FabSwingers.com > Forums > Politics > Boris said brexit will be a paradise.

Boris said brexit will be a paradise.

By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

Does he really believe it himself? It is hard to know but I think deep down he have his daubts about it that it probably wont be that.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Does he really believe it himself? It is hard to know but I think deep down he have his daubts about it that it probably wont be that."

Of course he does. Brexit will be paradise for him, his friends and family are set to make millions.

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By *rench letterCouple over a year ago

Chorley,

"Does he really believe it himself? It is hard to know but I think deep down he have his daubts about it that it probably wont be that.

Of course he does. Brexit will be paradise for him, his friends and family are set to make millions.

It's us normal folk that are going to suffer from it.

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By *oxychick35Couple over a year ago

thornaby

"Does he really believe it himself? It is hard to know but I think deep down he have his daubts about it that it probably wont be that."
we are not leaving according to you so why are you bothered ?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Does he really believe it himself? It is hard to know but I think deep down he have his daubts about it that it probably wont be that.

Of course he does. Brexit will be paradise for him, his friends and family are set to make millions.

It's us normal folk that are going to suffer from it. "

Well of course. But he doesn't have half a fuck about normal people.

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By *an For YouMan over a year ago

belfast/holywood

Normal people voted for Brexit and for Boris. Hadn’t you heard ?

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By *heBirminghamWeekendMan over a year ago

here

"Does he really believe it himself? It is hard to know but I think deep down he have his daubts about it that it probably wont be that.

Of course he does. Brexit will be paradise for him, his friends and family are set to make millions. "

Got to admire your unwavering commitment to this belief - like a dog with a bone

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Does he really believe it himself? It is hard to know but I think deep down he have his daubts about it that it probably wont be that.

Of course he does. Brexit will be paradise for him, his friends and family are set to make millions.

Got to admire your unwavering commitment to this belief - like a dog with a bone

Ah hello.

Nothing to do with belief. This is

and example of the primary purpose for brexit.

I mean what the fuck else is it about if it's not the ultra rich fucking the rest of us over. Be real.

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"Does he really believe it himself? It is hard to know but I think deep down he have his daubts about it that it probably wont be that.

Of course he does. Brexit will be paradise for him, his friends and family are set to make millions.

It's us normal folk that are going to suffer from it. "
That is right it will be that for them but not for the people they will be worse of with it.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Paradise yes.

The Square mile will continue to be the world's largest tax haven for terrorists, drug dealers, human traffickers and corrupt politicians.

It will still be possible to keep your money in offshore accounts and anonymous trusts and not pay tax.

UK will no longer be beholden to fair labour practices which will allow corporations to continue to underpay and over work employees.

The UK will not have to adhere to EU environmental laws.

Paradise.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

What I never understood about all this is why leavers were so keen to portray themselves as victims of EU oppression because as far as I can see the only real benefit to leaving the EU is that those with serious amounts of money will be able to carry on hiding where it comes from and make more out of fleecing the saps who voted for Brexit

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By *anejohnkent6263Couple over a year ago

canterbury

More guessing I guess

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By *andm288Couple over a year ago

oxford

At the end of the day nobody knows what will happen as nobody can predict the future but let’s put the great back into Britain ????

Personally I don’t think it will be a bad thing

And before everyone starts quoting that the economist state this or that or the other

Remember they were wrong before the referendum when house prices would crash 30 -%

Guess what they didn’t

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By *ammskiMan over a year ago

lytham st.annes

"At the end of the day nobody knows what will happen as nobody can predict the future but let’s put the great back into Britain ????

Personally I don’t think it will be a bad thing

And before everyone starts quoting that the economist state this or that or the other

Remember they were wrong before the referendum when house prices would crash 30 -%

Guess what they didn’t "

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"At the end of the day nobody knows what will happen as nobody can predict the future but let’s put the great back into Britain ????

Personally I don’t think it will be a bad thing

And before everyone starts quoting that the economist state this or that or the other

Remember they were wrong before the referendum when house prices would crash 30 -%

Guess what they didn’t "

Guess what....its called kicking the can down the road....nobody wants to fuck the economy by letting the housing market crash, as its the only way of making money available these days. Ever wondered why theres a housing shortage? Its called supply and demand. Artificially low interest rates make economies appear to be booming. No wonder Boris plans to borrow more money than any other peacetime government in living history! Not real growth though is it!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"At the end of the day nobody knows what will happen as nobody can predict the future but let’s put the great back into Britain ????

Personally I don’t think it will be a bad thing

And before everyone starts quoting that the economist state this or that or the other

Remember they were wrong before the referendum when house prices would crash 30 -%

Guess what they didn’t "

You picked one specific example of a claim that didn't happen. You could have picked the claim that it would cost the UK economy billions. And it absolutely has come true. As you know the cost of Brexit to the UK economy has now exceeded all the payments the UK has made the the EU.

Just because one single prediction didn't come true. Doesn't magically make the clusterfuck that is Brexit, into a good thing, or even an unknown thing.

It would correct to say. It's a fucking disaster. But we don't know the exact extent of the disaster yet.

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By *an For YouMan over a year ago

belfast/holywood

I see no signs of a “disaster” ?

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By *mmabluTV/TS over a year ago

upton wirral

"I see no signs of a “disaster” ?"

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I see no signs of a “disaster” ?"

What would you describe the epic waste of money that brexit has caused so far?

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"I see no signs of a “disaster” ?

What would you describe the epic waste of money that brexit has caused so far?"
Yes so far it have costs 200 billion pounds and that is just within 3 years.

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By *an For YouMan over a year ago

belfast/holywood

Don’t believe everything u read

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I see no signs of a “disaster” ?

What would you describe the epic waste of money that brexit has caused so far?

Yes so far it have costs 200 billion pounds and that is just within 3 years."

An absolute bargain mate init

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By *ony 2016Man over a year ago

Huddersfield /derby cinemas

"Don’t believe everything u read "
.

for example ,,,,,£350million written on the side of a bus

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By *andm288Couple over a year ago

oxford

In your opinion yes let’s have another conversation in 2-3 years time

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I see no signs of a “disaster” ?

What would you describe the epic waste of money that brexit has caused so far?Yes so far it have costs 200 billion pounds and that is just within 3 years."

Figures from the House of Commons put the UK's total projected contribution to the EU budget from 1973 to 2020 at £215 billion after adjusting for inflation.

The £200 billion estimated lost in economic growth end of by the of this this year almost eclipses the total amount the UK has paid toward the European Union budget over the past 47 years.!!

Isn’t that just fucking awesome!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I see no signs of a “disaster” ?

What would you describe the epic waste of money that brexit has caused so far?Yes so far it have costs 200 billion pounds and that is just within 3 years.

Figures from the House of Commons put the UK's total projected contribution to the EU budget from 1973 to 2020 at £215 billion after adjusting for inflation.

The £200 billion estimated lost in economic growth end of by the of this this year almost eclipses the total amount the UK has paid toward the European Union budget over the past 47 years.!!

Isn’t that just fucking awesome!

And Boris is planning to borrow more money than any peacetime government has ever done to pay for this paradise....so what has happened to that EU money? Oh yes I was forgetting that we still have to pay our contributions so that MEPs like Farage will continue receiving a pension from the European Parliament....now thats what I call winning....a broker who spent his life gambling with other peoples money fucks all our kids futures up and still gets his unjust rewards....i hope he gets a Darwin award!

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By *an For YouMan over a year ago

belfast/holywood

Who estimated it ?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Who estimated it ?"

I think you've run out of straws to clutch at.

You can choose to answer the question about how you would describe this epic waste of money. Or not to. But I think you've run out of "what abouts".

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If parliament hadn't played games for nearly 3 years it would not have cost half as much that is almost certain, and before someone says well it was this mps fault and that mps fault, or this party or that party to blame I reckon they were all as bad as one another!

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By *abioMan over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

"Who estimated it ?"

well if its in the "house of commons" library then the sources would either have to be the government themselves (in this case likely the treasury)... or the relevant house of commons select committees (which are all party) that would have done various reports of the matters.....

so.... are we now doubting the sources themselves?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Where does the 200 billion figure come from? Is this just estimated because I have searched and cannot find this information, just predictions by different people but no actual figures to bk this up? Although I guess its impossible to cost it properly as it is still ongoing so no one really knows for sure, just guessing relating to there own personal bias no doubt.

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By *an For YouMan over a year ago

belfast/holywood

Who estimated it ?

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By *an For YouMan over a year ago

belfast/holywood

House of Commons figures ... yep I get that for overall contributions . And the other estimate ?... the OBR?

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By *an For YouMan over a year ago

belfast/holywood

Simple question. Who estimated it?. Is it an accepted figure from multiple sources ?.... simple question

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

multiple sources have a different figure based on the reduced GDP since 2016.

Bloomberg economics estimated £130 billion up to 2019 and another and 70 billion by the end of 2020 making a total of £200 billion .

Others put it at £40 billion a year since 2016.Based on the fall of GDP.

You can google the economists who have made these estimates.

They are of course estimates.

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"Where does the 200 billion figure come from? Is this just estimated because I have searched and cannot find this information, just predictions by different people but no actual figures to bk this up? Although I guess its impossible to cost it properly as it is still ongoing so no one really knows for sure, just guessing relating to there own personal bias no doubt."
The calculation was made by dan hanson on the bloombergs site of the cost of brexit I also did a forum post about.

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"Don’t believe everything u read .

for example ,,,,,£350million written on the side of a bus "
Yes which all brexiters believed in.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

They government puts the cost of preparation for Brexit up to £2 billion

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"I see no signs of a “disaster” ?

