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Controlling the internet
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By *oo hot OP Couple
over a year ago
North West |
It seems that instead of getting better, the amount of trolling and on line abuse and death threats is getting worse and not better.
So how do we fix it?
The U.K. could do something once the Brexit paralysis passes.
My idea would be that all social media / websites / forums where people can make posts, the host must display the IP address of the person making the post. I realise that there are devices and VPN software that can hide IP addresses and so the sites just need to make sure that anyone who wants to submit any online content it must be through a regular IP address. Yes, it may be seen as a loss of privacy, but if people do truly feel strong enough to make a post online, then they should do it knowing that they could ultimately be held accountable for the content that they have posted.
Today I have seen the most sickening of posts of Facebook inciting extreme violence against MP’s. I reported one post that basically suggested that a particular MP should never again be able to feel safe walking down the street. Facebook said that they realise that emotions are inflamed. That’s it?.. |
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Will you be happy for your IP address to be displayed on this site? I agree that hate posts and trolling are getting out of control on the wider web, but I don't see any simple solution. I'm not sure how easy it is to filter out access via vpn's, as the whole point of them is to invisibly disguise the origin of the connection (happy to defer on this though to anybody that understands more about vps's than i do).
Possibly the best approach would be to require the big social media sites (facebook, twitter etc) to be much more stringent in their monitoring, and more responsive to complaints. Going to be lots of cries of censorship though... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Why don't you just quit looking at shit on Facebook.
Problem solved
And then the rest of us adults can carry on reading stuff without the necessity for censorship. |
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While your intentions are good this is not a good idea.
For one thing every site you go on already has a record of your ip address (unless theyre very closely following gdpr and most sites are not yet). Every site that you have a registered account on or that allows you to make submissions certainly has your ip and can match your ip to your submissions. Displaying it publically is just a security risk.
Secondly, while some people abuse the anonymity online there are a great many people that use it for good. And that cant always be something widely shared. There are people in other countries that could be killed for their opinions. Even in the UK there are LGBT folks who may want to participate on a forum. Or what if you wanted to keep your swinging private but your ip address was available and then someone matched it to your ip on your facebook or linkedin account?
First rule of the internet: dont feed the trolls. There was a time on the internet when everyone knew this. They feed on attention and reaction. Take that away and it stops. |
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"It seems that instead of getting better, the amount of trolling and on line abuse and death threats is getting worse and not better.
So how do we fix it?
The U.K. could do something once the Brexit paralysis passes.
My idea would be that all social media / websites / forums where people can make posts, the host must display the IP address of the person making the post. I realise that there are devices and VPN software that can hide IP addresses and so the sites just need to make sure that anyone who wants to submit any online content it must be through a regular IP address. Yes, it may be seen as a loss of privacy, but if people do truly feel strong enough to make a post online, then they should do it knowing that they could ultimately be held accountable for the content that they have posted.
Today I have seen the most sickening of posts of Facebook inciting extreme violence against MP’s. I reported one post that basically suggested that a particular MP should never again be able to feel safe walking down the street. Facebook said that they realise that emotions are inflamed. That’s it?.."
On a practical level - policing the internet in the manner you suggest is very very difficult on a technical level.
IP addresses (at least in the IPv4 space) are not unlimited - so ISPs will need to be made to track your online activity (not a popular prospect)
And all social media? even my tiny little phpbb board which I host on my personal webspace to discuss knitting and ethnic cleansing? who's going to track all those down?
Not to mention that all this risks the same pitfalls as attempts to limit online piracy - by making services awkward to use for legitimate users - while doing very little
to discourage the criminals. Also there's jurisdictional issues - if my UK provider shuts down my Knitting for Nazis board - whats to stop me hosting it in another country?
On a more philosophical note
Vinton Cerf - called by some as the father of the internet, is often quoted as saying...
"The internet is like a mirror of society, if we do not like what we see reflected, it does no good to fix the mirror"
I may be paraphrasing a little there - but I'm sure you get the gist.  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"It seems that instead of getting better, the amount of trolling and on line abuse and death threats is getting worse and not better.
So how do we fix it?
The U.K. could do something once the Brexit paralysis passes.
My idea would be that all social media / websites / forums where people can make posts, the host must display the IP address of the person making the post. I realise that there are devices and VPN software that can hide IP addresses and so the sites just need to make sure that anyone who wants to submit any online content it must be through a regular IP address. Yes, it may be seen as a loss of privacy, but if people do truly feel strong enough to make a post online, then they should do it knowing that they could ultimately be held accountable for the content that they have posted.
