime example is unelected Donald Tusk saying today that people who campaigned for Brexit have a special place in Hell. With Friends like him who needs enemies eh?
Like normal you only use the bit of quote to suit your twisted view.
He said people who campaigned without even a sketch of a plan of how to carry it out safely.
But you knew that but then if you'd quoted the full sentence it blows your point doesn't it
The leave campaign set out a basic plan during the referendum campaign with a clear list of objectives that should happen if Leave won, so Donald Tusk hasn't got a clue what he's talking about, but not the least bit surprised to see you attempt to defend his vile comments today. It was the remainer David Cameron who was the Prime minister, he called the referendum and made no contingency plan for a Leave vote. It was the remain led Cameron government who failed to plan and had no sketch of a plan for leave.
Just to highlight how dumb Donald Tusk is he was caught giggling after he made those comments on a live mic, which he thought had been switched off. Saying people deserve a special place in Hell, and then laughing about it afterwards, he's just shown himself up for the monumental twat he really is.
A list of objectives is not a plan.
Example, my objective is to be a billionaire.
Do I have a plan?
No, f*ck it. Some other mug can figure that out.
The exact term Donald Tusk used was "basic sketch of a plan". Those proposals form a basic sketch of a plan. "
No they don't. |
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Just watched part 3 of Europe - 10 years in turmoil about the migration crisis in the EU, on BBC iplayer. All I can say after watching that debacle is thank fuck we are leaving, and the sooner the better. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Just watched part 3 of Europe - 10 years in turmoil about the migration crisis in the EU, on BBC iplayer. All I can say after watching that debacle is thank fuck we are leaving, and the sooner the better. "
I take it you didn't see the report the other day that immigration post brexit is likely to rise not fall.
Thats going to be a hard one to sell. |
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By *oghunter33Woman
over a year ago
on the hill NordWest of |
The second part of that series was particularly poor. No mentioning what led up to the Euro crisis or the flaws of the Euro itself, just displaying Greece as the bad boy in the club. Disappointing journalism. |
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
Showed junker for what he is when he said he liked all night talks because the people waiting to vote are all tired in the morning and dont ask questions just vote it through because they want to go to bed.That about sums him up,had the right hump when merkel and the dutchman agreed a deal with turkey behind his back. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Feels niave to think this is all EU only. There will be a follow on series in a few years about brexit and Mays actions. (See chequers for overnight tactics)
But at least it’s our mess eh? |
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"It was a good 3 part series showing problem after problem being solved over and over "
Arguably not solved.....just delayed, fudged or simply walked over.
The migrant problem across Europe till exists, we haven't seen the final effects of Brexit on the EU and are unlikely to do so for 10 or 20 years and the Greeks are still in turmoil with implications for other, similarly misaligned economies.
I would call it more of a mid term report with an uncertain ending. I suspect the word "solved" is either an error or a bit of wishful thinking from an anti Brexit supporter. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"It was a good 3 part series showing problem after problem being solved over and over
Arguably not solved.....just delayed, fudged or simply walked over.
The migrant problem across Europe till exists, we haven't seen the final effects of Brexit on the EU and are unlikely to do so for 10 or 20 years and the Greeks are still in turmoil with implications for other, similarly misaligned economies.
I would call it more of a mid term report with an uncertain ending. I suspect the word "solved" is either an error or a bit of wishful thinking from an anti Brexit supporter."
The flood of humanity to Greece dropped by 97%, other than what's been done there's nothing left that anyone can do other than making people not want to leave to start with. Why the EU should shoulder this responsibility is beyond me. If anything it's a worldwide issue and blaming just the EU is frankly pathetic.
Greece brought everything upon themselves and nearly took everyone down with them but that Greek disaster was overted, bankruptcy avoided, but maybe they should of just fucked off and melted into insignificance quietly in a corner but they were given tough medicine which will take time to run it's course.