What would you describe the epic waste of money that brexit has caused so far?Yes so far it have costs 200 billion pounds and that is just within 3 years.

Figures from the House of Commons put the UK's total projected contribution to the EU budget from 1973 to 2020 at £215 billion after adjusting for inflation.

The £200 billion estimated lost in economic growth end of by the of this this year almost eclipses the total amount the UK has paid toward the European Union budget over the past 47 years.!!

Isn’t that just fucking awesome!

"
That is right and the last 70 billion of the 200 is what is predicted of the total cost at the end of this year of brexit

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By *an For YouMan over a year ago

belfast/holywood

"Where does the 200 billion figure come from? Is this just estimated because I have searched and cannot find this information, just predictions by different people but no actual figures to bk this up? Although I guess its impossible to cost it properly as it is still ongoing so no one really knows for sure, just guessing relating to there own personal bias no doubt.The calculation was made by dan hanson on the bloombergs site of the cost of brexit I also did a forum post about."

Oh... so dan Hanson . From Bloomberg . Just his estimate . I see . Who is dan Hanson ?

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"Where does the 200 billion figure come from? Is this just estimated because I have searched and cannot find this information, just predictions by different people but no actual figures to bk this up? Although I guess its impossible to cost it properly as it is still ongoing so no one really knows for sure, just guessing relating to there own personal bias no doubt.The calculation was made by dan hanson on the bloombergs site of the cost of brexit I also did a forum post about.

Oh... so dan Hanson . From Bloomberg . Just his estimate . I see . Who is dan Hanson ?"
He is an economist.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I see no signs of a “disaster” ?

What would you describe the epic waste of money that brexit has caused so far?Yes so far it have costs 200 billion pounds and that is just within 3 years.

Figures from the House of Commons put the UK's total projected contribution to the EU budget from 1973 to 2020 at £215 billion after adjusting for inflation.

The £200 billion estimated lost in economic growth end of by the of this this year almost eclipses the total amount the UK has paid toward the European Union budget over the past 47 years.!!

Isn’t that just fucking awesome!

Brexit bonus Bonanza

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Where does the 200 billion figure come from? Is this just estimated because I have searched and cannot find this information, just predictions by different people but no actual figures to bk this up? Although I guess its impossible to cost it properly as it is still ongoing so no one really knows for sure, just guessing relating to there own personal bias no doubt.The calculation was made by dan hanson on the bloombergs site of the cost of brexit I also did a forum post about.

Oh... so dan Hanson . From Bloomberg . Just his estimate . I see . Who is dan Hanson ?"

Someone who most definitely knows far more what he's talking about the UK economy than you mate

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By *anejohnkent6263Couple over a year ago

canterbury

Best we get the bank of England

Boss to give us a prediction ...with his track record he could not predict a thing ...pre britex ...total crap ...nothing happened

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Best we get the bank of England

Boss to give us a prediction ...with his track record he could not predict a thing ...pre britex ...total crap ...nothing happened"

Den hanson of bloombergs not good enough for you? Independent, widely respected, company whose opinions are consistently right? No axe to grind but why are you bringing up the Bank of England unless you are trying to avoid answering or maybe you didn’t understand what was being talked about Boycie.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Where does the 200 billion figure come from? Is this just estimated because I have searched and cannot find this information, just predictions by different people but no actual figures to bk this up? Although I guess its impossible to cost it properly as it is still ongoing so no one really knows for sure, just guessing relating to there own personal bias no doubt.The calculation was made by dan hanson on the bloombergs site of the cost of brexit I also did a forum post about.

Oh... so dan Hanson . From Bloomberg . Just his estimate . I see . Who is dan Hanson ?"

Tragic response....really tragic. Do your own research and lets here what you can find to try and undermine this. We are all waiting....

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By *xpatadventurerMan over a year ago

Work Abroad / London

The saddest fact about Brexit is that Brexit-eers continue to assume that some sort of " Sun lit Uplands " are on the horizon come Friday Jan 31st.

When irresponsible Politicians light a populist "bonfire" in a democracy they undermine its credibility and do damage that will last for decades.

The whole Brexit notion was a distraction from the day to day grind that life in the UK has become ...After all the Electorate need someone to blame . Harness that power in the wrong way and the fall out will be horrible.

I have asked Leaver friends on many occasions to name 3 benefits of Brexit and not one can do so.

Fact is that if you unilaterally extinguish a social/ economic / security / political / financial partnership with your natural allies you are going to suffer.

I am a full British citizen who is proud of the fact. I have worked in the UK/ abroad for many years in the construction industry and conversant with International Trade ...British companies that we deal with are already shifting production out of the UK.

Am no doom monger but very soon the British electorate is going to be asking itself " What have we done ? "

It is so sad that the Electorate fell for one of the biggest confidence tricks of all time !!

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By *mmabluTV/TS over a year ago

upton wirral

"I see no signs of a “disaster” ?

What would you describe the epic waste of money that brexit has caused so far?"
Caused by remoaners hating the democratic will of the people.HS2 a much bigger waste of money

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By *mmabluTV/TS over a year ago

upton wirral

"Don’t believe everything u read .

for example ,,,,,£350million written on the side of a bus Yes which all brexiters believed in."
No wrong again but you have been told but you do not listen

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By *an For YouMan over a year ago

belfast/holywood

"Where does the 200 billion figure come from? Is this just estimated because I have searched and cannot find this information, just predictions by different people but no actual figures to bk this up? Although I guess its impossible to cost it properly as it is still ongoing so no one really knows for sure, just guessing relating to there own personal bias no doubt.The calculation was made by dan hanson on the bloombergs site of the cost of brexit I also did a forum post about.

Oh... so dan Hanson . From Bloomberg . Just his estimate . I see . Who is dan Hanson ?He is an economist."

An economist ?. Gotcha . Just him then. I see

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"The saddest fact about Brexit is that Brexit-eers continue to assume that some sort of " Sun lit Uplands " are on the horizon come Friday Jan 31st.

When irresponsible Politicians light a populist "bonfire" in a democracy they undermine its credibility and do damage that will last for decades.

I have asked Leaver friends on many occasions to name 3 benefits of Brexit and not one can do so.

Fact is that if you unilaterally extinguish a social/ economic / security / political / financial partnership with your natural allies you are going to suffer.

Am no doom monger but very soon the British electorate is going to be asking itself " What have we done ? "

It is so sad that the Electorate fell for one of the biggest confidence tricks of all time !!

It’s almost as if a Jedi mind trick was played on a significant proportion of the population .

“These aren’t the experts you want to listen to ..now move along ...” with a wave of a hand they moved along..

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Where does the 200 billion figure come from? Is this just estimated because I have searched and cannot find this information, just predictions by different people but no actual figures to bk this up? Although I guess its impossible to cost it properly as it is still ongoing so no one really knows for sure, just guessing relating to there own personal bias no doubt.The calculation was made by dan hanson on the bloombergs site of the cost of brexit I also did a forum post about.

Oh... so dan Hanson . From Bloomberg . Just his estimate . I see . Who is dan Hanson ?He is an economist.

An economist ?. Gotcha . Just him then. I see"

Yep you definitely need to get back on the meds.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

and 200 billion is what percentage of GDP? To give the figures context, for those of us that aren't economists...

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Where does the 200 billion figure come from? Is this just estimated because I have searched and cannot find this information, just predictions by different people but no actual figures to bk this up? Although I guess its impossible to cost it properly as it is still ongoing so no one really knows for sure, just guessing relating to there own personal bias no doubt.The calculation was made by dan hanson on the bloombergs site of the cost of brexit I also did a forum post about.

Oh... so dan Hanson . From Bloomberg . Just his estimate . I see . Who is dan Hanson ?He is an economist.

An economist ?. Gotcha . Just him then. I see"

Imagine if you scrutinised everything you heard to this degree. You might fall on the correct side of an argument once in a while.

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By *evil_u_knowMan over a year ago

city

"and 200 billion is what percentage of GDP? To give the figures context, for those of us that aren't economists..."

To people who are not economists, or dont have a passing interest in it, then there its best to say it will be added to the 2 trillion of debt the UK has, and how that debt may overtake GDP and cause the UK to spiral into 3rd world levels of debt.

That when the time came to be pragmatic, risks were taken. Very very expensive risks.

If them risks pay off then non economists can say "told you so", but the economist will just reply "And we could have got here with reduced risks, your plan was akin to going into a casino and betting your house on black"

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Best we get the bank of England

Boss to give us a prediction ...with his track record he could not predict a thing ...pre britex ...total crap ...nothing happened"

I presume you're totally ignoring all the fiscal stimulus the BOE did leading up to the referendum vote then

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"and 200 billion is what percentage of GDP? To give the figures context, for those of us that aren't economists...

That when the time came to be pragmatic, risks were taken. Very very expensive risks.

So, some might call it an educated risk.... and the doomsday predictions might never happen and the UK might in fact prosper? So neither prediction is more certain than the other? Despite the best efforts of the remainers, sceptics and doomsday merchants, that frustrated a clean Brexit, it hasn't changed the majority view that we are better out, than in, apparently

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"and 200 billion is what percentage of GDP? To give the figures context, for those of us that aren't economists...

That when the time came to be pragmatic, risks were taken. Very very expensive risks.

Wait. No one is claiming the UK will prosper. Where did you get this from?

The UK has already taken a massive hit. And even the more hardcore brexiteers are saying 50 years to get anything positive out of it.

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"Where does the 200 billion figure come from? Is this just estimated because I have searched and cannot find this information, just predictions by different people but no actual figures to bk this up? Although I guess its impossible to cost it properly as it is still ongoing so no one really knows for sure, just guessing relating to there own personal bias no doubt.The calculation was made by dan hanson on the bloombergs site of the cost of brexit I also did a forum post about.