Today I have seen the most sickening of posts of Facebook inciting extreme violence against MP’s. I reported one post that basically suggested that a particular MP should never again be able to feel safe walking down the street. Facebook said that they realise that emotions are inflamed. That’s it?.."
I would have thought that most MPs are more than capable of looking after themselves and if reporting was necessary they would do it themselves .
If someone was serious about carrying out a threat they would not be posting their intentions on the internet.
Mps expect on line abuse and threats and are conditioned to ignore it.
Anyone serious about carrying out their intentions would simply go ahead and do it.
No one is compelled to read or pay any attention to Facebook so any threats posted on it can simply be ignored . |
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By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago
Barbados |
"It seems that instead of getting better, the amount of trolling and on line abuse and death threats is getting worse and not better.
So how do we fix it?
The U.K. could do something once the Brexit paralysis passes.
My idea would be that all social media / websites / forums where people can make posts, the host must display the IP address of the person making the post. I realise that there are devices and VPN software that can hide IP addresses and so the sites just need to make sure that anyone who wants to submit any online content it must be through a regular IP address. Yes, it may be seen as a loss of privacy, but if people do truly feel strong enough to make a post online, then they should do it knowing that they could ultimately be held accountable for the content that they have posted.
Today I have seen the most sickening of posts of Facebook inciting extreme violence against MP’s. I reported one post that basically suggested that a particular MP should never again be able to feel safe walking down the street. Facebook said that they realise that emotions are inflamed. That’s it?.. I would have thought that most MPs are more than capable of looking after themselves and if reporting was necessary they would do it themselves .
If someone was serious about carrying out a threat they would not be posting their intentions on the internet.
Mps expect on line abuse and threats and are conditioned to ignore it.
Anyone serious about carrying out their intentions would simply go ahead and do it.
No one is compelled to read or pay any attention to Facebook so any threats posted on it can simply be ignored ."
Two words:
Jo Cox.
But to publish IP addresses is very much not the answer and would make matters 100 times worse, for all the reasons given above.
-Matt |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"It seems that instead of getting better, the amount of trolling and on line abuse and death threats is getting worse and not better.
So how do we fix it?
The U.K. could do something once the Brexit paralysis passes.
My idea would be that all social media / websites / forums where people can make posts, the host must display the IP address of the person making the post. I realise that there are devices and VPN software that can hide IP addresses and so the sites just need to make sure that anyone who wants to submit any online content it must be through a regular IP address. Yes, it may be seen as a loss of privacy, but if people do truly feel strong enough to make a post online, then they should do it knowing that they could ultimately be held accountable for the content that they have posted.
Today I have seen the most sickening of posts of Facebook inciting extreme violence against MP’s. I reported one post that basically suggested that a particular MP should never again be able to feel safe walking down the street. Facebook said that they realise that emotions are inflamed. That’s it?.. I would have thought that most MPs are more than capable of looking after themselves and if reporting was necessary they would do it themselves .
If someone was serious about carrying out a threat they would not be posting their intentions on the internet.
Mps expect on line abuse and threats and are conditioned to ignore it.
Anyone serious about carrying out their intentions would simply go ahead and do it.
No one is compelled to read or pay any attention to Facebook so any threats posted on it can simply be ignored ."
You're quite a piece of work.
People do follow through on threats.
People commit suicide as a consequence of online abuse.
I'm sure they should either toughen up or just ignore it in your world.
Of course, absolutely nothing seems to get through to you  |
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I think publishing IP address info would largely just create privacy issues - though sites could remind every poster that they have theirs recorded.
The major social media companies are too powerful and yet doing too little to constrain their services and police them appropriately. The large sites have the greatest power to support the greatest harm. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"It seems that instead of getting better, the amount of trolling and on line abuse and death threats is getting worse and not better.
So how do we fix it?
The U.K. could do something once the Brexit paralysis passes.
My idea would be that all social media / websites / forums where people can make posts, the host must display the IP address of the person making the post. I realise that there are devices and VPN software that can hide IP addresses and so the sites just need to make sure that anyone who wants to submit any online content it must be through a regular IP address. Yes, it may be seen as a loss of privacy, but if people do truly feel strong enough to make a post online, then they should do it knowing that they could ultimately be held accountable for the content that they have posted.
