FabSwingers.com > Forums > Swingers Chat > Couples vs Play mates
Couples vs Play mates
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Recently set up a couples profile with a playmate of mine to find other couples/females for fun but have come accross a number of profiles stating that they only want to meet committed couples, not playmates/fuck buddies/friends with benefits etc
what is the difference between playing with a couple or 2 people that are just friends??
now, i am a firm believer of each to their own etc and this is BY NO MEANS a whingng thread - more a quest to become more educated in the ways of swinging  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Hmmm, I hardley omne to be able to comment on this, but I suspect that a 'comitted couple' are maybe perceived as less of a risk from a safe sex issue than those who have just FB's, after all, a FB is more likely to have fun as a single as well as a couple, with all the risks associated, especially if they have been around a while....
Remember all those scarey ads during the 80's re Aids, plus almost monthly report re STDs on the increase....they will have an affect on a lot of people, especially those at a tender age growing up when AIDs was THE news.
Like I say - hardely in a position to comment (although am looking for a regular FB myslef!) - just my randon ramblings. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Ive seen profiles like that and a couple we know wont meet fuck buds they says its because they are looking for couples who are commited to each other,no problems in the relationship no issues. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I'm single and I can fully understand where married couples are coming from.
A commited couple are inviting others into their relationship. Therefore the need to ensure playmates have the same to "lose".
After playing couples go home together, fuck buddies don't!
If I were in a couple I wouldn't play with fuck buddies either to be honest. |
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"I'm single and I can fully understand where married couples are coming from.
A commited couple are inviting others into their relationship. Therefore the need to ensure playmates have the same to "lose".
After playing couples go home together, fuck buddies don't!
If I were in a couple I wouldn't play with fuck buddies either to be honest."
i dont understand this, maybe its cos its late and i m tired
why should it be about them having anything to lose? and why should it matter if a couple goes home together or not?
surely with fuck buddies etc there is less chance of one of them getting cold feet or feeling uncomfortable with soeone playing with their partner etc |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Its also about the fact that usually but not always ,a couple who are married or in a long term relationship are both in unison when it comes to going for this ,but ,we have found that all too often fuck buddies want different thnigs and tend to say one thnig and the other says another and then they even start arguing and have broken up at least once when we spoke to them. doesent put us off totally but made us more aware and to a point ,wary too. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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When we first joined a site like this one all them years ago I asked a couple why they would not meet fuck buddies, and was told something very similar to what sassymissuk said.
I asked why again cos Im thick and didnt understand what the difference was.
I was told couples in a relationship (be that living together married or just serious dating) had more trust then a couple of singles who have decided to play as a couple. I said what if like me they trust everyone until that trust is broken (yes I know Im an overly simple soul lol) and was told that 2 singles are often seen as a bloke who is using a woman to get to the couples who dont want to meet single men.
I have also been told that fuck buddy couples dont have the same level of understanding between themselves as a couple who are in a serious relationship, the knowing when one is unhappy or happy to continue, knowing what makes the other tick.
I have never met with a couple who are fuck buddies and rarely meet couples, so I cant say if what I was told is true or just that couples way of explaining how they felt.
Shona
x x x |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I'm single and I can fully understand where married couples are coming from.
A commited couple are inviting others into their relationship. Therefore the need to ensure playmates have the same to "lose".
After playing couples go home together, fuck buddies don't!
If I were in a couple I wouldn't play with fuck buddies either to be honest.
i dont understand this, maybe its cos its late and i m tired
why should it be about them having anything to lose? and why should it matter if a couple goes home together or not?
surely with fuck buddies etc there is less chance of one of them getting cold feet or feeling uncomfortable with soeone playing with their partner etc"
I think you may be missing the point slightly.
Let's put it another way, you raised the thread why do you think couples only want to play with other couples? Why do some couples think single people shouldn't be on swinging sites?
Many have said, because singles can't share and have noting to lose.
I don't think it's about people turning up as they always have each other.
Some couples only soft swing, some people want "equal" playmates.
I'm probably waffling now as it is late, but it's the dynamics of all participants that's important to some and I respect that. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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i like couples,,,,,i like playmates,,,but,,which is the real best?
only 1 way to find out:
FIGHT!!!!!!  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I'm single and I can fully understand where married couples are coming from.