Oh... so dan Hanson . From Bloomberg . Just his estimate . I see . Who is dan Hanson ?

Someone who most definitely knows far more what he's talking about the UK economy than you mate

"
Yes dan is the man

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By *oxychick35Couple over a year ago

thornaby

"At the end of the day nobody knows what will happen as nobody can predict the future but let’s put the great back into Britain ????

Personally I don’t think it will be a bad thing

And before everyone starts quoting that the economist state this or that or the other

Remember they were wrong before the referendum when house prices would crash 30 -%

Guess what they didn’t

Just because one single prediction didn't come true. Doesn't magically make the clusterfuck that is Brexit, into a good thing, or even an unknown thing.

It would correct to say. It's a fucking disaster. But we don't know the exact extent of the disaster yet."
he could of said Osborn quoted half a million job loses the day after we voted leave. Guess what lol

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By *an For YouMan over a year ago

belfast/holywood

I’m always on the right side of the argument. I’m immensely clever

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By *an For YouMan over a year ago

belfast/holywood

"At the end of the day nobody knows what will happen as nobody can predict the future but let’s put the great back into Britain ????

Personally I don’t think it will be a bad thing

And before everyone starts quoting that the economist state this or that or the other

Remember they were wrong before the referendum when house prices would crash 30 -%

Guess what they didn’t

Just because one single prediction didn't come true. Doesn't magically make the clusterfuck that is Brexit, into a good thing, or even an unknown thing.

It would correct to say. It's a fucking disaster. But we don't know the exact extent of the disaster yet. he could of said Osborn quoted half a million job loses the day after we voted leave. Guess what lol"

Record levels of employment

Records levels of low unemployment

Growth higher than the majority of EU contributors

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I’m always on the right side of the argument. I’m immensely clever "

You may think so, yes I have no doubt you think that

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By *an For YouMan over a year ago

belfast/holywood

[Removed by poster at 30/01/20 13:23:42]

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By *an For YouMan over a year ago

belfast/holywood

Den/Dan hansin from Boombegs is independent?. Does he have full access to the government data,?. Tracey Boles, the Sun’s business editor has a different opinion apparently. She is also independent

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By *ony 2016Man over a year ago

Huddersfield /derby cinemas

"and Despite the best efforts of the remainers, sceptics and doomsday merchants, that frustrated a clean Brexit, it hasn't changed the majority view that we are better out, than in, apparently

"
. Not entirely correct, if you look at the General Election result ,while undoubtedly the leave parties won a 80 seat majority in The Commons , more people voted for parties that either wanted another referendum or to cancel brexit altogether, which probably shows that the majority view is that we are better in than out ,

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I’m always on the right side of the argument. I’m immensely clever "

Winning at all costs is generally a bit lame, especially if you have to get rid of people who disagree with your point of view by cowardly and nefarious means. Just saying!

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By *xpatadventurerMan over a year ago

Work Abroad / London

Jedi mind trick indeed !

Brexit offers nothing but jingoistic slogans and not one of its proponents can give solid facts as to what the outcome will be !

There are no statistics to say that any UK citizen will be socially/financially better off because it is completely unchartered waters.

I have no wish to offend those who think that it is going to lead to great things for the UK but where is the evidence ?

For those who believe in Brexit then please name 3 things that you know will make our lives better as a result of it ?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Jedi mind trick indeed !

Brexit offers nothing but jingoistic slogans and not one of its proponents can give solid facts as to what the outcome will be !

There are no statistics to say that any UK citizen will be socially/financially better off because it is completely unchartered waters.

I have no wish to offend those who think that it is going to lead to great things for the UK but where is the evidence ?

For those who believe in Brexit then please name 3 things that you know will make our lives better as a result of it ? "

Valiant effort. We've been asking that question here for years.

All we ever get are slogans or just repeat blatant lies.

The latest argument seems to be. "No one knows".

Which is a misunderstanding of "no one knows how bad"

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By *ony 2016Man over a year ago

Huddersfield /derby cinemas

"Jedi mind trick indeed !

Brexit offers nothing but jingoistic slogans and not one of its proponents can give solid facts as to what the outcome will be !

There are no statistics to say that any UK citizen will be socially/financially better off because it is completely unchartered waters.

I have no wish to offend those who think that it is going to lead to great things for the UK but where is the evidence ?

For those who believe in Brexit then please name 3 things that you know will make our lives better as a result of it ? "
. (1) bent bananas ,,(2) blue passports ,,(3) a new 50p coin

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Jedi mind trick indeed !

Brexit offers nothing but jingoistic slogans and not one of its proponents can give solid facts as to what the outcome will be !

There are no statistics to say that any UK citizen will be socially/financially better off because it is completely unchartered waters.

I have no wish to offend those who think that it is going to lead to great things for the UK but where is the evidence ?

For those who believe in Brexit then please name 3 things that you know will make our lives better as a result of it ? . (1) bent bananas ,,(2) blue passports ,,(3) a new 50p coin

Just got my renewed passport and its still red

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By *ony 2016Man over a year ago

Huddersfield /derby cinemas

"Jedi mind trick indeed !

Brexit offers nothing but jingoistic slogans and not one of its proponents can give solid facts as to what the outcome will be !

There are no statistics to say that any UK citizen will be socially/financially better off because it is completely unchartered waters.

I have no wish to offend those who think that it is going to lead to great things for the UK but where is the evidence ?

For those who believe in Brexit then please name 3 things that you know will make our lives better as a result of it ? . (1) bent bananas ,,(2) blue passports ,,(3) a new 50p coin

Just got my renewed passport and its still red

"
. Just the banana and coin then

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Where does the 200 billion figure come from? Is this just estimated because I have searched and cannot find this information, just predictions by different people but no actual figures to bk this up? Although I guess its impossible to cost it properly as it is still ongoing so no one really knows for sure, just guessing relating to there own personal bias no doubt.The calculation was made by dan hanson on the bloombergs site of the cost of brexit I also did a forum post about.

Oh... so dan Hanson . From Bloomberg . Just his estimate . I see . Who is dan Hanson ?

Tragic response....really tragic. Do your own research and lets here what you can find to try and undermine this. We are all waiting....

"
your opinion and you are entitled to it, never said I was trying to undermine what was said either, just questioned where it had come from, but as usual on here just personal attacks and insults to anyone who asks a question, why did you not just say it was the Bloomberg guy, and I see this is still a estimate which is the point I was trying to make, no one will know the true costs for a very long time, no need to reply either, I am done on here, this place is so toxic

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By *asyukMan over a year ago

West London

"At the end of the day nobody knows what will happen as nobody can predict the future but let’s put the great back into Britain ????

Personally I don’t think it will be a bad thing

And before everyone starts quoting that the economist state this or that or the other

Remember they were wrong before the referendum when house prices would crash 30 -%

Guess what they didn’t

Just because one single prediction didn't come true. Doesn't magically make the clusterfuck that is Brexit, into a good thing, or even an unknown thing.

Record levels of employment

Records levels of low unemployment

Growth higher than the majority of EU contributors "

George Osborne was an idiot and the Government fear campaign was foolish.

Again the attempt to suggest that just because this extreme position was started and didn't occur means that all of the sober predictions made are also untrue. They are not connected.

Employment defined as having done one hours work in the last week.

Record levels of job insecurity and use of food banks, so something doesn't add up.

GDP growth in the UK has been amongst the bottom dozen in the EU since the referendum

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By *asyukMan over a year ago

West London

Think tank calls for ban on ‘office chat’ about economics and trade for being ‘exclusionary to Brexiters’

January 28, 2020

Written by Chris Ballard (Newsthump)

Workplace banter about the gritty reality of life outside a major trading bloc should be curtailed on the basis that it’s exclusionary, according to a management body.

A new report from the Chartered Institute of Managers suggests that talking in realistic terms about the UK’s economic prospects after Brexit should be banned in the workplace.

“Not everyone likes to face up to the real world,” said Chartered Manager Simon Williams. “Many people prefer to view Brexit through the prism of high fantasy.

“If people are chatting about how the US will slap tariffs on everything if they don’t get their way, then these delusional Brexiters are naturally going to feel left out. If you want to discuss Japan’s insistence that a quick free-trade agreement with the UK would require us being in regulatory alignment with the EU then we simply ask you don’t do it in front of people who won’t understand it.

“I’ve got nothing against Remainers or economic literacy – that’s all great and everything – but bosses need to crack down on water cooler banter that focuses on Britain’s impending financial meltdown. It’s a gateway conversation to other divisive issues.

“It’s a short step from ‘ooh, medicines are gonna be expensive’ to other inappropriate topics such as the value of immigration and the need for equal pay.”

Brexit supporter Christopher James welcomes the proposal.

“I’ve got no mates in work cos everyone’s always going on about how imports are gonna be expensive and how great the foreigners are,” he said. “It’s just not a safe environment for me to come out with my casually racist comments and jokes.

“Managers need to make sure that everyone feels comfortable in the workplace. Trouble is, the boss is a bloody kraut. Got no respect have they?”

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By *oxychick35Couple over a year ago

thornaby

"At the end of the day nobody knows what will happen as nobody can predict the future but let’s put the great back into Britain ????

Personally I don’t think it will be a bad thing

And before everyone starts quoting that the economist state this or that or the other

Remember they were wrong before the referendum when house prices would crash 30 -%

Guess what they didn’t

Just because one single prediction didn't come true. Doesn't magically make the clusterfuck that is Brexit, into a good thing, or even an unknown thing.