Today I have seen the most sickening of posts of Facebook inciting extreme violence against MP’s. I reported one post that basically suggested that a particular MP should never again be able to feel safe walking down the street. Facebook said that they realise that emotions are inflamed. That’s it?..
On a practical level - policing the internet in the manner you suggest is very very difficult on a technical level.
IP addresses (at least in the IPv4 space) are not unlimited - so ISPs will need to be made to track your online activity (not a popular prospect)
And all social media? even my tiny little phpbb board which I host on my personal webspace to discuss knitting and ethnic cleansing? who's going to track all those down?
Not to mention that all this risks the same pitfalls as attempts to limit online piracy - by making services awkward to use for legitimate users - while doing very little
to discourage the criminals. Also there's jurisdictional issues - if my UK provider shuts down my Knitting for Nazis board - whats to stop me hosting it in another country?
On a more philosophical note
Vinton Cerf - called by some as the father of the internet, is often quoted as saying...
"The internet is like a mirror of society, if we do not like what we see reflected, it does no good to fix the mirror"
I may be paraphrasing a little there - but I'm sure you get the gist. "
.
Don't panic, Brexit or no Brexit the UK have already said they'll adopt EU resolutions 11 and 13 and that's the end of any independent media, so now we can all be in our own one big giant bubble.
No wrong facial expressions, no wrong words. |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"It seems that instead of getting better, the amount of trolling and on line abuse and death threats is getting worse and not better.
So how do we fix it?
The U.K. could do something once the Brexit paralysis passes.
My idea would be that all social media / websites / forums where people can make posts, the host must display the IP address of the person making the post. I realise that there are devices and VPN software that can hide IP addresses and so the sites just need to make sure that anyone who wants to submit any online content it must be through a regular IP address. Yes, it may be seen as a loss of privacy, but if people do truly feel strong enough to make a post online, then they should do it knowing that they could ultimately be held accountable for the content that they have posted.
Today I have seen the most sickening of posts of Facebook inciting extreme violence against MP’s. I reported one post that basically suggested that a particular MP should never again be able to feel safe walking down the street. Facebook said that they realise that emotions are inflamed. That’s it?..
On a practical level - policing the internet in the manner you suggest is very very difficult on a technical level.
IP addresses (at least in the IPv4 space) are not unlimited - so ISPs will need to be made to track your online activity (not a popular prospect)
And all social media? even my tiny little phpbb board which I host on my personal webspace to discuss knitting and ethnic cleansing? who's going to track all those down?
Not to mention that all this risks the same pitfalls as attempts to limit online piracy - by making services awkward to use for legitimate users - while doing very little
to discourage the criminals. Also there's jurisdictional issues - if my UK provider shuts down my Knitting for Nazis board - whats to stop me hosting it in another country?
On a more philosophical note
Vinton Cerf - called by some as the father of the internet, is often quoted as saying...
"The internet is like a mirror of society, if we do not like what we see reflected, it does no good to fix the mirror"
I may be paraphrasing a little there - but I'm sure you get the gist. .
Don't panic, Brexit or no Brexit the UK have already said they'll adopt EU resolutions 11 and 13 and that's the end of any independent media, so now we can all be in our own one big giant bubble.
No wrong facial expressions, no wrong words."
Neither of those Articles in the directive have anything to do with what you just said.
They are to do with internet firms having to pay royalties to companies who's content is uploaded to them.
People are expecting to get paid if someone else wants to use information or music or anything elae that they have created 
There is a discussion to be had about I'd this reduces the sharing of news, but you might want to explain how that kills independent media who currently don't get paid for their work or why you think this will change the bubble which most people choose to be inside... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"It seems that instead of getting better, the amount of trolling and on line abuse and death threats is getting worse and not better.
So how do we fix it?
The U.K. could do something once the Brexit paralysis passes.
My idea would be that all social media / websites / forums where people can make posts, the host must display the IP address of the person making the post. I realise that there are devices and VPN software that can hide IP addresses and so the sites just need to make sure that anyone who wants to submit any online content it must be through a regular IP address. Yes, it may be seen as a loss of privacy, but if people do truly feel strong enough to make a post online, then they should do it knowing that they could ultimately be held accountable for the content that they have posted.