Brexit is our shit of a mess and we own it, we wanted it and we're going to get it. He |
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By *oghunter33Woman
over a year ago
on the hill NordWest of |
"It was a good 3 part series showing problem after problem being solved over and over
Arguably not solved.....just delayed, fudged or simply walked over.
The migrant problem across Europe till exists, we haven't seen the final effects of Brexit on the EU and are unlikely to do so for 10 or 20 years and the Greeks are still in turmoil with implications for other, similarly misaligned economies.
I would call it more of a mid term report with an uncertain ending. I suspect the word "solved" is either an error or a bit of wishful thinking from an anti Brexit supporter.
The flood of humanity to Greece dropped by 97%, other than what's been done there's nothing left that anyone can do other than making people not want to leave to start with. Why the EU should shoulder this responsibility is beyond me. If anything it's a worldwide issue and blaming just the EU is frankly pathetic.
Greece brought everything upon themselves and nearly took everyone down with them but that Greek disaster was overted, bankruptcy avoided, but maybe they should of just fucked off and melted into insignificance quietly in a corner but they were given tough medicine which will take time to run it's course.
Brexit is our shit of a mess and we own it, we wanted it and we're going to get it. He "
While Greece is and was certainly responsible for the biggest part of their misery I do not agree that they brought everything upon themselves. Greece isn't and wasn't responsible for the wreckless lending, it isn't and wasn't responsible for the great recession and it isn't and wasn't responsible for a single currency called Euro that took away a government's main adjustment mechanisms to deal with a financial crisis without providing alternative institution.
Any but I agree with you that Brexit is fully made in UK. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"It was a good 3 part series showing problem after problem being solved over and over
Arguably not solved.....just delayed, fudged or simply walked over.
The migrant problem across Europe till exists, we haven't seen the final effects of Brexit on the EU and are unlikely to do so for 10 or 20 years and the Greeks are still in turmoil with implications for other, similarly misaligned economies.
I would call it more of a mid term report with an uncertain ending. I suspect the word "solved" is either an error or a bit of wishful thinking from an anti Brexit supporter.
The flood of humanity to Greece dropped by 97%, other than what's been done there's nothing left that anyone can do other than making people not want to leave to start with. Why the EU should shoulder this responsibility is beyond me. If anything it's a worldwide issue and blaming just the EU is frankly pathetic.
Greece brought everything upon themselves and nearly took everyone down with them but that Greek disaster was overted, bankruptcy avoided, but maybe they should of just fucked off and melted into insignificance quietly in a corner but they were given tough medicine which will take time to run it's course.
Brexit is our shit of a mess and we own it, we wanted it and we're going to get it. He
While Greece is and was certainly responsible for the biggest part of their misery I do not agree that they brought everything upon themselves. Greece isn't and wasn't responsible for the wreckless lending, it isn't and wasn't responsible for the great recession and it isn't and wasn't responsible for a single currency called Euro that took away a government's main adjustment mechanisms to deal with a financial crisis without providing alternative institution.
Any but I agree with you that Brexit is fully made in UK."
So if I go out and borrow and borrow and fudge my financial true facts to enable me to borrow and borrow some more then I find I'm on the verge of going bust... that's not my fault....
Oooookaayyyy..... |
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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
"It was a good 3 part series showing problem after problem being solved over and over
Arguably not solved.....just delayed, fudged or simply walked over.
The migrant problem across Europe till exists, we haven't seen the final effects of Brexit on the EU and are unlikely to do so for 10 or 20 years and the Greeks are still in turmoil with implications for other, similarly misaligned economies.
I would call it more of a mid term report with an uncertain ending. I suspect the word "solved" is either an error or a bit of wishful thinking from an anti Brexit supporter."
I wonder what the migrant crisis would look like if the EU did not exist?
The Europhobes in here want to lay the problem at the door of the EU and cite it as evidence of failure.
The failure was the failure of 28 nations, including the UK, to agree a common approach.
Now, if those same states were not joined together, how different would the outcome have been?
How would Greece and Italy have coped, for example?