Record levels of employment

Records levels of low unemployment

Growth higher than the majority of EU contributors

George Osborne was an idiot and the Government fear campaign was foolish.

Again the attempt to suggest that just because this extreme position was started and didn't occur means that all of the sober predictions made are also untrue. They are not connected.

Employment defined as having done one hours work in the last week.

Record levels of job insecurity and use of food banks, so something doesn't add up.

GDP growth in the UK has been amongst the bottom dozen in the EU since the referendum

"
France and Italy arnt doing to clever at the min either

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"At the end of the day nobody knows what will happen as nobody can predict the future but let’s put the great back into Britain ????

Personally I don’t think it will be a bad thing

And before everyone starts quoting that the economist state this or that or the other

Remember they were wrong before the referendum when house prices would crash 30 -%

Guess what they didn’t

Just because one single prediction didn't come true. Doesn't magically make the clusterfuck that is Brexit, into a good thing, or even an unknown thing.

Record levels of employment

Records levels of low unemployment

Growth higher than the majority of EU contributors

George Osborne was an idiot and the Government fear campaign was foolish.

Again the attempt to suggest that just because this extreme position was started and didn't occur means that all of the sober predictions made are also untrue. They are not connected.

Employment defined as having done one hours work in the last week.

Record levels of job insecurity and use of food banks, so something doesn't add up.

GDP growth in the UK has been amongst the bottom dozen in the EU since the referendum

France and Italy arnt doing to clever at the min either "

Public support for the EU is up across the entire EU27.

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By *an For YouMan over a year ago

belfast/holywood

Tell that to the swedes , the Dutch and an ever growing influence of nationalist, far right parties across major European countries

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By *an For YouMan over a year ago

belfast/holywood

[Removed by poster at 31/01/20 13:26:00]

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Tell that to the swedes , the Dutch and an ever growing influence of nationalist, far right parties across major European countries "

They’ll have been polled too. Support for the EU up across the block. And in the UK too.

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By *an For YouMan over a year ago

belfast/holywood

Support for the EU is up in the UK..... erm .... hang on.... just gonna have to ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. Right that’s out the way. Support in the UK is up for the EU. Erm the small matter of the referendum then the landslide GET Brexit Done general election. Ring any bells ????????

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By *asyukMan over a year ago

West London

"Support for the EU is up in the UK..... erm .... hang on.... just gonna have to ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. Right that’s out the way. Support in the UK is up for the EU. Erm the small matter of the referendum then the landslide GET Brexit Done general election. Ring any bells ????????"

The "landslide" was a 1.2% increase to 44%

It's perfectly legitimate. The large majority is due to the first past the post system.

Support for Brexit really is not a "landslide" in any way whatsoever though

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Polling since 2017 has all suggested remain would win a direct repeat referendum. Johnson’s ‘landslide’ was given to him by less than half of voter turnout, and 53% of votes were in favour of second referendum supporting parties.

Remainers managed to get around a million people on the streets to march. Farage’s Brexit walk was attended by a gathering smaller than some families.

So yes. Support for the EU is up in the UK.

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By *an For YouMan over a year ago

belfast/holywood

Excuses excuses . How anyone can say a defeat is victory is beyond me . Oh wait.... we’re out of the EU. Explain that to me again .

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

You know those old clips where you see the Titanic setting out on it's maiden voyage and everyone on board cheering like they are the luckiest people alive.... why does that come to mind?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Does he really believe it himself? It is hard to know but I think deep down he have his daubts about it that it probably wont be that.

Of course he does. Brexit will be paradise for him, his friends and family are set to make millions.

Got to admire your unwavering commitment to this belief - like a dog with a bone

Ah hello.

Nothing to do with belief. This is

and example of the primary purpose for brexit.

I mean what the fuck else is it about if it's not the ultra rich fucking the rest of us over. Be real."

This the ultra rich who almost 100% voted and campaigned to remain. Because EU and remaining was what had feathered their nests. The bankers, the directors etc wished to remain.

The leave vote was mostly outside if "the city" and the Westminster bubble. The leave vote was the ordinary man in the street.

Wether they got it right or wrong remains to be seen.....but dont spout nonsense about the rich voting to leave when they clearly didn't.

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By *an For YouMan over a year ago

belfast/holywood

Because some people are locked in the past. Titanic?. Really?... oh wait ..... was that a conspiracy tooo????? Hilarious sonny

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Does he really believe it himself? It is hard to know but I think deep down he have his daubts about it that it probably wont be that.

Of course he does. Brexit will be paradise for him, his friends and family are set to make millions.

Got to admire your unwavering commitment to this belief - like a dog with a bone

Ah hello.

Nothing to do with belief. This is

and example of the primary purpose for brexit.

I mean what the fuck else is it about if it's not the ultra rich fucking the rest of us over. Be real.

This the ultra rich who almost 100% voted and campaigned to remain. Because EU and remaining was what had feathered their nests. The bankers, the directors etc wished to remain.

The leave vote was mostly outside if "the city" and the Westminster bubble. The leave vote was the ordinary man in the street.

Wether they got it right or wrong remains to be seen.....but dont spout nonsense about the rich voting to leave when they clearly didn't."

The rich not only voted leave, but they paid for it as well.

Arron Banks, Lord Ashcroft et al. Patriots based in Belize, who couldn’t give a toss about the working class in the UK.

They’re making a killing out of this.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Because some people are locked in the past. Titanic?. Really?... oh wait ..... was that a conspiracy tooo????? Hilarious sonny"

Just a lot of people celebrating their own doom. At the time they thought they were the lucky ones. Never mind. You wouldn't understand.

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By *an For YouMan over a year ago

belfast/holywood

"Does he really believe it himself? It is hard to know but I think deep down he have his daubts about it that it probably wont be that.

Of course he does. Brexit will be paradise for him, his friends and family are set to make millions.

Got to admire your unwavering commitment to this belief - like a dog with a bone

Ah hello.

Nothing to do with belief. This is

and example of the primary purpose for brexit.

I mean what the fuck else is it about if it's not the ultra rich fucking the rest of us over. Be real.

This the ultra rich who almost 100% voted and campaigned to remain. Because EU and remaining was what had feathered their nests. The bankers, the directors etc wished to remain.

The leave vote was mostly outside if "the city" and the Westminster bubble. The leave vote was the ordinary man in the street.

Wether they got it right or wrong remains to be seen.....but dont spout nonsense about the rich voting to leave when they clearly didn't.

The rich not only voted leave, but they paid for it as well.

Arron Banks, Lord Ashcroft et al. Patriots based in Belize, who couldn’t give a toss about the working class in the UK.

They’re making a killing out of this."

I think a lot more poor people voted to leave than rich . By a factor of many thousands to one. No wait - they were hoodwinked by the daily mail weren’t they ?. They had no idea what they were voting for. Did they?. Bloody press barons. Engineered Brexit to line their own pockets and force more people to go to food banks. Not sure exactly how that works if the economy is going down the tubes but sure ; some fab expert will be along to keep me right lol

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By *ust RachelTV/TS over a year ago

Eastbourne

Of course it.

The jobs that will need filling due to Europeans not wanting to stay here, will be filled by those on benefits. So to Boris it is a paradise, loads of jobs, drop in unemployment.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

The EU will implode within 10 years.. France and Germany are already struggling.. they didn't want to keep us in for our own good.. better off out

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"The EU will implode within 10 years.. France and Germany are already struggling.. they didn't want to keep us in for our own good.. better off out"

Did you "learn" this misinformation from a previous poster on this forum, because they "learned" it from some lad at the pub.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"The EU will implode within 10 years.. France and Germany are already struggling.. they didn't want to keep us in for our own good.. better off out"

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By *ostafunMan over a year ago

near ipswich

"The EU will implode within 10 years.. France and Germany are already struggling.. they didn't want to keep us in for our own good.. better off out

Haha, there are countries begging to get in the EU. They will be fine without us. If Brexit does become an ‘amazing ‘ success and we complete ‘easy and fantastic’ trade deals with other countries then maybe the other EU countries might consider leaving . If Brexit is a clusterfuck or nothing much changes then it will strengthen the EU . "
Yes look at the countries begging to get in, not a penny between them, of course they are they will be net beneficiaries for decades.

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By *oxychick35Couple over a year ago

thornaby

"The EU will implode within 10 years.. France and Germany are already struggling.. they didn't want to keep us in for our own good.. better off out

Haha, there are countries begging to get in the EU. They will be fine without us. If Brexit does become an ‘amazing ‘ success and we complete ‘easy and fantastic’ trade deals with other countries then maybe the other EU countries might consider leaving . If Brexit is a clusterfuck or nothing much changes then it will strengthen the EU . "
if th Eu thought brexit was going to be a clusterfuck wouldn’t they be happy for the uk to leave so it could stand as warning to other members thinking of leaving ? Yet they have fought so hard to keep us in ?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"The EU will implode within 10 years.. France and Germany are already struggling.. they didn't want to keep us in for our own good.. better off out

Haha, there are countries begging to get in the EU. They will be fine without us. If Brexit does become an ‘amazing ‘ success and we complete ‘easy and fantastic’ trade deals with other countries then maybe the other EU countries might consider leaving . If Brexit is a clusterfuck or nothing much changes then it will strengthen the EU . Yes look at the countries begging to get in, not a penny between them, of course they are they will be net beneficiaries for decades. "

So you're saying when the UK is penniless, we can get to the back of the queue to rejoin?