A commited couple are inviting others into their relationship. Therefore the need to ensure playmates have the same to "lose".
After playing couples go home together, fuck buddies don't!
If I were in a couple I wouldn't play with fuck buddies either to be honest.
i dont understand this, maybe its cos its late and i m tired
why should it be about them having anything to lose? and why should it matter if a couple goes home together or not?
surely with fuck buddies etc there is less chance of one of them getting cold feet or feeling uncomfortable with soeone playing with their partner etc
I think you may be missing the point slightly.
Let's put it another way, you raised the thread why do you think couples only want to play with other couples? Why do some couples think single people shouldn't be on swinging sites?
Many have said, because singles can't share and have noting to lose.
I don't think it's about people turning up as they always have each other.
Some couples only soft swing, some people want "equal" playmates.
I'm probably waffling now as it is late, but it's the dynamics of all participants that's important to some and I respect that. "
Not only that but some of us prefer a real couple not a married man/woman cheating on their partners, less chance of being dragged into something when all one wants is fun |
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By *ugby 123Couple
over a year ago
Forum Mod O o O oo |
"I'm single and I can fully understand where married couples are coming from.
A commited couple are inviting others into their relationship. Therefore the need to ensure playmates have the same to "lose".
After playing couples go home together, fuck buddies don't!
If I were in a couple I wouldn't play with fuck buddies either to be honest.
i dont understand this, maybe its cos its late and i m tired
why should it be about them having anything to lose? and why should it matter if a couple goes home together or not?
surely with fuck buddies etc there is less chance of one of them getting cold feet or feeling uncomfortable with soeone playing with their partner etc"
I don't think you are right by saying FB's are less likely to get cold feet or be uncomfortable watching their partner with someone else...........I am asumming it is the same for all attached couples........if they were uncomfortable watching their partner with someone else they wouldn't be swinging.
We have met a man who said he only plays with attached couples, as he loves to watch the interaction between the couple who he is playing with. |
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We've had contacts from FB couples who live in different towns many miles apart. That makes it more likely they won't turn up as a couple. "Sorry, she couldn't make it, it's just me" No thanks, been there already. |
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Reading through this thread makes me wonder why anyone would need to know? Ok so we play with singles and or couples so if one of the FB’s didn’t turn up it wouldn’t really matter. Certainly we’ve met married couples who were essentially FB’s inasmuch that they didn’t have that ‘as one’ thing that long-term couples can have. But you could make an endless list of ‘possible’ pitfalls with single, married couples, un-married couples or FB’s.
Suppose the FB’s both happen to have a good helping of sexual skills, such as the ability to read body language, people skills, time served knowledge and understanding etc. they may well be better than some married couples.
If we meet a single or a couple and we hit it off that’s fine. If then we all hit it off in the bedroom that’s fine too. I don’t think that a couples relationship to each other is any of our business, either it works for the four of us or it doesn’t.
Might be an advantage… ever met a couple and only liked one of them?
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the only issue for me is that all parties involved know whats going on .... with a live together/married couple it goes without saying. With a FB couple ( for want of a better term ) t hen it takes a bit more asking , and honesty, to determine if those involved are single or playing with/without the knowledge of a different partner.
Ive played with both and not knowingly played with anyone cheating on an unsuspecting partner with a FB .
aside from this as long as both people are enjoying the experience and each other, as well as me, then I dont mind if they are "together" or not |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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it doesn't matter to us if a "couple" are committed to each other, or are fuck buddies. In fact we say on our profile that we are happy to meet singles who can pair up to keep us both happy.
Many people have "issues", even couples with lists of rules that read like War and Peace. We are here to enjoy discreet sexy fun, and as long as we are all happy with how we look, how we get on, then thats good enough for us.
Fookin 'ell, some peoples social meets must be like an interview, lol  |
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I guess all pre-sex-play meetings are ‘interviews’ after all everyone is there to decide if everyone else meets their criteria whatever that may be.