Today I have seen the most sickening of posts of Facebook inciting extreme violence against MP’s. I reported one post that basically suggested that a particular MP should never again be able to feel safe walking down the street. Facebook said that they realise that emotions are inflamed. That’s it?.. I would have thought that most MPs are more than capable of looking after themselves and if reporting was necessary they would do it themselves .
If someone was serious about carrying out a threat they would not be posting their intentions on the internet.
Mps expect on line abuse and threats and are conditioned to ignore it.
Anyone serious about carrying out their intentions would simply go ahead and do it.
No one is compelled to read or pay any attention to Facebook so any threats posted on it can simply be ignored .
You're quite a piece of work.
People do follow through on threats.
People commit suicide as a consequence of online abuse.
I'm sure they should either toughen up or just ignore it in your world.
Of course, absolutely nothing seems to get through to you "
As far as I am aware we still live in a free society and we are entitled to express an opinion.
No one is compelled to accept your interpretation of events which is what you appear to be implying .
Threats do not hurt , physical action does . |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"It seems that instead of getting better, the amount of trolling and on line abuse and death threats is getting worse and not better.
So how do we fix it?
The U.K. could do something once the Brexit paralysis passes.
My idea would be that all social media / websites / forums where people can make posts, the host must display the IP address of the person making the post. I realise that there are devices and VPN software that can hide IP addresses and so the sites just need to make sure that anyone who wants to submit any online content it must be through a regular IP address. Yes, it may be seen as a loss of privacy, but if people do truly feel strong enough to make a post online, then they should do it knowing that they could ultimately be held accountable for the content that they have posted.
Today I have seen the most sickening of posts of Facebook inciting extreme violence against MP’s. I reported one post that basically suggested that a particular MP should never again be able to feel safe walking down the street. Facebook said that they realise that emotions are inflamed. That’s it?.. I would have thought that most MPs are more than capable of looking after themselves and if reporting was necessary they would do it themselves .
If someone was serious about carrying out a threat they would not be posting their intentions on the internet.
Mps expect on line abuse and threats and are conditioned to ignore it.
Anyone serious about carrying out their intentions would simply go ahead and do it.
No one is compelled to read or pay any attention to Facebook so any threats posted on it can simply be ignored .
You're quite a piece of work.
People do follow through on threats.
People commit suicide as a consequence of online abuse.
I'm sure they should either toughen up or just ignore it in your world.
Of course, absolutely nothing seems to get through to you As far as I am aware we still live in a free society and we are entitled to express an opinion.
No one is compelled to accept your interpretation of events which is what you appear to be implying .
Threats do not hurt , physical action does ."
So, just for clarity your interpretation of events is that:
Threats of sexual assault and murder of individuals and their families is "expressing an opinion"?
Such threats are only to be taken seriously once they have been acted upon? So, only after someone has been attacked or an attempt has been made?
Nobody had suffered psychological damage, self-harmed or committed suicide as a consequence of online abuse? |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"Don't let trolls get on ur head problem solved n "
It's not quite that simple.
Laws aren't in place the strong and resilient as perhaps you are. They are to protect the vulnerable.
See my post above. |
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By *oo hot OP Couple
over a year ago
North West |
Been away for a couple of days - but to catch up.
Sites like Fabswingers (oddly enough) are really quite heavily moderated and so aside from the fake profile / fake person challenge - there is not really an issue.
I do take exception however to the more open media sources like Twitter and Facebook where people get away with some really questionable submissions. For example...
There is a Facebook page that I subscribe to which was allegedly set up as a local interest Group and it soon attracted thousands of followers who were engaged posting lost and found, whats on, historic pictures and really everything of interest about the local area. Slowly, but surely the post content started to change to a point that now, 9 out of 10 posts are direct and hostile attacks on Labour generally, and our local MP specifically. I picked up on one post which started along the lines of "XX is a f****ng traitor who has claimed a million pounds in expenses and who has just voted to revoke A50. In times gone by, we hung traitors - what do you think now?"
The vitriol that followed was quite simply ghastly and I made the mistake of posting and reminding people that Jo Cox was murdered by a guy so twisted that he chose to be a hero to all those who felt Jo Cox was a traitor and there are plenty more like him out there.
I then got hounded on the thread and by PM suggesting that traitors and those who help and sympathise with them should all have the same fate.
I reported the thread and again was told by Facebook that it did not breach their community standards and they recognise that these are emotional times in British politics.
