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Armchair statisticians and trigger-bait threads
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
Is it just me who has found that over the last week, a lot of forum threads seem to be taking statistics and merging them with highly emotive history.
Or opining views that are essentialy online trolling.
Has fabs forums got one too many daily-mail style armchair experts? |
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I posted stats on the Boris/Hitler thread so perhaps I'm guilty but they were from verifiable and reputable sources FT and BBC..
And in response to someone saying average UK deaths for last year were at a number which was patently wrong upon which they were downplaying the covid death figures..
Agree that there's been a lot of stuff in the earlier part of this pandemic which was from the web and was directly intent on bolstering the various conspiracies about then ..
Anyway what is it they say about stats? |
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"Is it just me who has found that over the last week, a lot of forum threads seem to be taking statistics and merging them with highly emotive history.
Or opining views that are essentialy online trolling.
Has fabs forums got one too many daily-mail style armchair experts?"
I tend to call them The Guardian armchair experts... |
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It makes you question whether people are that bothered about the tragic events and more interested in pushing their own agenda time after time.
Usually when you see a back and forth of Boris Corbyn Abbott and Mogg with a liberal sprinkling of Gmnt you realise what the thread is really about. |
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"I posted stats on the Boris/Hitler thread so perhaps I'm guilty but they were from verifiable and reputable sources FT and BBC..
And in response to someone saying average UK deaths for last year were at a number which was patently wrong upon which they were downplaying the covid death figures..
Agree that there's been a lot of stuff in the earlier part of this pandemic which was from the web and was directly intent on bolstering the various conspiracies about then ..
Anyway what is it they say about stats? "
I'm not sure about the fora at all any more. They mostly make me upset and reflective and I'm guessing I need to step away for a break or permanently. I don't do any other social media so have no idea how this compares with other spaces but just don't think it adds any value any more. There have been some good debates and I've learned things from them but they now seem to be places where the usual suspects come (I'm one of them) and kick the dirt.
The tories are shit
Boris is a bastard
We are a communist state
We are a Totalitarian state
Save the old / let them burn
People stop breaking rules
Numbers are scarey
Vaccine is poison
Schools out / schools in
Why didn't we...
Why did we...
Lock down/ freedom
And so on...
I think I've just argued myself out! |
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"Is it just me who has found that over the last week, a lot of forum threads seem to be taking statistics and merging them with highly emotive history.
Or opining views that are essentialy online trolling.
Has fabs forums got one too many daily-mail style armchair experts?"
If you watch most of the main news sources they are taking statistics and merging them with highly emotive stories. There seems to be very little to balance it. It's no wonder to me that people are possessed by gloom and despondency.
It's not a comparison I generally favour but amongst all the WW2 propaganda there was at least an optimistic note. |
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By *amillMan
over a year ago
Warrington |
I honestly think that the virus section on the forums causes more arguments and toxicity on here. It’s depressing enough seeing the news and having it forced to you all on social media every day.
I wish there was a way I could hide this forum part from showing up on my list because everyone is frustrated and sick of this by now. We just need to do our bit and get through it, arguing with each other what’s right or wrong isn’t solving any problems and is only creating greater divides between us all. |
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"I honestly think that the virus section on the forums causes more arguments and toxicity on here. It’s depressing enough seeing the news and having it forced to you all on social media every day.
I wish there was a way I could hide this forum part from showing up on my list because everyone is frustrated and sick of this by now. We just need to do our bit and get through it, arguing with each other what’s right or wrong isn’t solving any problems and is only creating greater divides between us all."
You can't hide it. I know it's difficult, trust me I promise myself every day not to look, but if it's seriously having a negative effect on you avoid it.  |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
Thanks to everyone who has responded so far.
I guess my point was that the press is designed to be emotive, without sensationalising stories no one would ever be drawn in.
As society however do we not have a responsibility to see past it, to try and focus more on what unites us as people.
The Hitler and Boris post got me thinking and I saw similarities emerging akin to the growing fear and division in America.
I am by no means a Boris fan or a conservative, yet I do find posts likening him to Hitler horrible. It is easy to sit here and criticise, yet would you want to be prime minister? Would you want to be making these decisions?