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"It was a good 3 part series showing problem after problem being solved over and over
Arguably not solved.....just delayed, fudged or simply walked over.
The migrant problem across Europe till exists, we haven't seen the final effects of Brexit on the EU and are unlikely to do so for 10 or 20 years and the Greeks are still in turmoil with implications for other, similarly misaligned economies.
I would call it more of a mid term report with an uncertain ending. I suspect the word "solved" is either an error or a bit of wishful thinking from an anti Brexit supporter.
The flood of humanity to Greece dropped by 97%, other than what's been done there's nothing left that anyone can do other than making people not want to leave to start with. Why the EU should shoulder this responsibility is beyond me. If anything it's a worldwide issue and blaming just the EU is frankly pathetic.
Greece brought everything upon themselves and nearly took everyone down with them but that Greek disaster was overted, bankruptcy avoided, but maybe they should of just fucked off and melted into insignificance quietly in a corner but they were given tough medicine which will take time to run it's course.
Brexit is our shit of a mess and we own it, we wanted it and we're going to get it. He
While Greece is and was certainly responsible for the biggest part of their misery I do not agree that they brought everything upon themselves. Greece isn't and wasn't responsible for the wreckless lending, it isn't and wasn't responsible for the great recession and it isn't and wasn't responsible for a single currency called Euro that took away a government's main adjustment mechanisms to deal with a financial crisis without providing alternative institution.
Any but I agree with you that Brexit is fully made in UK."
Well they were because they wanted it and the stability and cheaper borrowing that it brought.
They chose to to borrow, mis-spend the money and not follow the stability rules.
What was forced upon them considering that they were defaulting on loans? |
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By *oghunter33Woman
over a year ago
on the hill NordWest of |
"
Greece brought everything upon themselves and nearly took everyone down with them but that Greek disaster was overted, bankruptcy avoided, but maybe they should of just fucked off and melted into insignificance quietly in a corner but they were given tough medicine which will take time to run it's course.
Brexit is our shit of a mess and we own it, we wanted it and we're going to get it. He
While Greece is and was certainly responsible for the biggest part of their misery I do not agree that they brought everything upon themselves. Greece isn't and wasn't responsible for the wreckless lending, it isn't and wasn't responsible for the great recession and it isn't and wasn't responsible for a single currency called Euro that took away a government's main adjustment mechanisms to deal with a financial crisis without providing alternative institution.
Any but I agree with you that Brexit is fully made in UK.
So if I go out and borrow and borrow and fudge my financial true facts to enable me to borrow and borrow some more then I find I'm on the verge of going bust... that's not my fault....
Oooookaayyyy..... "
I clearly stated right at the top that Greece is responsible for the bulk of their misery, but you choose to overlook that.
There's no wreckless lending without a wreckless lender, is there? And wasn't that one of the main causes for the last worldwide economic downturn? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"It was a good 3 part series showing problem after problem being solved over and over
Arguably not solved.....just delayed, fudged or simply walked over.
The migrant problem across Europe till exists, we haven't seen the final effects of Brexit on the EU and are unlikely to do so for 10 or 20 years and the Greeks are still in turmoil with implications for other, similarly misaligned economies.
I would call it more of a mid term report with an uncertain ending. I suspect the word "solved" is either an error or a bit of wishful thinking from an anti Brexit supporter.
The flood of humanity to Greece dropped by 97%, other than what's been done there's nothing left that anyone can do other than making people not want to leave to start with. Why the EU should shoulder this responsibility is beyond me. If anything it's a worldwide issue and blaming just the EU is frankly pathetic.
Greece brought everything upon themselves and nearly took everyone down with them but that Greek disaster was overted, bankruptcy avoided, but maybe they should of just fucked off and melted into insignificance quietly in a corner but they were given tough medicine which will take time to run it's course.