I just do not believe that such aggressive posts would be made if the people making the posts knew they would be held accountable and also that Facebook would at least try to moderate their own media channels. |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"Been away for a couple of days - but to catch up.
Sites like Fabswingers (oddly enough) are really quite heavily moderated and so aside from the fake profile / fake person challenge - there is not really an issue.
I do take exception however to the more open media sources like Twitter and Facebook where people get away with some really questionable submissions. For example...
There is a Facebook page that I subscribe to which was allegedly set up as a local interest Group and it soon attracted thousands of followers who were engaged posting lost and found, whats on, historic pictures and really everything of interest about the local area. Slowly, but surely the post content started to change to a point that now, 9 out of 10 posts are direct and hostile attacks on Labour generally, and our local MP specifically. I picked up on one post which started along the lines of "XX is a f****ng traitor who has claimed a million pounds in expenses and who has just voted to revoke A50. In times gone by, we hung traitors - what do you think now?"
The vitriol that followed was quite simply ghastly and I made the mistake of posting and reminding people that Jo Cox was murdered by a guy so twisted that he chose to be a hero to all those who felt Jo Cox was a traitor and there are plenty more like him out there.
I then got hounded on the thread and by PM suggesting that traitors and those who help and sympathise with them should all have the same fate.
I reported the thread and again was told by Facebook that it did not breach their community standards and they recognise that these are emotional times in British politics.
I just do not believe that such aggressive posts would be made if the people making the posts knew they would be held accountable and also that Facebook would at least try to moderate their own media channels."
I agree with the last point.
Therein lies the problem.
They have enabled it but need to find an electronic method to police it because their profits would vanish if they had to pay real people to do this.
They would take a position if they were legally required to do so. They are not so they will not. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"It seems that instead of getting better, the amount of trolling and on line abuse and death threats is getting worse and not better.
So how do we fix it?
The U.K. could do something once the Brexit paralysis passes.
My idea would be that all social media / websites / forums where people can make posts, the host must display the IP address of the person making the post. I realise that there are devices and VPN software that can hide IP addresses and so the sites just need to make sure that anyone who wants to submit any online content it must be through a regular IP address. Yes, it may be seen as a loss of privacy, but if people do truly feel strong enough to make a post online, then they should do it knowing that they could ultimately be held accountable for the content that they have posted.
Today I have seen the most sickening of posts of Facebook inciting extreme violence against MP’s. I reported one post that basically suggested that a particular MP should never again be able to feel safe walking down the street. Facebook said that they realise that emotions are inflamed. That’s it?..
On a practical level - policing the internet in the manner you suggest is very very difficult on a technical level.
IP addresses (at least in the IPv4 space) are not unlimited - so ISPs will need to be made to track your online activity (not a popular prospect)
And all social media? even my tiny little phpbb board which I host on my personal webspace to discuss knitting and ethnic cleansing? who's going to track all those down?
Not to mention that all this risks the same pitfalls as attempts to limit online piracy - by making services awkward to use for legitimate users - while doing very little
to discourage the criminals. Also there's jurisdictional issues - if my UK provider shuts down my Knitting for Nazis board - whats to stop me hosting it in another country?
On a more philosophical note
Vinton Cerf - called by some as the father of the internet, is often quoted as saying...
"The internet is like a mirror of society, if we do not like what we see reflected, it does no good to fix the mirror"
I may be paraphrasing a little there - but I'm sure you get the gist. .
Don't panic, Brexit or no Brexit the UK have already said they'll adopt EU resolutions 11 and 13 and that's the end of any independent media, so now we can all be in our own one big giant bubble.
No wrong facial expressions, no wrong words.
Neither of those Articles in the directive have anything to do with what you just said.
They are to do with internet firms having to pay royalties to companies who's content is uploaded to them.
People are expecting to get paid if someone else wants to use information or music or anything elae that they have created
There is a discussion to be had about I'd this reduces the sharing of news, but you might want to explain how that kills independent media who currently don't get paid for their work or why you think this will change the bubble which most people choose to be inside..."
.
As far as I've read I think it does, for instance you will no longer to be able to post a link to any other site on here, or you will but then fab will have to pay said site, assuming fab won't pay your link will be taken away via a ban on links.
Independent media relies alot on links to other sites for reporting context and then short clips that used to fall under the old fair use policy. |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"It seems that instead of getting better, the amount of trolling and on line abuse and death threats is getting worse and not better.