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By *ostafunMan over a year ago

near ipswich

"The EU will implode within 10 years.. France and Germany are already struggling.. they didn't want to keep us in for our own good.. better off out

Haha, there are countries begging to get in the EU. They will be fine without us. If Brexit does become an ‘amazing ‘ success and we complete ‘easy and fantastic’ trade deals with other countries then maybe the other EU countries might consider leaving . If Brexit is a clusterfuck or nothing much changes then it will strengthen the EU . Yes look at the countries begging to get in, not a penny between them, of course they are they will be net beneficiaries for decades.

So you're saying when the UK is penniless, we can get to the back of the queue to rejoin?"
The uk wont be penniless we are a great trading nation, you make it sound like nobody will want to trade with us.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"The EU will implode within 10 years.. France and Germany are already struggling.. they didn't want to keep us in for our own good.. better off out

Haha, there are countries begging to get in the EU. They will be fine without us. If Brexit does become an ‘amazing ‘ success and we complete ‘easy and fantastic’ trade deals with other countries then maybe the other EU countries might consider leaving . If Brexit is a clusterfuck or nothing much changes then it will strengthen the EU . Yes look at the countries begging to get in, not a penny between them, of course they are they will be net beneficiaries for decades.

So you're saying when the UK is penniless, we can get to the back of the queue to rejoin?The uk wont be penniless we are a great trading nation, you make it sound like nobody will want to trade with us.

Haha. Yeah, of course everyone wants to trade with us, we are weak and vulnerable, ripe for the picking.

That's why corporate America funded Farage and his goons.

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By *asyukMan over a year ago

West London

"Of course it.

The jobs that will need filling due to Europeans not wanting to stay here, will be filled by those on benefits. So to Boris it is a paradise, loads of jobs, drop in unemployment. "

What makes you think that?

There are unfilled vacancies now with people still on benefits.

They'll be filled by people from other countries. They'll just be on employment visas and have fewer rights than EU citizens did with free movement.

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By *ony 2016Man over a year ago

Huddersfield /derby cinemas

It appears as if ,although Johnson believes brexit will be paradise he only wants to tell the " friendly" press what happens next

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"The EU will implode within 10 years.. France and Germany are already struggling.. they didn't want to keep us in for our own good.. better off out

Haha, there are countries begging to get in the EU. They will be fine without us. If Brexit does become an ‘amazing ‘ success and we complete ‘easy and fantastic’ trade deals with other countries then maybe the other EU countries might consider leaving . If Brexit is a clusterfuck or nothing much changes then it will strengthen the EU . if th Eu thought brexit was going to be a clusterfuck wouldn’t they be happy for the uk to leave so it could stand as warning to other members thinking of leaving ? Yet they have fought so hard to keep us in ?"

Fought so hard? of course they would have preferred the UK to stay in the EU, but now they have left they will now be quite rightly fighting for their members interests not the UKs .

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"The EU will implode within 10 years.. France and Germany are already struggling.. they didn't want to keep us in for our own good.. better off out

Haha, there are countries begging to get in the EU. They will be fine without us. If Brexit does become an ‘amazing ‘ success and we complete ‘easy and fantastic’ trade deals with other countries then maybe the other EU countries might consider leaving . If Brexit is a clusterfuck or nothing much changes then it will strengthen the EU . if th Eu thought brexit was going to be a clusterfuck wouldn’t they be happy for the uk to leave so it could stand as warning to other members thinking of leaving ? Yet they have fought so hard to keep us in ?

Fought so hard? of course they would have preferred the UK to stay in the EU, but now they have left they will now be quite rightly fighting for their members interests not the UKs . "

https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/boris-johnson-no-deal-brexit-trump-gatt-wto-trade-latest-a9003296.html

"First, one has to believe our economy would perform better outside the EU, including in the first few years, so we would be negotiating from a position of economic strength, or at the very least not from a position of economic meltdown, as many suspect would be the case."

"Second, one would have to believe that our former European partners would be willing to improve their offer to us, after we’ve left the club and after we would have caused costly disruption for many of their citizens and firms."

"Third, one would have to believe our new negotiator-in-chief, Boris Johnson, possesses such powers of deal-making and diplomacy that Britain would at last be able to turn the tables on the hapless Europeans."

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By *ust RachelTV/TS over a year ago

Eastbourne

"Of course it.

The jobs that will need filling due to Europeans not wanting to stay here, will be filled by those on benefits. So to Boris it is a paradise, loads of jobs, drop in unemployment.

What makes you think that?

There are unfilled vacancies now with people still on benefits.

They'll be filled by people from other countries. They'll just be on employment visas and have fewer rights than EU citizens did with free movement."

With the increase levels of racism towards them, why would they want to come here.

We have had the same immigration system in place for years, so obviously it didn't work too well

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By *asyukMan over a year ago

West London

"Of course it.

The jobs that will need filling due to Europeans not wanting to stay here, will be filled by those on benefits. So to Boris it is a paradise, loads of jobs, drop in unemployment.

What makes you think that?

There are unfilled vacancies now with people still on benefits.

They'll be filled by people from other countries. They'll just be on employment visas and have fewer rights than EU citizens did with free movement.

With the increase levels of racism towards them, why would they want to come here.

We have had the same immigration system in place for years, so obviously it didn't work too well"

Then we won't get the high skilled jobs.

They don't have to come here.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/midlands-news/ikea-coventry-store-closure-blamed-17686305

Business is booming! For Amazon...

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By *ust RachelTV/TS over a year ago

Eastbourne

"Of course it.

The jobs that will need filling due to Europeans not wanting to stay here, will be filled by those on benefits. So to Boris it is a paradise, loads of jobs, drop in unemployment.

What makes you think that?

There are unfilled vacancies now with people still on benefits.

They'll be filled by people from other countries. They'll just be on employment visas and have fewer rights than EU citizens did with free movement.

With the increase levels of racism towards them, why would they want to come here.

We have had the same immigration system in place for years, so obviously it didn't work too well

Then we won't get the high skilled jobs.

They don't have to come here."

The majority of Eastern Europeans that I worked with, had better qualifications than the people who were in a position of power.

Believe me they do the lo level jobs that no one wants to do, then go for the promotion that befits them.

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By *ony 2016Man over a year ago

Huddersfield /derby cinemas

When Johnson said it would be paradise after brexit he was probably refering to his free £15,000 Caribbean Island holiday

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By *ust RachelTV/TS over a year ago

Eastbourne

I bet this was not mentioned in the brexit promise

Britain’s exit from the EU, will leave the sensitive personal information of tens of millions not covered by Europe’s world-leading General Data Protection Regulation(GDPR) and therefore with less protection and within easier reach of British law enforcement.

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By *ercuryMan over a year ago

Grantham

"I bet this was not mentioned in the brexit promise

The UK will have its own version of GDPR, after the transition period.

This may well be weaker, as strong or stronger than the current. Time will tell.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Does he really believe it himself? It is hard to know but I think deep down he have his daubts about it that it probably wont be that.

Of course he does. Brexit will be paradise for him, his friends and family are set to make millions. "

True but lets face it hes only reaping what hes sown

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Well DEFRA have confirmed that English farmers will receive 25% lower subsidies moving forwards.

This of course after the Vote leave campaign promised that farmers would be ‘better off’ after Brexit and that subsidies would be ‘protected, and even increased’

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Well DEFRA have confirmed that English farmers will receive 25% lower subsidies moving forwards.

This of course after the Vote leave campaign promised that farmers would be ‘better off’ after Brexit and that subsidies would be ‘protected, and even increased’ "

Brexit bonus

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Does he really believe it himself? It is hard to know but I think deep down he have his daubts about it that it probably wont be that.

Of course he does. Brexit will be paradise for him, his friends and family are set to make millions.

It's us normal folk that are going to suffer from it. "

glad im not normal

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By *ercuryMan over a year ago

Grantham

"Well DEFRA have confirmed that English farmers will receive 25% lower subsidies moving forwards.

This of course after the Vote leave campaign promised that farmers would be ‘better off’ after Brexit and that subsidies would be ‘protected, and even increased’ "

That's not exactly true. Look eyond the headlines and into the detail.

Subsidies, linked to the Cap, are going to be replaced by payments that reward sustainability, modern techniques and environment matters.

Some farmers will lose out, but many will either stay still or gain.

The CAP, designed decades ago, is no longer relevant to the 21st century.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Well DEFRA have confirmed that English farmers will receive 25% lower subsidies moving forwards.

This of course after the Vote leave campaign promised that farmers would be ‘better off’ after Brexit and that subsidies would be ‘protected, and even increased’

That's not exactly true. Look eyond the headlines and into the detail.

Subsidies, linked to the Cap, are going to be replaced by payments that reward sustainability, modern techniques and environment matters.

Some farmers will lose out, but many will either stay still or gain.

The CAP, designed decades ago, is no longer relevant to the 21st century. "

There no Tory lie that some won’t defend, is there?

No farmers are going to gain. Except probably the ones who are also Tory MP’s

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By *an For YouMan over a year ago

belfast/holywood

Even the EU recognises that CAP is an outdated policy, not fit for today’s realities. Just look at the numerous , lengthy criticisms on its Wiki page. Unless you are French that is . Then it’s a great idea

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Even the EU recognises that CAP is an outdated policy, not fit for today’s realities. Just look at the numerous , lengthy criticisms on its Wiki page. Unless you are French that is . Then it’s a great idea"

This isn’t about whether CAP is good or bad - this is about a pledge to retain or improve farmers subsidies in 2016 which is being reneged upon.

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By *ostafunMan over a year ago

near ipswich

This isn’t about whether CAP is good or bad - this is about a pledge to retain or improve farmers subsidies in 2016 which is being reneged upon.

"
How is it being reneged upon? nothing has been finalized yet.