Brexit is our shit of a mess and we own it, we wanted it and we're going to get it. He
While Greece is and was certainly responsible for the biggest part of their misery I do not agree that they brought everything upon themselves. Greece isn't and wasn't responsible for the wreckless lending, it isn't and wasn't responsible for the great recession and it isn't and wasn't responsible for a single currency called Euro that took away a government's main adjustment mechanisms to deal with a financial crisis without providing alternative institution.
Any but I agree with you that Brexit is fully made in UK.
Well they were because they wanted it and the stability and cheaper borrowing that it brought.
They chose to to borrow, mis-spend the money and not follow the stability rules.
What was forced upon them considering that they were defaulting on loans?"
.
There not choosing to borrow, there a massive importer of German goods and it's a one way street, goods in, money out.
Germany didn't choose to bring in Greece or other basket case economies into they're single currency out of just the kindness of their heart, if Greece had a currency of their own the market would have stopped them borrowing money to buy German goods,ie the Greeks don't get to drive round in a fancy BMW they couldn't actually afford, it's not really any different to 90% of borrowing made in the West.
Were living in a neo liberal debt bubble that's about to implode, all the political manifestations were seeing now are just the beginning!.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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You clearly said
"Greece isn't and wasn't responsible for the wreckless lending"
Yes it was, it's your own bloody responsibility for asking for the loans to start and drawing up false financial statements to enable them loans to be accepted but that's the main crux you are skimming over. |
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By *oghunter33Woman
over a year ago
on the hill NordWest of |
"You clearly said
"Greece isn't and wasn't responsible for the wreckless lending"
Yes it was, it's your own bloody responsibility for asking for the loans to start and drawing up false financial statements to enable them loans to be accepted but that's the main crux you are skimming over. "
Greece is responsible for wreckless borrowing but not for wreckless lending. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"You clearly said
"Greece isn't and wasn't responsible for the wreckless lending"
Yes it was, it's your own bloody responsibility for asking for the loans to start and drawing up false financial statements to enable them loans to be accepted but that's the main crux you are skimming over.
Greece is responsible for wreckless borrowing but not for wreckless lending. "
However you want to word it, it's all the Greeks doing. |
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By *oghunter33Woman
over a year ago
on the hill NordWest of |
"It was a good 3 part series showing problem after problem being solved over and over
Arguably not solved.....just delayed, fudged or simply walked over.
The migrant problem across Europe till exists, we haven't seen the final effects of Brexit on the EU and are unlikely to do so for 10 or 20 years and the Greeks are still in turmoil with implications for other, similarly misaligned economies.
I would call it more of a mid term report with an uncertain ending. I suspect the word "solved" is either an error or a bit of wishful thinking from an anti Brexit supporter.
The flood of humanity to Greece dropped by 97%, other than what's been done there's nothing left that anyone can do other than making people not want to leave to start with. Why the EU should shoulder this responsibility is beyond me. If anything it's a worldwide issue and blaming just the EU is frankly pathetic.
Greece brought everything upon themselves and nearly took everyone down with them but that Greek disaster was overted, bankruptcy avoided, but maybe they should of just fucked off and melted into insignificance quietly in a corner but they were given tough medicine which will take time to run it's course.
Brexit is our shit of a mess and we own it, we wanted it and we're going to get it. He
While Greece is and was certainly responsible for the biggest part of their misery I do not agree that they brought everything upon themselves. Greece isn't and wasn't responsible for the wreckless lending, it isn't and wasn't responsible for the great recession and it isn't and wasn't responsible for a single currency called Euro that took away a government's main adjustment mechanisms to deal with a financial crisis without providing alternative institution.
Any but I agree with you that Brexit is fully made in UK.
Well they were because they wanted it and the stability and cheaper borrowing that it brought.
They chose to to borrow, mis-spend the money and not follow the stability rules.
What was forced upon them considering that they were defaulting on loans?"
It's not that simple black and white and you know it yourself. The Euro is an unfinished and ill thought project yet it was brought along with the promise of prosperity and stability. So you can't really blame Greece for joining the euro currency to get some of that cake. Unfortunately the cake isn't baked through. As soon as some member states have financial difficulties while others are flourishing you've a substantial problem.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"It was a good 3 part series showing problem after problem being solved over and over
Arguably not solved.....just delayed, fudged or simply walked over.