One thread subject I’ve not seen of this site but we have on others raises the question as to if both halves of a couple are fully consenting in terms of ‘free will’ or is one or other being dragged kicking and screaming. This sort of discussion leads to another question, ever felt you wanted to take one or other half of a couple to one side and ask, “Are you REALLY up for this or doing it to please him/her?” I guess if a ‘couple’ are self-confessed FB’s then that question is totally irrelevant.
I’d agree that there is twice as much risk/work checking out if the FB’s are not cheating on someone else so just treat them as two singles. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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We swapped a few messages with what we thought were a couple. Then we found out that they both had singles profiles as well as a couples profile, no problem there you might think. The problem was they were both married, just not to each other and were using the FB scenario to both get what they want with others.
We're not ones to get all judgemental but that is not what we are here for I'm afraid. We prefer proper couples who are in a relationship for many of the reasons noted above. xxx |
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im the same as sirens . prefer actual cpls as you know what the full situation is then . no one cheating on anybody so no one being hurt . im certainly not saying all fbs are marrieds playing away from home, but there are afew . id rather not be put in that situation so easiest way to avoid is to stick with long term cpls . also theres the aspect of the partners changing .im sorry but i dont see fbs as a long term situation and have spoken to quite afew where women has then decided just to meet on her own or theyve split for what ever reason . so then either one or both are then teaming up with another partner!.so no garentees youd click with the new fb. plus from sexual health point of view have to thought about to.
finnal aspect for me is just the commonsense aspect of its easier organising meet with a cpl rather than basically 2 separte inderviduals .
this is just my own preference and point of view though |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I'm single and I can fully understand where married couples are coming from.
A committed couple are inviting others into their relationship. Therefore the need to ensure playmates have the same to "lose".
After playing couples go home together, fuck buddies don't!
If I were in a couple I wouldn't play with fuck buddies either to be honest."
That's how it is with us.
When your sharing the most important person in your life,you expect the same commitment from the people your sharing with.
Not just some one who's teamed up to increase their chances of a shag.
Also,as has been mentioned earlier,we don't have the same trust for the single guys that make up a fuck buddy couple.
Just check out how many "straight" single guys are on the verification list of gay guys/T.V's.
Plus,the same can be said of bare-back couples or "cum sluts",how many straight guys who say the have safe sex are on their lists?
Thanks but no thanks!
XXXX |
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By *umourCouple
over a year ago
Northants |
Us too.. Committed couples only! We did try a FB couples but never got further than the social because after we decided we would meet for playtime, I (Mr R) started to get texts from the guy who obviously thought it was Mrs R's phone! He was telling me that he could meet on his own and would be very discreet!
Other texts were what he would like to do and how he would book a room somewhere as he travelled on business a lot! Disapeared from MSN when I tackled him about it!
Needless to say we told the "other half" but she said "we aint a couple, he can do what he likes"
Decided there and then, committed couples only! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Recently set up a couples profile with a playmate of mine to find other couples/females for fun but have come accross a number of profiles stating that they only want to meet committed couples, not playmates/fuck buddies/friends with benefits etc
what is the difference between playing with a couple or 2 people that are just friends??
now, i am a firm believer of each to their own etc and this is BY NO MEANS a whingng thread - more a quest to become more educated in the ways of swinging "
Yes there is a difference as a committed couple live together and have stronger emotional bonds. This makes a difference with some couples when swinging as they want parity in the way they share things not a couple of convenience to get into knickers and pants.
With other couples it doesn't matter as they are after a different experience. Each to their own is the best way to look at it and if your not the type of couple they are after then move onto a couple that will appreciate you. |
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I'm not a fan of meeting 'arrangement' couples and prefer real life couples.
It's not always the case... but... fuck-buddies sometimes want the chance to fuck their fuck-buddie (they may not have met up for a week or two) and so I have found some of the female halves want to make sure they are getting the same share as if they were meeting their buddy for 1-2-1. |
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We wont meet fuck buddies because we feel that they do not feel the same way about their patners as a long term/married couple would feel, and they therefore do not have the same feelings towards swinging.
In my opinion married/long term couples have a better understanding of what is going to happen when they meet someone. They know one anothers rules, and they no that no matter what they are gonna go home together after a meet and go to bed together and etc!