I feel as though Boris is akin to George W Bush, not well equipped to do the job, yet not a vindictive person, whereas I felt Trump and Hitler shared more similarities in that they were both vindictive authoritarians.
I mainly posted this because I wanted to draw attention that forum posts like yesterdays “NHS should use better looking people in their adverts” and todays “Boris is Hitler 2.0” quite simply avoids the point of where we are...
The current war shouldn’t be liberals v conservatives, rich v poor or us v them...
The only war that matters right now is
Us v the virus
 |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Thanks to everyone who has responded so far.
I guess my point was that the press is designed to be emotive, without sensationalising stories no one would ever be drawn in.
As society however do we not have a responsibility to see past it, to try and focus more on what unites us as people.
The Hitler and Boris post got me thinking and I saw similarities emerging akin to the growing fear and division in America.
I am by no means a Boris fan or a conservative, yet I do find posts likening him to Hitler horrible. It is easy to sit here and criticise, yet would you want to be prime minister? Would you want to be making these decisions?
I feel as though Boris is akin to George W Bush, not well equipped to do the job, yet not a vindictive person, whereas I felt Trump and Hitler shared more similarities in that they were both vindictive authoritarians.
I mainly posted this because I wanted to draw attention that forum posts like yesterdays “NHS should use better looking people in their adverts” and todays “Boris is Hitler 2.0” quite simply avoids the point of where we are...
The current war shouldn’t be liberals v conservatives, rich v poor or us v them...
The only war that matters right now is
Us v the virus
"
The only war should be inside those who are deliberately making the wrong choice and trying to find vindication on forums for not helping to contain the virus.
I wish fab would have a little virus icon we could place against profiles. Would really help after this have passed to some normally. Till then, my hotlist has a very new meaning. |
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"Thanks to everyone who has responded so far.
I guess my point was that the press is designed to be emotive, without sensationalising stories no one would ever be drawn in.
As society however do we not have a responsibility to see past it, to try and focus more on what unites us as people.
The Hitler and Boris post got me thinking and I saw similarities emerging akin to the growing fear and division in America.
I am by no means a Boris fan or a conservative, yet I do find posts likening him to Hitler horrible. It is easy to sit here and criticise, yet would you want to be prime minister? Would you want to be making these decisions?
I feel as though Boris is akin to George W Bush, not well equipped to do the job, yet not a vindictive person, whereas I felt Trump and Hitler shared more similarities in that they were both vindictive authoritarians.
I mainly posted this because I wanted to draw attention that forum posts like yesterdays “NHS should use better looking people in their adverts” and todays “Boris is Hitler 2.0” quite simply avoids the point of where we are...
The current war shouldn’t be liberals v conservatives, rich v poor or us v them...
The only war that matters right now is
Us v the virus
"
Amen to that. As I've said once or twice. Stronger together. |
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By *host63Man
over a year ago
Bedfont Feltham |
"It makes you question whether people are that bothered about the tragic events and more interested in pushing their own agenda time after time.
Usually when you see a back and forth of Boris Corbyn Abbott and Mogg with a liberal sprinkling of Gmnt you realise what the thread is really about. "
I go dancing and I had to stop going on the partner dancing threads.
There are so many hoax theories or posts saying we should carry on as normal because they want to carry in dancing no.matter what.
Selfish and sad |
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By *atEvolutionCouple
over a year ago
atlantisEVOLUTION Swingers Club. Stoke. |
Absolutely. The ones with good news in them don't really get much attention or discussion.
The ones where they can slag off something or somebody are the ones they love.
On the politics board if you post something someone doesn't agree with you are obviously a Remainer or a Brexiteer.
It really has brought us all together hasn't it. Or perhaps this is just who we were to start with. |
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"Absolutely. The ones with good news in them don't really get much attention or discussion.
The ones where they can slag off something or somebody are the ones they love.
On the politics board if you post something someone doesn't agree with you are obviously a Remainer or a Brexiteer.
It really has brought us all together hasn't it. Or perhaps this is just who we were to start with."