So how do we fix it?
The U.K. could do something once the Brexit paralysis passes.
My idea would be that all social media / websites / forums where people can make posts, the host must display the IP address of the person making the post. I realise that there are devices and VPN software that can hide IP addresses and so the sites just need to make sure that anyone who wants to submit any online content it must be through a regular IP address. Yes, it may be seen as a loss of privacy, but if people do truly feel strong enough to make a post online, then they should do it knowing that they could ultimately be held accountable for the content that they have posted.
Today I have seen the most sickening of posts of Facebook inciting extreme violence against MP’s. I reported one post that basically suggested that a particular MP should never again be able to feel safe walking down the street. Facebook said that they realise that emotions are inflamed. That’s it?..
On a practical level - policing the internet in the manner you suggest is very very difficult on a technical level.
IP addresses (at least in the IPv4 space) are not unlimited - so ISPs will need to be made to track your online activity (not a popular prospect)
And all social media? even my tiny little phpbb board which I host on my personal webspace to discuss knitting and ethnic cleansing? who's going to track all those down?
Not to mention that all this risks the same pitfalls as attempts to limit online piracy - by making services awkward to use for legitimate users - while doing very little
to discourage the criminals. Also there's jurisdictional issues - if my UK provider shuts down my Knitting for Nazis board - whats to stop me hosting it in another country?
On a more philosophical note
Vinton Cerf - called by some as the father of the internet, is often quoted as saying...
"The internet is like a mirror of society, if we do not like what we see reflected, it does no good to fix the mirror"
I may be paraphrasing a little there - but I'm sure you get the gist. .
Don't panic, Brexit or no Brexit the UK have already said they'll adopt EU resolutions 11 and 13 and that's the end of any independent media, so now we can all be in our own one big giant bubble.
No wrong facial expressions, no wrong words.
Neither of those Articles in the directive have anything to do with what you just said.
They are to do with internet firms having to pay royalties to companies who's content is uploaded to them.
People are expecting to get paid if someone else wants to use information or music or anything elae that they have created
There is a discussion to be had about I'd this reduces the sharing of news, but you might want to explain how that kills independent media who currently don't get paid for their work or why you think this will change the bubble which most people choose to be inside....
As far as I've read I think it does, for instance you will no longer to be able to post a link to any other site on here, or you will but then fab will have to pay said site, assuming fab won't pay your link will be taken away via a ban on links.
Independent media relies alot on links to other sites for reporting context and then short clips that used to fall under the old fair use policy."
I don't think that's true.
It doesn't effect links because that takes you to the content provider.
It's inserting clips of content that is legislated against.
Paying royalties for music is also required.
I assume that any provider can wave this ride should they wish to (as now).
That seems OK to me. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"It seems that instead of getting better, the amount of trolling and on line abuse and death threats is getting worse and not better.
So how do we fix it?
The U.K. could do something once the Brexit paralysis passes.
My idea would be that all social media / websites / forums where people can make posts, the host must display the IP address of the person making the post. I realise that there are devices and VPN software that can hide IP addresses and so the sites just need to make sure that anyone who wants to submit any online content it must be through a regular IP address. Yes, it may be seen as a loss of privacy, but if people do truly feel strong enough to make a post online, then they should do it knowing that they could ultimately be held accountable for the content that they have posted.
Today I have seen the most sickening of posts of Facebook inciting extreme violence against MP’s. I reported one post that basically suggested that a particular MP should never again be able to feel safe walking down the street. Facebook said that they realise that emotions are inflamed. That’s it?..
On a practical level - policing the internet in the manner you suggest is very very difficult on a technical level.
IP addresses (at least in the IPv4 space) are not unlimited - so ISPs will need to be made to track your online activity (not a popular prospect)
And all social media? even my tiny little phpbb board which I host on my personal webspace to discuss knitting and ethnic cleansing? who's going to track all those down?
Not to mention that all this risks the same pitfalls as attempts to limit online piracy - by making services awkward to use for legitimate users - while doing very little
to discourage the criminals. Also there's jurisdictional issues - if my UK provider shuts down my Knitting for Nazis board - whats to stop me hosting it in another country?
On a more philosophical note
Vinton Cerf - called by some as the father of the internet, is often quoted as saying...