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By *ercuryMan over a year ago

Grantham

This isn’t about whether CAP is good or bad - this is about a pledge to retain or improve farmers subsidies in 2016 which is being reneged upon.

This years subsidies are protected in law.

Many consultations have now to take place.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

This isn’t about whether CAP is good or bad - this is about a pledge to retain or improve farmers subsidies in 2016 which is being reneged upon.

How is it being reneged upon? nothing has been finalized yet."

Have DEFRA not informed the industry that subsidies will be cut?

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *ostafunMan over a year ago

near ipswich

This isn’t about whether CAP is good or bad - this is about a pledge to retain or improve farmers subsidies in 2016 which is being reneged upon.

How is it being reneged upon? nothing has been finalized yet.

Have DEFRA not informed the industry that subsidies will be cut?

"
Its informed them that it will be scaled down over the next 7 years and replaced with an environmental policy which has not been finalized yet.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

This isn’t about whether CAP is good or bad - this is about a pledge to retain or improve farmers subsidies in 2016 which is being reneged upon.

How is it being reneged upon? nothing has been finalized yet.

Have DEFRA not informed the industry that subsidies will be cut?

Its informed them that it will be scaled down over the next 7 years and replaced with an environmental policy which has not been finalized yet."

And how would you feel about this not yet finalised policy? Especially when you take into account the much vaunted trade deal with the USA being reliant upon a farming industry that isn’t propped up with subsidies...

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

This isn’t about whether CAP is good or bad - this is about a pledge to retain or improve farmers subsidies in 2016 which is being reneged upon.

How is it being reneged upon? nothing has been finalized yet.

Have DEFRA not informed the industry that subsidies will be cut?

Its informed them that it will be scaled down over the next 7 years and replaced with an environmental policy which has not been finalized yet."

Seriously. The naivety is immense. To actually trust this government to deliver on something that isn’t even within their current term of office.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

The farmers union, who probably know more about farming than Joe Average, describe the govt. plan as ‘lunacy’.

But I’m sure the fabs politics board know better than actual representatives of actual farmers.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *ostafunMan over a year ago

near ipswich

This isn’t about whether CAP is good or bad - this is about a pledge to retain or improve farmers subsidies in 2016 which is being reneged upon.

How is it being reneged upon? nothing has been finalized yet.

Have DEFRA not informed the industry that subsidies will be cut?

Its informed them that it will be scaled down over the next 7 years and replaced with an environmental policy which has not been finalized yet.

"
Personally im all for getting rid of them why should people like the duke of norfolk,richard drax mp,vicount ridley all very wealthy people be getting over 1/2 million each in tax payers money.Last year 48 parliamentarians received nearly 6 million in farming subsidies no wonder they didnt want to leave the eu.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

This isn’t about whether CAP is good or bad - this is about a pledge to retain or improve farmers subsidies in 2016 which is being reneged upon.

How is it being reneged upon? nothing has been finalized yet.

Have DEFRA not informed the industry that subsidies will be cut?

Its informed them that it will be scaled down over the next 7 years and replaced with an environmental policy which has not been finalized yet.

Personally im all for getting rid of them why should people like the duke of norfolk,richard drax mp,vicount ridley all very wealthy people be getting over 1/2 million each in tax payers money.Last year 48 parliamentarians received nearly 6 million in farming subsidies no wonder they didnt want to leave the eu. "

What about the Farmers who aren’t wealthy parliamentarians? What about the ones struggling daily so that you can have food on your plate?

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By *ostafunMan over a year ago

near ipswich

This isn’t about whether CAP is good or bad - this is about a pledge to retain or improve farmers subsidies in 2016 which is being reneged upon.

How is it being reneged upon? nothing has been finalized yet.

Have DEFRA not informed the industry that subsidies will be cut?

Its informed them that it will be scaled down over the next 7 years and replaced with an environmental policy which has not been finalized yet.

What about the Farmers who aren’t wealthy parliamentarians? What about the ones struggling daily so that you can have food on your plate?

"
I should think they will be the 1st to implement the environmental policy to get the subs.Im with Greenpeace on this one it is what they have been calling for for years.1 in 5 of the top 100 land owning companies are billionaires or millionaires on the uk,s rich list and basically the bulk of the uk,s 3 billion subsidies goes to basic payments based on land area and are bankrolling these people.

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By *obka3Couple over a year ago

bournemouth

If anyone thinks the nfu is representative of "normal" farmers then you're wrong, they are full of oones that dont get their hands dirty but love attending committee meetings etc, they dont allow one member one vote as they know there would be a huge change at the top.

As for subs it's a very complicated subject and while it has helped keep food supplies stable it's the supermarkets who benefit by buying food often below cost price, food in the uk is cheap, if subs go then either the cost rises or we import a lot of cheap shit from abroad.I got out of food production years ago and moved into supplying the equestrian market the profit level is higher and less idiots telling ne how to do the job

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 28/02/20 05:49:34]

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If No Deal is so great, as some ardent brexiters like to tell us, why haven’t we stopped trying to get a deal?

Why not just walk away from negotiations?

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By *an For YouMan over a year ago

belfast/holywood

Because the PM wants a deal !. Duh. And the PM us in charge. He just doesn’t want a deal that means there will be no effective changes as a result of Brexit. Such as the EU demanding continued access to our waters, fish quotas, ECJ, free movement blah blah blah . The EU hasn’t grasped the reality that the UK will no longer be their cash cow and whipping boy

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Because the PM wants a deal !. Duh. And the PM us in charge. He just doesn’t want a deal that means there will be no effective changes as a result of Brexit. Such as the EU demanding continued access to our waters, fish quotas, ECJ, free movement blah blah blah . The EU hasn’t grasped the reality that the UK will no longer be their cash cow and whipping boy"

He won’t walk away with no deal. And he won’t get a satisfactory deal by the June extension time limit.

So we’ll request an extension or get a shit deal.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

He won’t walk away with no deal. And he won’t get a satisfactory deal by the June extension time limit.

So we’ll request an extension or get a shit deal. "

Or the wildcard: a deal which looks a lot like membership, without any say in anything, but accepting everything.

And Johnson will claim that’s what he wanted all along.

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By *an For YouMan over a year ago

belfast/holywood

I think you are getting Boris and Sir Keir stammerer mixed up

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I think you are getting Boris and Sir Keir stammerer mixed up"

To be fair, both are repeatedly on record as saying we should always stay in the EU.

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By *obka3Couple over a year ago

bournemouth

He won’t walk away with no deal. And he won’t get a satisfactory deal by the June extension time limit.

So we’ll request an extension or get a shit deal. "

Except he will have to change the law to do so, it's fixed date is in law and cant change

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

He won’t walk away with no deal. And he won’t get a satisfactory deal by the June extension time limit.

So we’ll request an extension or get a shit deal.

Except he will have to change the law to do so, it's fixed date is in law and cant change"

It can be changed, anyone who knows how our laws and parliament work knows that it can be changed. You were even kind enough to point it out before totally contradicting yourself in the same sentence.

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By *ostafunMan over a year ago

near ipswich

He won’t walk away with no deal. And he won’t get a satisfactory deal by the June extension time limit.

So we’ll request an extension or get a shit deal. "
To get an extension would mean paying the eu millions of pounds a week and if you think Boris will do that you are living in cloud cuckoo land mate.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

He won’t walk away with no deal. And he won’t get a satisfactory deal by the June extension time limit.

So we’ll request an extension or get a shit deal. To get an extension would mean paying the eu millions of pounds a week and if you think Boris will do that you are living in cloud cuckoo land mate. "

So it’s a shit deal then, which will probably cost us much more - or no deal which will be economic and political suicide.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

He won’t walk away with no deal. And he won’t get a satisfactory deal by the June extension time limit.

What is it about Boris that suddenly everyone believes the words that leave his mouth? He’s literally never delivered upon a promise in his entire political career.

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By *ostafunMan over a year ago

near ipswich

He won’t walk away with no deal. And he won’t get a satisfactory deal by the June extension time limit.

So it’s a shit deal then, which will probably cost us much more - or no deal which will be economic and political suicide.

"
do you actually believe that the eu want tariffs on goods when they sell far more to the uk than we do to them? there is a big world out there and we do not need eu rules holding us back.So yes there may be short term pain for exports to the eu but it will affect them too.We now have a strong government all on the same page where as the eu may have all been in agreement over the withdrawal agreement they now all have different agendas when it comes to trade.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

He won’t walk away with no deal. And he won’t get a satisfactory deal by the June extension time limit.

So it’s a shit deal then, which will probably cost us much more - or no deal which will be economic and political suicide.

do you actually believe that the eu want tariffs on goods when they sell far more to the uk than we do to them? there is a big world out there and we do not need eu rules holding us back.So yes there may be short term pain for exports to the eu but it will affect them too.We now have a strong government all on the same page where as the eu may have all been in agreement over the withdrawal agreement they now all have different agendas when it comes to trade. "

Trade and geography are linked. Always have been and always will be. You do most trade with your neighbours - especially in JIT manufacturing and with time limited resources like foodstuff.

If we want to trade with the EU (we do) then we have to adhere to EU trade rules. That’s not up for discussion.

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By *ostafunMan over a year ago

near ipswich

He won’t walk away with no deal. And he won’t get a satisfactory deal by the June extension time limit.

So it’s a shit deal then, which will probably cost us much more - or no deal which will be economic and political suicide.

Trade and geography are linked. Always have been and always will be. You do most trade with your neighbours - especially in JIT manufacturing and with time limited resources like foodstuff.