I personally think there is a much deeper issue here, once we get past the covid virus, which can be addressed if we have an appetite and some leadership of it. I think this has highlighted how poorly educated, how entitled, how we expect perfect answers in perfect time, our lack of resilience and care, our inability to look beyond the here and now for me and mine, our lack of courage, there is an element of truth in those who would make the comment "cowering behind your settees" not cowering from the virus though, but of the need for change and the lack of ability or will so to do.
Pressure and fear make people do things they would not normally, but I hope each of us can take one or two lessons from this and when we are through it, come back better, give a little more and take a little less. |
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"I honestly think that the virus section on the forums causes more arguments and toxicity on here. It’s depressing enough seeing the news and having it forced to you all on social media every day.
I wish there was a way I could hide this forum part from showing up on my list because everyone is frustrated and sick of this by now. We just need to do our bit and get through it, arguing with each other what’s right or wrong isn’t solving any problems and is only creating greater divides between us all."
Don't click on it then, problem solved  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
I think they are mostly posting statistics they have read and not making them up themselves. They are allowed to do so, as that's what forums are for discussing things x
|
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
"I think they are mostly posting statistics they have read and not making them up themselves. They are allowed to do so, as that's what forums are for discussing things x
"
Oh I dont doubt the statistic, I doubt the judgement of using statistics to bend to your view. Especially when that view is divisive at a time of heightened tensions.
One thing I have learnt is-
“A fool knows nothing yet constantly speaks, a wiseman knows everything yet says nothing” |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"I think they are mostly posting statistics they have read and not making them up themselves. They are allowed to do so, as that's what forums are for discussing things x
Oh I dont doubt the statistic, I doubt the judgement of using statistics to bend to your view. Especially when that view is divisive at a time of heightened tensions.
One thing I have learnt is-
“A fool knows nothing yet constantly speaks, a wiseman knows everything yet says nothing”"
I largely agree with your judgement of using statistics. I've been using some myself, more to point out how statistics can be bent to suit.
I'll take some blame for that.  |
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"I posted stats on the Boris/Hitler thread so perhaps I'm guilty but they were from verifiable and reputable sources FT and BBC..
And in response to someone saying average UK deaths for last year were at a number which was patently wrong upon which they were downplaying the covid death figures..
Agree that there's been a lot of stuff in the earlier part of this pandemic which was from the web and was directly intent on bolstering the various conspiracies about then ..
Anyway what is it they say about stats?
I'm not sure about the fora at all any more. They mostly make me upset and reflective and I'm guessing I need to step away for a break or permanently. I don't do any other social media so have no idea how this compares with other spaces but just don't think it adds any value any more. There have been some good debates and I've learned things from them but they now seem to be places where the usual suspects come (I'm one of them) and kick the dirt.
The tories are shit
Boris is a bastard
We are a communist state
We are a Totalitarian state
Save the old / let them burn
People stop breaking rules
Numbers are scarey
Vaccine is poison
Schools out / schools in
Why didn't we...
Why did we...
Lock down/ freedom
And so on...
I think I've just argued myself out! "
I can relate to the tone you've picked up on and agree with learning from those with knowledge and experience on this..
I think there's a general anxiety with the uncertainty we have all been in and it's only going to continue, fear too to a lesser or greater degree is part of that depending on individual circumstances..
At times these forums can be an amazing support but there's a downside to that also,fair play in recognising that ..  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Absolutely. The ones with good news in them don't really get much attention or discussion.
The ones where they can slag off something or somebody are the ones they love.
On the politics board if you post something someone doesn't agree with you are obviously a Remainer or a Brexiteer.
It really has brought us all together hasn't it. Or perhaps this is just who we were to start with.
I personally think there is a much deeper issue here, once we get past the covid virus, which can be addressed if we have an appetite and some leadership of it. I think this has highlighted how poorly educated, how entitled, how we expect perfect answers in perfect time, our lack of resilience and care, our inability to look beyond the here and now for me and mine, our lack of courage, there is an element of truth in those who would make the comment "cowering behind your settees" not cowering from the virus though, but of the need for change and the lack of ability or will so to do.