However fuck buddies just don't have that emotional connection! The guy is after more women (or guys lol) and the women is after more men and maybe some women! Where as for a truely attached ouple there is more too it than this. We personally enjoy watching our partner with another person more so than playing with another person ourselves! Obviously we enjoy playing a lot too or we wouldn't do it.
Anyway FB's just don't have the same understanding of one anothers needs and wants as a married/long term couple would have! Also FB relationship are not as secure in the way that i know next time i mail a couple they are gonna be the same people i met last time.
Where as with a FB couple.... how can i be sure they don't have a little black book with 20 FB's in, and for me as a bi sexual woman. I wouldn't want to play intimately with a female who i can't be sure doesn't have more fuck buddies, or who i can't be sure hasn't being playing safe!
End of the day it's personal opinion but that's how we see it, and we will never play with fuck buddies! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"We wont meet fuck buddies because we feel that they do not feel the same way about their patners as a long term/married couple would feel, and they therefore do not have the same feelings towards swinging.
In my opinion married/long term couples have a better understanding of what is going to happen when they meet someone. They know one anothers rules, and they no that no matter what they are gonna go home together after a meet and go to bed together and etc!
However fuck buddies just don't have that emotional connection! The guy is after more women (or guys lol) and the women is after more men and maybe some women! Where as for a truely attached ouple there is more too it than this. We personally enjoy watching our partner with another person more so than playing with another person ourselves! Obviously we enjoy playing a lot too or we wouldn't do it.
Anyway FB's just don't have the same understanding of one anothers needs and wants as a married/long term couple would have! Also FB relationship are not as secure in the way that i know next time i mail a couple they are gonna be the same people i met last time.
Where as with a FB couple.... how can i be sure they don't have a little black book with 20 FB's in, and for me as a bi sexual woman. I wouldn't want to play intimately with a female who i can't be sure doesn't have more fuck buddies, or who i can't be sure hasn't being playing safe!
End of the day it's personal opinion but that's how we see it, and we will never play with fuck buddies! "
Good post and also goes to show that some of the young folk on here can have a very mature outlook.
Nice one!
XXXX |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"We wont meet fuck buddies because we feel that they do not feel the same way about their patners as a long term/married couple would feel, and they therefore do not have the same feelings towards swinging.
In my opinion married/long term couples have a better understanding of what is going to happen when they meet someone. They know one anothers rules, and they no that no matter what they are gonna go home together after a meet and go to bed together and etc!
However fuck buddies just don't have that emotional connection! The guy is after more women (or guys lol) and the women is after more men and maybe some women! Where as for a truely attached ouple there is more too it than this. We personally enjoy watching our partner with another person more so than playing with another person ourselves! Obviously we enjoy playing a lot too or we wouldn't do it.
Anyway FB's just don't have the same understanding of one anothers needs and wants as a married/long term couple would have! Also FB relationship are not as secure in the way that i know next time i mail a couple they are gonna be the same people i met last time.
Where as with a FB couple.... how can i be sure they don't have a little black book with 20 FB's in, and for me as a bi sexual woman. I wouldn't want to play intimately with a female who i can't be sure doesn't have more fuck buddies, or who i can't be sure hasn't being playing safe!
End of the day it's personal opinion but that's how we see it, and we will never play with fuck buddies!
Good post and also goes to show that some of the young folk on here can have a very mature outlook.
Nice one!
XXXX"
My sentiments exactly: excellent post, mirrors my view too! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"We wont meet fuck buddies because we feel that they do not feel the same way about their patners as a long term/married couple would feel, and they therefore do not have the same feelings towards swinging.
In my opinion married/long term couples have a better understanding of what is going to happen when they meet someone. They know one anothers rules, and they no that no matter what they are gonna go home together after a meet and go to bed together and etc!
However fuck buddies just don't have that emotional connection! The guy is after more women (or guys lol) and the women is after more men and maybe some women! Where as for a truely attached ouple there is more too it than this. We personally enjoy watching our partner with another person more so than playing with another person ourselves! Obviously we enjoy playing a lot too or we wouldn't do it.
Anyway FB's just don't have the same understanding of one anothers needs and wants as a married/long term couple would have! Also FB relationship are not as secure in the way that i know next time i mail a couple they are gonna be the same people i met last time.