The migrant problem across Europe till exists, we haven't seen the final effects of Brexit on the EU and are unlikely to do so for 10 or 20 years and the Greeks are still in turmoil with implications for other, similarly misaligned economies.
I would call it more of a mid term report with an uncertain ending. I suspect the word "solved" is either an error or a bit of wishful thinking from an anti Brexit supporter.
The flood of humanity to Greece dropped by 97%, other than what's been done there's nothing left that anyone can do other than making people not want to leave to start with. Why the EU should shoulder this responsibility is beyond me. If anything it's a worldwide issue and blaming just the EU is frankly pathetic.
Greece brought everything upon themselves and nearly took everyone down with them but that Greek disaster was overted, bankruptcy avoided, but maybe they should of just fucked off and melted into insignificance quietly in a corner but they were given tough medicine which will take time to run it's course.
Brexit is our shit of a mess and we own it, we wanted it and we're going to get it. He
While Greece is and was certainly responsible for the biggest part of their misery I do not agree that they brought everything upon themselves. Greece isn't and wasn't responsible for the wreckless lending, it isn't and wasn't responsible for the great recession and it isn't and wasn't responsible for a single currency called Euro that took away a government's main adjustment mechanisms to deal with a financial crisis without providing alternative institution.
Any but I agree with you that Brexit is fully made in UK.
Well they were because they wanted it and the stability and cheaper borrowing that it brought.
They chose to to borrow, mis-spend the money and not follow the stability rules.
What was forced upon them considering that they were defaulting on loans?
It's not that simple black and white and you know it yourself. The Euro is an unfinished and ill thought project yet it was brought along with the promise of prosperity and stability. So you can't really blame Greece for joining the euro currency to get some of that cake. Unfortunately the cake isn't baked through. As soon as some member states have financial difficulties while others are flourishing you've a substantial problem.
"
Indeed and Greece bought every cake and buckets of cheeries and now they have severe indigestion |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"It was a good 3 part series showing problem after problem being solved over and over
Arguably not solved.....just delayed, fudged or simply walked over.
The migrant problem across Europe till exists, we haven't seen the final effects of Brexit on the EU and are unlikely to do so for 10 or 20 years and the Greeks are still in turmoil with implications for other, similarly misaligned economies.
I would call it more of a mid term report with an uncertain ending. I suspect the word "solved" is either an error or a bit of wishful thinking from an anti Brexit supporter.
The flood of humanity to Greece dropped by 97%, other than what's been done there's nothing left that anyone can do other than making people not want to leave to start with. Why the EU should shoulder this responsibility is beyond me. If anything it's a worldwide issue and blaming just the EU is frankly pathetic.
Greece brought everything upon themselves and nearly took everyone down with them but that Greek disaster was overted, bankruptcy avoided, but maybe they should of just fucked off and melted into insignificance quietly in a corner but they were given tough medicine which will take time to run it's course.
Brexit is our shit of a mess and we own it, we wanted it and we're going to get it. He
While Greece is and was certainly responsible for the biggest part of their misery I do not agree that they brought everything upon themselves. Greece isn't and wasn't responsible for the wreckless lending, it isn't and wasn't responsible for the great recession and it isn't and wasn't responsible for a single currency called Euro that took away a government's main adjustment mechanisms to deal with a financial crisis without providing alternative institution.
Any but I agree with you that Brexit is fully made in UK.
Well they were because they wanted it and the stability and cheaper borrowing that it brought.
They chose to to borrow, mis-spend the money and not follow the stability rules.
What was forced upon them considering that they were defaulting on loans?
It's not that simple black and white and you know it yourself. The Euro is an unfinished and ill thought project yet it was brought along with the promise of prosperity and stability. So you can't really blame Greece for joining the euro currency to get some of that cake. Unfortunately the cake isn't baked through. As soon as some member states have financial difficulties while others are flourishing you've a substantial problem.