If we want to trade with the EU (we do) then we have to adhere to EU trade rules. That’s not up for discussion. "
true but you are getting trade rules mixed up with eu rules.Everyone who trades has to adhere to the trading standards of who they trade with that goes without saying.The eu are demanding that we adhere to their working directive,be under the control of the ecj,fair competition rules etc.Now that is not taking back control,all the uk is asking for is the same deal as canada,japan etc but the eu say that is not possible because of geography now you explain why that makes any difference.The simple fact is they are trying to impose these rules because they know we will succeed and then others will want to leave too.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

He won’t walk away with no deal. And he won’t get a satisfactory deal by the June extension time limit.

So it’s a shit deal then, which will probably cost us much more - or no deal which will be economic and political suicide.

Incidentally our economy is 80% services based. How would a no-deal Brexit affect that, do you reckon?

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By *ostafunMan over a year ago

near ipswich

He won’t walk away with no deal. And he won’t get a satisfactory deal by the June extension time limit.

So it’s a shit deal then, which will probably cost us much more - or no deal which will be economic and political suicide.

Incidentally our economy is 80% services based. How would a no-deal Brexit affect that, do you reckon? "
I have no idea i leave that to the experts.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

He won’t walk away with no deal. And he won’t get a satisfactory deal by the June extension time limit.

So it’s a shit deal then, which will probably cost us much more - or no deal which will be economic and political suicide.

Trade and geography are linked. Always have been and always will be. You do most trade with your neighbours - especially in JIT manufacturing and with time limited resources like foodstuff.

If we want to trade with the EU (we do) then we have to adhere to EU trade rules. That’s not up for discussion. true but you are getting trade rules mixed up with eu rules.Everyone who trades has to adhere to the trading standards of who they trade with that goes without saying.The eu are demanding that we adhere to their working directive,be under the control of the ecj,fair competition rules etc.Now that is not taking back control,all the uk is asking for is the same deal as canada,japan etc but the eu say that is not possible because of geography now you explain why that makes any difference.The simple fact is they are trying to impose these rules because they know we will succeed and then others will want to leave too. "

I’m not getting anything mixed up at all. I’m the one pointing out that we’re negotiating from a position of weakness here. We don’t get to dictate to the EU what we do or don’t get. Welcome to the post-Brexit world.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

He won’t walk away with no deal. And he won’t get a satisfactory deal by the June extension time limit.

So it’s a shit deal then, which will probably cost us much more - or no deal which will be economic and political suicide.

Incidentally our economy is 80% services based. How would a no-deal Brexit affect that, do you reckon? I have no idea i leave that to the experts."

The experts warned against leaving the EU.

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By *obka3Couple over a year ago

bournemouth

He won’t walk away with no deal. And he won’t get a satisfactory deal by the June extension time limit.

So it’s a shit deal then, which will probably cost us much more - or no deal which will be economic and political suicide.

Incidentally our economy is 80% services based. How would a no-deal Brexit affect that, do you reckon? "

Our trade with the EU is 8% of gdp

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By *ostafunMan over a year ago

near ipswich

He won’t walk away with no deal. And he won’t get a satisfactory deal by the June extension time limit.

So it’s a shit deal then, which will probably cost us much more - or no deal which will be economic and political suicide.

Incidentally our economy is 80% services based. How would a no-deal Brexit affect that, do you reckon? I have no idea i leave that to the experts.

The experts warned against leaving the EU."
Again i dont know enough about it but would take a guess it depends on what side of the fence the expert sits.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

He won’t walk away with no deal. And he won’t get a satisfactory deal by the June extension time limit.

So it’s a shit deal then, which will probably cost us much more - or no deal which will be economic and political suicide.

Incidentally our economy is 80% services based. How would a no-deal Brexit affect that, do you reckon?

Our trade with the EU is 8% of gdp "

That’s because we’re a services based economy. Services across the continent require freedom of movement, frictionless borders etc.

Get it yet?

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By *ostafunMan over a year ago

near ipswich

He won’t walk away with no deal. And he won’t get a satisfactory deal by the June extension time limit.

So it’s a shit deal then, which will probably cost us much more - or no deal which will be economic and political suicide.

Incidentally our economy is 80% services based. How would a no-deal Brexit affect that, do you reckon?

Our trade with the EU is 8% of gdp

That’s because we’re a services based economy. Services across the continent require freedom of movement, frictionless borders etc.

Get it yet?

"
Oh right you are an expert on services

can you tell me why you think the uk should live under eu rules as an independent country when no other country in the world has to before we move on to the next subject?

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

He won’t walk away with no deal. And he won’t get a satisfactory deal by the June extension time limit.

So it’s a shit deal then, which will probably cost us much more - or no deal which will be economic and political suicide.

Incidentally our economy is 80% services based. How would a no-deal Brexit affect that, do you reckon?

Our trade with the EU is 8% of gdp

That’s because we’re a services based economy. Services across the continent require freedom of movement, frictionless borders etc.

Get it yet?

Oh right you are an expert on services

can you tell me why you think the uk should live under eu rules as an independent country when no other country in the world has to before we move on to the next subject?"

There’s only one truly independent nation in the world these days - North Korea. Everyone else operates under trade agreements and as such sacrifices a degree of sovereignty.

It’s basically the nation’s natural state in a connected world.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

He won’t walk away with no deal. And he won’t get a satisfactory deal by the June extension time limit.

So it’s a shit deal then, which will probably cost us much more - or no deal which will be economic and political suicide.

Incidentally our economy is 80% services based. How would a no-deal Brexit affect that, do you reckon?

Our trade with the EU is 8% of gdp

That’s because we’re a services based economy. Services across the continent require freedom of movement, frictionless borders etc.

Get it yet?

Oh right you are an expert on services

can you tell me why you think the uk should live under eu rules as an independent country when no other country in the world has to before we move on to the next subject?"

The problem that we’ve always had is that even as an EU member, too many people saw the relationship as ‘them’ and ‘us’ - when in actual fact we have been the EU from 1992-2020

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *ostafunMan over a year ago

near ipswich

He won’t walk away with no deal. And he won’t get a satisfactory deal by the June extension time limit.

So it’s a shit deal then, which will probably cost us much more - or no deal which will be economic and political suicide.

Incidentally our economy is 80% services based. How would a no-deal Brexit affect that, do you reckon?

Our trade with the EU is 8% of gdp

That’s because we’re a services based economy. Services across the continent require freedom of movement, frictionless borders etc.

Get it yet?

Oh right you are an expert on services

can you tell me why you think the uk should live under eu rules as an independent country when no other country in the world has to before we move on to the next subject?

The problem that we’ve always had is that even as an EU member, too many people saw the relationship as ‘them’ and ‘us’ - when in actual fact we have been the EU from 1992-2020"
That does not answer the question.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

He won’t walk away with no deal. And he won’t get a satisfactory deal by the June extension time limit.

So it’s a shit deal then, which will probably cost us much more - or no deal which will be economic and political suicide.

Incidentally our economy is 80% services based. How would a no-deal Brexit affect that, do you reckon?

Our trade with the EU is 8% of gdp

That’s because we’re a services based economy. Services across the continent require freedom of movement, frictionless borders etc.

Get it yet?

Oh right you are an expert on services

can you tell me why you think the uk should live under eu rules as an independent country when no other country in the world has to before we move on to the next subject?

The problem that we’ve always had is that even as an EU member, too many people saw the relationship as ‘them’ and ‘us’ - when in actual fact we have been the EU from 1992-2020That does not answer the question.

I answered the question in the post above, Einstein.

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By *ostafunMan over a year ago

near ipswich

No you didnt i want to know why you think the uk should be the only country in the world that has to live under eu rules to trade with them?

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"No you didnt i want to know why you think the uk should be the only country in the world that has to live under eu rules to trade with them?"

I never claimed that, that’s you reading what you want to read.

What is it about pooling sovereignty for increased strength on the world stage that terrifies you so much?

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By *ostafunMan over a year ago

near ipswich

"No you didnt i want to know why you think the uk should be the only country in the world that has to live under eu rules to trade with them?

I never claimed that, that’s you reading what you want to read.

What is it about pooling sovereignty for increased strength on the world stage that terrifies you so much?"
Well thats what the eu are demanding.Have you not been awake this last 3 years the uk has voted for sovereignty from the eu.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If we want a deal as beneficial as the one we’ve enjoyed as an EU member then we will have to accept the 4 freedoms. That will secure our services sector (and is basically where we are now, in transition). It would make us a rule taker which is not as good as full membership, but there we are.

If we don’t want any part of the 4 freedoms then we can still get a deal, but it will be a deal with us as 3rd nation status - which will mean tariffs and adhering to standards that we may not want to adhere to.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"No you didnt i want to know why you think the uk should be the only country in the world that has to live under eu rules to trade with them?

I never claimed that, that’s you reading what you want to read.

What is it about pooling sovereignty for increased strength on the world stage that terrifies you so much?Well thats what the eu are demanding.Have you not been awake this last 3 years the uk has voted for sovereignty from the eu."

And if we want to trade with anyone, that will require a degree of sacrifice of that sovereignty. Unless we want to go down the 100% self sufficiency route - which no nation in the world does.

This is the world today. That’s how things work.

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By *ostafunMan over a year ago

near ipswich

"If we want a deal as beneficial as the one we’ve enjoyed as an EU member then we will have to accept the 4 freedoms. That will secure our services sector (and is basically where we are now, in transition). It would make us a rule taker which is not as good as full membership, but there we are.