Pressure and fear make people do things they would not normally, but I hope each of us can take one or two lessons from this and when we are through it, come back better, give a little more and take a little less. "
I think the issues you have raised are what will change swinging from what it was and not the virus at all. It's high lighted attitudes, intentions, attitudes in people which were kept under wraps before the pandemic frustrations caused cracks in their guarded nature. I don't think many understand how they are viewed and will continue to be viewed afterwards. |
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By *rman82Man
over a year ago
Manchester |
What’s the definition of an armchair statistician? That rhyme was completely unintentional.
I am intrigued to know though? Some people search out stats for themselves, others rely on the main stream media to provide them for them, who is right and who is wrong? Personally I don’t think you can disregard people that have a different point of view than yourself. If they are producing ‘armchair stats’ that point to a credible source, does this make them unreliable? Just because it doesn’t quite fit the narrative given by the mainstream media. One thing I’ve noticed is that if you don’t agree with the measures being taken by the government and speak up against them you are instantly labelled a tin foil that wearing conspiracy theorist. If you look back through time it’s only because of brave people that challenge the narrative and try to make change that we have learned from our mistakes and made the change for the better. For me the best approach is to listen to others accept their opinion and make your own mind up. Unfortunately it appears debate has been totally lost with regards to this virus and too many people with a valid point of view are labelled a ‘armchair statistician’. |
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"What’s the definition of an armchair statistician? That rhyme was completely unintentional.
I am intrigued to know though? Some people search out stats for themselves, others rely on the main stream media to provide them for them, who is right and who is wrong? Personally I don’t think you can disregard people that have a different point of view than yourself. If they are producing ‘armchair stats’ that point to a credible source, does this make them unreliable? Just because it doesn’t quite fit the narrative given by the mainstream media. One thing I’ve noticed is that if you don’t agree with the measures being taken by the government and speak up against them you are instantly labelled a tin foil that wearing conspiracy theorist. If you look back through time it’s only because of brave people that challenge the narrative and try to make change that we have learned from our mistakes and made the change for the better. For me the best approach is to listen to others accept their opinion and make your own mind up. Unfortunately it appears debate has been totally lost with regards to this virus and too many people with a valid point of view are labelled a ‘armchair statistician’."
Quote of the week and I for one am taking this as a huge compliment |
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By *rman82Man
over a year ago
Manchester |
"Some people definitely post things just to be controversial, in my opinion.
Sometimes it's interesting...othertimes it's just unpleasant "
Is ‘controversial’ anything that doesn’t fit the narrative though? I agree it’s not nice when it gets unpleasant but for some people, hearing stuff that doesn’t agree with them or the mainstream narrative is unpleasant but that doesn’t make it wrong... or make their point of view any less credible. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
"Some people definitely post things just to be controversial, in my opinion.
Sometimes it's interesting...othertimes it's just unpleasant
Is ‘controversial’ anything that doesn’t fit the narrative though? I agree it’s not nice when it gets unpleasant but for some people, hearing stuff that doesn’t agree with them or the mainstream narrative is unpleasant but that doesn’t make it wrong... or make their point of view any less credible. "
As I have mentioned before Boris is not Hitler 2.0 and there was a thread I read late last night about obesity where the person literally called them “chubsters and fattys” if you consider this controversial then you can’t be helped!
In my honest opinion this is just plain rude! |
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By *rman82Man
over a year ago
Manchester |
"Some people definitely post things just to be controversial, in my opinion.
Sometimes it's interesting...othertimes it's just unpleasant
Is ‘controversial’ anything that doesn’t fit the narrative though? I agree it’s not nice when it gets unpleasant but for some people, hearing stuff that doesn’t agree with them or the mainstream narrative is unpleasant but that doesn’t make it wrong... or make their point of view any less credible.
As I have mentioned before Boris is not Hitler 2.0 and there was a thread I read late last night about obesity where the person literally called them “chubsters and fattys” if you consider this controversial then you can’t be helped!
In my honest opinion this is just plain rude!"
Only time will tell what Boris is.