"The internet is like a mirror of society, if we do not like what we see reflected, it does no good to fix the mirror"
I may be paraphrasing a little there - but I'm sure you get the gist. .
Don't panic, Brexit or no Brexit the UK have already said they'll adopt EU resolutions 11 and 13 and that's the end of any independent media, so now we can all be in our own one big giant bubble.
No wrong facial expressions, no wrong words.
Neither of those Articles in the directive have anything to do with what you just said.
They are to do with internet firms having to pay royalties to companies who's content is uploaded to them.
People are expecting to get paid if someone else wants to use information or music or anything elae that they have created
There is a discussion to be had about I'd this reduces the sharing of news, but you might want to explain how that kills independent media who currently don't get paid for their work or why you think this will change the bubble which most people choose to be inside....
As far as I've read I think it does, for instance you will no longer to be able to post a link to any other site on here, or you will but then fab will have to pay said site, assuming fab won't pay your link will be taken away via a ban on links.
Independent media relies alot on links to other sites for reporting context and then short clips that used to fall under the old fair use policy.
I don't think that's true.
It doesn't effect links because that takes you to the content provider.
It's inserting clips of content that is legislated against.
Paying royalties for music is also required.
I assume that any provider can wave this ride should they wish to (as now).
That seems OK to me."
.
Fair use always used to take into account small clips against entire sections of content, it was never legal under that system to use somebody else's material in its entirety anyhow.
And I'm pretty sure your wrong links won't be allowed on here or they will but fab will have to pay the licence although like I suggested before fab won't they'll just bar you from posting links. |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"It seems that instead of getting better, the amount of trolling and on line abuse and death threats is getting worse and not better.
So how do we fix it?
The U.K. could do something once the Brexit paralysis passes.
My idea would be that all social media / websites / forums where people can make posts, the host must display the IP address of the person making the post. I realise that there are devices and VPN software that can hide IP addresses and so the sites just need to make sure that anyone who wants to submit any online content it must be through a regular IP address. Yes, it may be seen as a loss of privacy, but if people do truly feel strong enough to make a post online, then they should do it knowing that they could ultimately be held accountable for the content that they have posted.
Today I have seen the most sickening of posts of Facebook inciting extreme violence against MP’s. I reported one post that basically suggested that a particular MP should never again be able to feel safe walking down the street. Facebook said that they realise that emotions are inflamed. That’s it?..
On a practical level - policing the internet in the manner you suggest is very very difficult on a technical level.
IP addresses (at least in the IPv4 space) are not unlimited - so ISPs will need to be made to track your online activity (not a popular prospect)
And all social media? even my tiny little phpbb board which I host on my personal webspace to discuss knitting and ethnic cleansing? who's going to track all those down?
Not to mention that all this risks the same pitfalls as attempts to limit online piracy - by making services awkward to use for legitimate users - while doing very little
to discourage the criminals. Also there's jurisdictional issues - if my UK provider shuts down my Knitting for Nazis board - whats to stop me hosting it in another country?
On a more philosophical note
Vinton Cerf - called by some as the father of the internet, is often quoted as saying...
"The internet is like a mirror of society, if we do not like what we see reflected, it does no good to fix the mirror"
I may be paraphrasing a little there - but I'm sure you get the gist. .
Don't panic, Brexit or no Brexit the UK have already said they'll adopt EU resolutions 11 and 13 and that's the end of any independent media, so now we can all be in our own one big giant bubble.
No wrong facial expressions, no wrong words.
Neither of those Articles in the directive have anything to do with what you just said.
They are to do with internet firms having to pay royalties to companies who's content is uploaded to them.
People are expecting to get paid if someone else wants to use information or music or anything elae that they have created
There is a discussion to be had about I'd this reduces the sharing of news, but you might want to explain how that kills independent media who currently don't get paid for their work or why you think this will change the bubble which most people choose to be inside....
As far as I've read I think it does, for instance you will no longer to be able to post a link to any other site on here, or you will but then fab will have to pay said site, assuming fab won't pay your link will be taken away via a ban on links.
Independent media relies alot on links to other sites for reporting context and then short clips that used to fall under the old fair use policy.
I don't think that's true.
It doesn't effect links because that takes you to the content provider.
It's inserting clips of content that is legislated against.
Paying royalties for music is also required.
I assume that any provider can wave this ride should they wish to (as now).
That seems OK to me..