If we insist upon regulatory divergence on food and animal welfare etc, or agree lower standards via trade with another country like the USA that will potentially threaten any deal with the EU (and regulatory divergence will necessitate a hard border in N. Ireland or in the Irish Sea)"
Well no country will adhere to standards they dont want to your talking rubbish.So many things i can comment on this,animal welfare Boris has already said he will ban live animal transport abroad once we leave (a better standard than the eu).I presume the food you talking about is chlorinated chicken?It was banned in 1997 by the eu so everyone thinks its bad, the fact is it was an excuse to stop US chicken entering europe as protection for eu farmers.It was a political decision not based on any science.The other fact is only 10% of US chicken is washed in chlorine the other is washed in organic acids as in the eu.

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By *ostafunMan over a year ago

near ipswich

"No you didnt i want to know why you think the uk should be the only country in the world that has to live under eu rules to trade with them?

I never claimed that, that’s you reading what you want to read.

And if we want to trade with anyone, that will require a degree of sacrifice of that sovereignty. Unless we want to go down the 100% self sufficiency route - which no nation in the world does.

This is the world today. That’s how things work."
Its like banging my head against a wall

you do not sacrifice your sovereignty doing a trade deal its trade thats all this is not what the eu are demanding of the uk what part of that dont you understand?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If we insist upon regulatory divergence on food and animal welfare etc, or agree lower standards via trade with another country like the USA that will potentially threaten any deal with the EU (and regulatory divergence will necessitate a hard border in N. Ireland or in the Irish Sea)Well no country will adhere to standards they dont want to your talking rubbish.So many things i can comment on this,animal welfare Boris has already said he will ban live animal transport abroad once we leave (a better standard than the eu).I presume the food you talking about is chlorinated chicken?It was banned in 1997 by the eu so everyone thinks its bad, the fact is it was an excuse to stop US chicken entering europe as protection for eu farmers.It was a political decision not based on any science.The other fact is only 10% of US chicken is washed in chlorine the other is washed in organic acids as in the eu."

The USA have lower food standards than the EU. That’s not even a discussion - 2 minutes on google will demonstrate that (and it’s not just about it chicken).

So if we do a deal with the USA on foodstuffs that will impact upon our ability to trade with the EU. And the lower standards will require policing at our border with the EU. You can’t have regulatory divergence on either side of an open frictionless border.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"No you didnt i want to know why you think the uk should be the only country in the world that has to live under eu rules to trade with them?

I never claimed that, that’s you reading what you want to read.

And if we want to trade with anyone, that will require a degree of sacrifice of that sovereignty. Unless we want to go down the 100% self sufficiency route - which no nation in the world does.

This is the world today. That’s how things work.Its like banging my head against a wall

you do not sacrifice your sovereignty doing a trade deal its trade thats all this is not what the eu are demanding of the uk what part of

That dont you understand?"

You absolutely sacrifice a percentage of sovereignty with every trade deal - unless of course you’re dictating each and every single term of the deal - which we certainly aren’t doing as a 3rd nation.

I understand this far better than you appear to, friend. You seem to get your soundbytes straight from the faragist playbook. So I’ll leave you to it.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *ostafunMan over a year ago

near ipswich

"No you didnt i want to know why you think the uk should be the only country in the world that has to live under eu rules to trade with them?

I never claimed that, that’s you reading what you want to read.

And if we want to trade with anyone, that will require a degree of sacrifice of that sovereignty. Unless we want to go down the 100% self sufficiency route - which no nation in the world does.

This is the world today. That’s how things work.Its like banging my head against a wall

you do not sacrifice your sovereignty doing a trade deal its trade thats all this is not what the eu are demanding of the uk what part of

That dont you understand?

I understand this far better than you appear to, friend. You seem to get your soundbytes straight from the faragist playbook. So I’ll leave you to it. "
As you seem to know so much about it please enlighten me as to how you sacrifice your sovereignty with every trade deal i look foreward to your reply.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"No you didnt i want to know why you think the uk should be the only country in the world that has to live under eu rules to trade with them?

I never claimed that, that’s you reading what you want to read.

And if we want to trade with anyone, that will require a degree of sacrifice of that sovereignty. Unless we want to go down the 100% self sufficiency route - which no nation in the world does.

This is the world today. That’s how things work.Its like banging my head against a wall

you do not sacrifice your sovereignty doing a trade deal its trade thats all this is not what the eu are demanding of the uk what part of

That dont you understand?

I understand this far better than you appear to, friend. You seem to get your soundbytes straight from the faragist playbook. So I’ll leave you to it. As you seem to know so much about it please enlighten me as to how you sacrifice your sovereignty with every trade deal i look foreward to your reply. "

I said a percentage of your sovereignty, and the answer was understandable from my last post. So sorry you didn’t understand it.

Have another read and see if you can work it out. Night night.

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By *ostafunMan over a year ago

near ipswich

"No you didnt i want to know why you think the uk should be the only country in the world that has to live under eu rules to trade with them?

I never claimed that, that’s you reading what you want to read.

And if we want to trade with anyone, that will require a degree of sacrifice of that sovereignty. Unless we want to go down the 100% self sufficiency route - which no nation in the world does.

This is the world today. That’s how things work.Its like banging my head against a wall

you do not sacrifice your sovereignty doing a trade deal its trade thats all this is not what the eu are demanding of the uk what part of

That dont you understand?

I said a percentage of your sovereignty, and the answer was understandable from my last post. So sorry you didn’t understand it.

Have another read and see if you can work it out. Night night. "
I see no answer i would still be interested in how a percentage is lost.

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By *an For YouMan over a year ago

belfast/holywood

He won’t walk away with no deal. And he won’t get a satisfactory deal by the June extension time limit.

So it’s a shit deal then, which will probably cost us much more - or no deal which will be economic and political suicide.

Trade and geography are linked. Always have been and always will be. You do most trade with your neighbours - especially in JIT manufacturing and with time limited resources like foodstuff.

If we want to trade with the EU (we do) then we have to adhere to EU trade rules. That’s not up for discussion. "

I literally can’t read your nonsense anymore . Ever

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By *an For YouMan over a year ago

belfast/holywood

"No you didnt i want to know why you think the uk should be the only country in the world that has to live under eu rules to trade with them?"

M8.... its pointless debating with someone like him. He knows nothing about anything

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By *oo hotCouple over a year ago

North West

Not going to reply to a specific post but broadly, grasping the story...

Every “deal” that we do as humans as an individual, a family, town, region or country involves a loss of “Sovereignty” to some degree or another. It is called a deal, because it is a trade, or a bargain and if you are the junior partner particularly - then you don’t dictate the terms and you give up some things on one hand in the hope of a material benefit in the other hand some time later.

Let’s take renting or buying a house from an individual perspective. Once you sign the lease or the mortgage, you are committed to adhere to things that you didn’t have to do beforehand. You have lost some individuality and you are expected to behave in a certain way to adhere to the contract that you signed.

A country signing a trade agreement will necessarily have to compromise on some of its preconceived “Sovereign” ideas in order to generate a benefit in another way. An example might be a US trade deal whereby the UK has to compromise its sovereign ideas about food standards, about drug pricing and about US Supreme Court jurisdiction. We want to sell stuff tariff free to them, and they want to sell stuff tariff free to us, but they being the bigger partner l, so they call the biggest shots,

This is just the way it works.

Try buying or renting a house and telling the landlord or or mortgage company that you are only signing a contract on your terms and as an equal. See what happens.

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By *ostafunMan over a year ago

near ipswich

"Not going to reply to a specific post but broadly, grasping the story...

This is just the way it works.

Try buying or renting a house and telling the landlord or or mortgage company that you are only signing a contract on your terms and as an equal. See what happens."
Sovereign ideas as you put them are not sovereignty to lose a percentage of sovereignty would mean you changing the law in parliament to accommodate some other countries laws.This is not what happens in trade deals.I dont recognize any of your examples of losing sovereignty as people dont have it.

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By *ostafunMan over a year ago

near ipswich

"No you didnt i want to know why you think the uk should be the only country in the world that has to live under eu rules to trade with them?

M8.... its pointless debating with someone like him. He knows nothing about anything "
Im beginning to think you are right thats why he is back under another name.

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By *oo hotCouple over a year ago

North West

"Not going to reply to a specific post but broadly, grasping the story...

This is just the way it works.

Try buying or renting a house and telling the landlord or or mortgage company that you are only signing a contract on your terms and as an equal. See what happens.Sovereign ideas as you put them are not sovereignty to lose a percentage of sovereignty would mean you changing the law in parliament to accommodate some other countries laws.This is not what happens in trade deals.I dont recognize any of your examples of losing sovereignty as people dont have it. "

OK - so we have laws in this country that relate to food and agriculture standards and we also have laws that govern how the NHS procurement system works. Unless those laws are changed we can never have a UK/US trade deal.

Just to add balance to that argument, we used to have laws about emissions into the air, rivers and sea around this country. We had to change those laws in order to continue to remain members of the EU.

We also currently have CO2 emissions targets that have now been enshrined in law which means that the Govt will be hamstrung with its commitment to build new runways, roads and rail lines in this country. The law may be changed or may have to be changed if political reality dictates.

In other words - laws can be changed if political will requires it - that could be strengthening the existing concepts of Sovereignty, or weakening it because of a perceived future economic benefit.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Does he really believe it himself? It is hard to know but I think deep down he have his daubts about it that it probably wont be that."

If Boris said it, it'll be at best, highly doubtful

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

" please enlighten me as to how you sacrifice your sovereignty with every trade deal i look foreward to your reply. "

As far as I see it with every trade deal you end up conforming to some rules or regulations of the trading partner to facilitate a deal.

Every change made by our Government because of what another state requires for a deal is an erosion of sovereignty

I'm not saying it's a bad thing it's just how the world works.

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