Where as with a FB couple.... how can i be sure they don't have a little black book with 20 FB's in, and for me as a bi sexual woman. I wouldn't want to play intimately with a female who i can't be sure doesn't have more fuck buddies, or who i can't be sure hasn't being playing safe!
End of the day it's personal opinion but that's how we see it, and we will never play with fuck buddies! "
Thats pretty much how we feel about things. Its just what your comfortable with. |
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we've seen peeps post that too and cant understand it - provided they both turn up [as in not a guy pretending he has a woman to bring] then we're happy ..
biggest problem is doing the old verify by Phone or Webcam before hand as often "they" live far apart  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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we've only recently started playing with couples and have played with both a committed cpl and fb's (altho to be fair they were honest about the fact). altho both experiences were great the first was amazing and i as a woman felt more relaxed and comfortable as i felt there was more trust from me towards the other couple that they wouldn't try anything that would make me feel uncomfortable or let emotions other than a deep and intimate friendship get in the way or threaten either relationship! does that make sense?
altho the fb cpl had been together for sometime and no longer played without the other i found myself worrying more about ova stepping the mark as it was their 1st meet with another cpl and if i'm truely honest i felt a lot more insecure! this said we would still play with the couple again as the more time u spend with someone the more trust u have and in turn the less insecurities arise.
personally i still wouldn't be comfortable playing with random fb's our situation was slightly different as we had the chance to get to know them a bit first and as i said they don't play seperately anymore. |
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By *ouvakMan
over a year ago
clacton on sea |
reading this thread has been interesting to say the least,the one issue i have with the whole thread is that respect and trust are key issues in any relationship, be it a committed couple a married couple or FB couple.
In all case's the partnership has been built on mutual trust and respect for each other.
These issues are part and parcel of any relationship and therefore carry through to friendships also, so I'm thinking here that many couples see a friendship as less than that of a relationship ?
If that's the case how on earth do you justify being friends with a couple you meet and have sexual fun with because that friendship isn't based upon those key points your so diligently extolling here in the thread,because your saying trust and respect is a major element to you, and it is also a major element for those who take a fuck bubby too.
Sad as it seems there does seem to be a small amount of double standards here in this thread |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"reading this thread has been interesting to say the least,the one issue i have with the whole thread is that respect and trust are key issues in any relationship, be it a committed couple a married couple or FB couple.
In all case's the partnership has been built on mutual trust and respect for each other.
These issues are part and parcel of any relationship and therefore carry through to friendships also, so I'm thinking here that many couples see a friendship as less than that of a relationship ?
If that's the case how on earth do you justify being friends with a couple you meet and have sexual fun with because that friendship isn't based upon those key points your so diligently extolling here in the thread,because your saying trust and respect is a major element to you, and it is also a major element for those who take a fuck bubby too.
Sad as it seems there does seem to be a small amount of double standards here in this thread"
i agree that friendships are based on trust and respect too but sadly with most of the fb's we've spoken too there's been a distinct lack of both between the cpl's and more often than not they rarely bother with each other outside of meets other than a quick call or message here and there asking if the other is up for a meet today, in my opinion it would have to be extremely difficult to build up any kind of mutual trust and respect in that kinda situation (i am talking from personal experience as have formerly been in a so called fb relationship!)don't get me wrong i'm by no means saying it can't work for fb's just that in most cases it doesn't seem to!
if it works for them then thats great but it's a choice us as committed couples are entitled to make as they are entitled to decide what works for them! |
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By *ouvakMan
over a year ago
clacton on sea |
"reading this thread has been interesting to say the least,the one issue i have with the whole thread is that respect and trust are key issues in any relationship, be it a committed couple a married couple or FB couple.
In all case's the partnership has been built on mutual trust and respect for each other.
These issues are part and parcel of any relationship and therefore carry through to friendships also, so I'm thinking here that many couples see a friendship as less than that of a relationship ?
If that's the case how on earth do you justify being friends with a couple you meet and have sexual fun with because that friendship isn't based upon those key points your so diligently extolling here in the thread,because your saying trust and respect is a major element to you, and it is also a major element for those who take a fuck bubby too.