Fair use always used to take into account small clips against entire sections of content, it was never legal under that system to use somebody else's material in its entirety anyhow.
And I'm pretty sure your wrong links won't be allowed on here or they will but fab will have to pay the licence although like I suggested before fab won't they'll just bar you from posting links."
Not from what I've read. I suspect we've both seen different interpretations. I haven't looked at the actual text which I usually do if I'm actually interested.
Really not in the mood to.
I might get back to it. Happy for you to though and get your take on the primary source  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"It seems that instead of getting better, the amount of trolling and on line abuse and death threats is getting worse and not better.
So how do we fix it?
The U.K. could do something once the Brexit paralysis passes.
My idea would be that all social media / websites / forums where people can make posts, the host must display the IP address of the person making the post. I realise that there are devices and VPN software that can hide IP addresses and so the sites just need to make sure that anyone who wants to submit any online content it must be through a regular IP address. Yes, it may be seen as a loss of privacy, but if people do truly feel strong enough to make a post online, then they should do it knowing that they could ultimately be held accountable for the content that they have posted.
Today I have seen the most sickening of posts of Facebook inciting extreme violence against MP’s. I reported one post that basically suggested that a particular MP should never again be able to feel safe walking down the street. Facebook said that they realise that emotions are inflamed. That’s it?..
On a practical level - policing the internet in the manner you suggest is very very difficult on a technical level.
IP addresses (at least in the IPv4 space) are not unlimited - so ISPs will need to be made to track your online activity (not a popular prospect)
And all social media? even my tiny little phpbb board which I host on my personal webspace to discuss knitting and ethnic cleansing? who's going to track all those down?
Not to mention that all this risks the same pitfalls as attempts to limit online piracy - by making services awkward to use for legitimate users - while doing very little
to discourage the criminals. Also there's jurisdictional issues - if my UK provider shuts down my Knitting for Nazis board - whats to stop me hosting it in another country?
On a more philosophical note
Vinton Cerf - called by some as the father of the internet, is often quoted as saying...
"The internet is like a mirror of society, if we do not like what we see reflected, it does no good to fix the mirror"
I may be paraphrasing a little there - but I'm sure you get the gist. .
Don't panic, Brexit or no Brexit the UK have already said they'll adopt EU resolutions 11 and 13 and that's the end of any independent media, so now we can all be in our own one big giant bubble.
No wrong facial expressions, no wrong words.
Neither of those Articles in the directive have anything to do with what you just said.
They are to do with internet firms having to pay royalties to companies who's content is uploaded to them.
People are expecting to get paid if someone else wants to use information or music or anything elae that they have created
There is a discussion to be had about I'd this reduces the sharing of news, but you might want to explain how that kills independent media who currently don't get paid for their work or why you think this will change the bubble which most people choose to be inside....
As far as I've read I think it does, for instance you will no longer to be able to post a link to any other site on here, or you will but then fab will have to pay said site, assuming fab won't pay your link will be taken away via a ban on links.
Independent media relies alot on links to other sites for reporting context and then short clips that used to fall under the old fair use policy.
I don't think that's true.
It doesn't effect links because that takes you to the content provider.
It's inserting clips of content that is legislated against.
Paying royalties for music is also required.
I assume that any provider can wave this ride should they wish to (as now).
That seems OK to me..
Fair use always used to take into account small clips against entire sections of content, it was never legal under that system to use somebody else's material in its entirety anyhow.
And I'm pretty sure your wrong links won't be allowed on here or they will but fab will have to pay the licence although like I suggested before fab won't they'll just bar you from posting links.
Not from what I've read. I suspect we've both seen different interpretations. I haven't looked at the actual text which I usually do if I'm actually interested.
Really not in the mood to.
I might get back to it. Happy for you to though and get your take on the primary source "
.
Originally it was any link, I think this ruling that's passed is links which include the first few words of the article but when you make the owners of the site responsible for posted content which I think is 10k euros plus 3 to 6 months in prison penalty then these things tend to obviously be over policed (would the owners of fab want to take that risk) you'll find they just ban all links.
We'll have to wait and see what the court ruling is on the first few words or sentence/paragraph but while that's waiting I would imagine people will take the cautious route.
Memes as well will absolutely be gone unless you can obtain the owners permission.
For me it's just one more step down the road to totalitarianism, you'll be free providing you don't disagree or say anything the dictatorships doesn't want said.
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