"
I understand what you're saying.
The euro is not what it should be. However, every country involved were complicit in fudging numbers to get in. The understanding was always that although budgetry management was not as converged as it should be everyone would actually try to get it right. They didn't though. They cheated and behaved in the same way as they always did. Of they had done what they were supposed to they wouldn't be here.
Perhaps the ECB should have been tougher much earlier, but the less disciplined countries were not exactly up front either.
If you look at Ireland, Spain and Portugal now they have actually sorted their mess out. Even Greece. The recovery is painful but they could have avoided the crash completely. They chose not to.
So I don't see what the Euro or ECB did that was inherently wrong. It was decisions made by individual states.
You are right though, we are not disagreeing in a big way but I don't see what mechanism makes anyone other than national governments responsible. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"It was a good 3 part series showing problem after problem being solved over and over
Arguably not solved.....just delayed, fudged or simply walked over.
The migrant problem across Europe till exists, we haven't seen the final effects of Brexit on the EU and are unlikely to do so for 10 or 20 years and the Greeks are still in turmoil with implications for other, similarly misaligned economies.
I would call it more of a mid term report with an uncertain ending. I suspect the word "solved" is either an error or a bit of wishful thinking from an anti Brexit supporter.
The flood of humanity to Greece dropped by 97%, other than what's been done there's nothing left that anyone can do other than making people not want to leave to start with. Why the EU should shoulder this responsibility is beyond me. If anything it's a worldwide issue and blaming just the EU is frankly pathetic.
Greece brought everything upon themselves and nearly took everyone down with them but that Greek disaster was overted, bankruptcy avoided, but maybe they should of just fucked off and melted into insignificance quietly in a corner but they were given tough medicine which will take time to run it's course.
Brexit is our shit of a mess and we own it, we wanted it and we're going to get it. He
While Greece is and was certainly responsible for the biggest part of their misery I do not agree that they brought everything upon themselves. Greece isn't and wasn't responsible for the wreckless lending, it isn't and wasn't responsible for the great recession and it isn't and wasn't responsible for a single currency called Euro that took away a government's main adjustment mechanisms to deal with a financial crisis without providing alternative institution.
Any but I agree with you that Brexit is fully made in UK.
Well they were because they wanted it and the stability and cheaper borrowing that it brought.
They chose to to borrow, mis-spend the money and not follow the stability rules.
What was forced upon them considering that they were defaulting on loans?
It's not that simple black and white and you know it yourself. The Euro is an unfinished and ill thought project yet it was brought along with the promise of prosperity and stability. So you can't really blame Greece for joining the euro currency to get some of that cake. Unfortunately the cake isn't baked through. As soon as some member states have financial difficulties while others are flourishing you've a substantial problem.
I understand what you're saying.
The euro is not what it should be. However, every country involved were complicit in fudging numbers to get in. The understanding was always that although budgetry management was not as converged as it should be everyone would actually try to get it right. They didn't though. They cheated and behaved in the same way as they always did. Of they had done what they were supposed to they wouldn't be here.
Perhaps the ECB should have been tougher much earlier, but the less disciplined countries were not exactly up front either.
If you look at Ireland, Spain and Portugal now they have actually sorted their mess out. Even Greece. The recovery is painful but they could have avoided the crash completely. They chose not to.
So I don't see what the Euro or ECB did that was inherently wrong. It was decisions made by individual states.
You are right though, we are not disagreeing in a big way but I don't see what mechanism makes anyone other than national governments responsible."
.
Unless you use modified GNI then Ireland is the 5th most indebted country in Europe after Greece Portugal Italy and Belgium.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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" It was decisions made by individual states.
You are right though, we are not disagreeing in a big way but I don't see what mechanism makes anyone other than national governments responsible."
But if you don't like the EU then it's much easier on the brain just to blame them now isn't it |
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