Sad as it seems there does seem to be a small amount of double standards here in this thread
i agree that friendships are based on trust and respect too but sadly with most of the fb's we've spoken too there's been a distinct lack of both between the cpl's and more often than not they rarely bother with each other outside of meets other than a quick call or message here and there asking if the other is up for a meet today, in my opinion it would have to be extremely difficult to build up any kind of mutual trust and respect in that kinda situation (i am talking from personal experience as have formerly been in a so called fb relationship!)don't get me wrong i'm by no means saying it can't work for fb's just that in most cases it doesn't seem to!
if it works for them then thats great but it's a choice us as committed couples are entitled to make as they are entitled to decide what works for them!"
i know of a few "committed couples" who have little or no respect for their partners, but under your guidelines they would be more likely to get to play than the said "fuckbubbie's" , my point being is that even a committed couple can and do have one or the other who is not as respectful as you might like them to be,but hey it's a funny world we live in and if we all liked the same thing then there'd be nothing to complain about would there because we would all be fucking each other silly all the time
and yes that was very very tongue in cheek |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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ur totally right that u can find the same problem with committed couples but we seem to come across it less often and we would be inclined to give those couples that have no respect for each other or trust just as much of a wide berth as we would a fb cpl! we still give fb cpl's a chance but have only clicked with one cpl enough to meet and like i said wasn't as relaxed but not a bad experience!
and thanks but i wasn't complaining i was stating an opinion and drawing on my experiences in a topical discussion as were u! |
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no one is being harmed by couples not wanting to meet FB couples at the end of the day. Its personal choice. In my opinion i feel that our reasons for making the choice not to meet FB couples is a fantastic one.
I won't give FB couples a chance either to see if we click on msn! As most FB couples want you to be available at a certain time when they know their play partner will be around. It's all just messing about! We will happily meet them as seperate people but we couldn't meet them both together! Weird i know but it's our choice.
Fuck buddys are just fuck buddys at the end of the day. Most aren't close friends. They are just horny people who were lucky enough to find each other to use whenever they need a quick fuck!  |
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By *umourCouple
over a year ago
Northants |
Just to illustrate the point, we have been trying to meet a single fem for a while and one seems interested, but as soon as we start chatting, loads of single guys are pvt messaging her to get a meet as a foursome!
That is NOT what we want and we will refuse to meet another couple not as committed as we are. Quite frankly we don't care about single guys bleeting about "double standards" There are none! We do not think that FB couples have the same commitment as we do and as I said earlier in the thread, all sorts of nasties can come out of it! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"no one is being harmed by couples not wanting to meet FB couples at the end of the day. Its personal choice. In my opinion i feel that our reasons for making the choice not to meet FB couples is a fantastic one.
I won't give FB couples a chance either to see if we click on msn! As most FB couples want you to be available at a certain time when they know their play partner will be around. It's all just messing about! We will happily meet them as seperate people but we couldn't meet them both together! Weird i know but it's our choice.
Fuck buddys are just fuck buddys at the end of the day. Most aren't close friends. They are just horny people who were lucky enough to find each other to use whenever they need a quick fuck! "
We come to a similar conclusion. Nothing personal but FB's are just not for us. |
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thanks for the input and i can definately see the point for comitted couples being more commited to each other and more intune to how the other wants to play etc
however i can also see the arguement that fb's would perhaps have less hang ups about their 'partner' being with other people.
like i said before it was not a whinge, just a chance to get some views
i am sure that someone out there will gie us a chance to prove that although we are just friends and dont live together etc we are genuine and lots of fun  |
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By *ouvakMan
over a year ago
clacton on sea |
I might be out of place in what I'm about to say but I think it's a valid point in this thread.
At the end of the day aren't all swingers by the very nature of what they do no more than " fuck bubbies" be them couples meeting couples or singles meeting singles and FBs meeting couples or singles, we are after all meeting people from the site with one common aim to enjoy the pleasure's we can all bring to each other.
So married, single or otherwise at the end of the day we all become a fuck bubby to someone.
Just a twist on the views all have displayed here |
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"Why not join up with other fbs there are a few on here."
good idea lol maybe fab could put that as one of the options when setting up a profile
single man
single woman
couple mf
couple ff
couple mm
fb mf
fb ff
fb mm
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