I agree that is super rude, I wasn’t talking about offensive name calling, mainly referring to people that have a different point of view on things and that point of view being disregarded because it doesn’t fit the MSM narrative |
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By *D835Man
over a year ago
London |
"I think they are mostly posting statistics they have read and not making them up themselves. They are allowed to do so, as that's what forums are for discussing things x
Oh I dont doubt the statistic, I doubt the judgement of using statistics to bend to your view. Especially when that view is divisive at a time of heightened tensions.
One thing I have learnt is-
“A fool knows nothing yet constantly speaks, a wiseman knows everything yet says nothing”"
|
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There are some people who consider any opinion or narrative that does not match their own as either hate speech or trolling when it's either an alternative view or a differing point of view. These people cannot be helped.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Some people definitely post things just to be controversial, in my opinion.
Sometimes it's interesting...othertimes it's just unpleasant
Is ‘controversial’ anything that doesn’t fit the narrative though? I agree it’s not nice when it gets unpleasant but for some people, hearing stuff that doesn’t agree with them or the mainstream narrative is unpleasant but that doesn’t make it wrong... or make their point of view any less credible. "
Much of our language is being lost by dilution. Text speak has a lot to answer towards reprogramming our brains in what was learnt at a time.
Controversial has part understanding that the topic has an aspect of being very new/different, unsubstantiated or no longer accepted because evidence is that great against it as the nornal thinking within the group it has been raised (another group may not feel it's controversial in the same way). Debate or discussion tends simply to be of opposing accepted opinions/views.
This may also be open to debate.  |
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"Absolutely. The ones with good news in them don't really get much attention or discussion.
The ones where they can slag off something or somebody are the ones they love.
On the politics board if you post something someone doesn't agree with you are obviously a Remainer or a Brexiteer.
It really has brought us all together hasn't it. Or perhaps this is just who we were to start with.
I personally think there is a much deeper issue here, once we get past the covid virus, which can be addressed if we have an appetite and some leadership of it. I think this has highlighted how poorly educated, how entitled, how we expect perfect answers in perfect time, our lack of resilience and care, our inability to look beyond the here and now for me and mine, our lack of courage, there is an element of truth in those who would make the comment "cowering behind your settees" not cowering from the virus though, but of the need for change and the lack of ability or will so to do.
Pressure and fear make people do things they would not normally, but I hope each of us can take one or two lessons from this and when we are through it, come back better, give a little more and take a little less.
I think the issues you have raised are what will change swinging from what it was and not the virus at all. It's high lighted attitudes, intentions, attitudes in people which were kept under wraps before the pandemic frustrations caused cracks in their guarded nature. I don't think many understand how they are viewed and will continue to be viewed afterwards."
Plus some are fully aware of their character but don’t really care what anyone thinks, it is their way or no way. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
"Absolutely. The ones with good news in them don't really get much attention or discussion.
The ones where they can slag off something or somebody are the ones they love.
On the politics board if you post something someone doesn't agree with you are obviously a Remainer or a Brexiteer.
It really has brought us all together hasn't it. Or perhaps this is just who we were to start with.
I personally think there is a much deeper issue here, once we get past the covid virus, which can be addressed if we have an appetite and some leadership of it. I think this has highlighted how poorly educated, how entitled, how we expect perfect answers in perfect time, our lack of resilience and care, our inability to look beyond the here and now for me and mine, our lack of courage, there is an element of truth in those who would make the comment "cowering behind your settees" not cowering from the virus though, but of the need for change and the lack of ability or will so to do.
Pressure and fear make people do things they would not normally, but I hope each of us can take one or two lessons from this and when we are through it, come back better, give a little more and take a little less.
I think the issues you have raised are what will change swinging from what it was and not the virus at all. It's high lighted attitudes, intentions, attitudes in people which were kept under wraps before the pandemic frustrations caused cracks in their guarded nature. I don't think many understand how they are viewed and will continue to be viewed afterwards.
Plus some are fully aware of their character but don’t really care what anyone thinks, it is their way or no way. "
I mean I have made it clear that I don’t agree with brexit, but there are people who get so personal and abusive about it, the topic has been made so taboo that there is a massive amount of vitriol from both sides.
We never used to define ourselves from our political views. This unfortunatley has become the norm |
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