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Doing things differently...
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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How thinks that from the start we should have taken the stance New Zealand took.? Shut the boarders and if you don't live here you can't come in..!!
It easily done as an island and you only have to look at the cases there to see it has worked.
They had 3 new confirmed cases last week and lockdown was initiated...
This stance did upset a few people but they soon got over it and realised it was the best solution to staying clear...
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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They certainly did better than us during the worst.
However, they have a difficult route out.
We have vaccinated so many, New Zealand haven't even started.
They can't open the borders till they do. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"They certainly did better than us during the worst.
However, they have a difficult route out.
We have vaccinated so many, New Zealand haven't even started.
They can't open the borders till they do."
The question was, should we have done the same..? If we had, then our route out now would be a breeze, we have the vaccines and the plan... |
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They won’t let anyone in to deliver the vaccine!
So, NZ off my list of countries to visit on my around the world cycle adventure.
Shame as I rather fancy their PM and I’ve wanted to visit Te Awamutu for ages, it’s mentioned in a Crowded House tune. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"They certainly did better than us during the worst.
However, they have a difficult route out.
We have vaccinated so many, New Zealand haven't even started.
They can't open the borders till they do.
The question was, should we have done the same..? If we had, then our route out now would be a breeze, we have the vaccines and the plan..."
Yes.
We should have shut our borders to coincide with lockdown1.
We stopped travel from China, but 60% of our cases came from France and Spain.
That was a fatal error. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"They certainly did better than us during the worst.
However, they have a difficult route out.
We have vaccinated so many, New Zealand haven't even started.
They can't open the borders till they do.
The question was, should we have done the same..? If we had, then our route out now would be a breeze, we have the vaccines and the plan..."
we probably should have (although it still wouldn’t have been quite as easy as NZ because of our import export methods but we could have fixed that over the last year)
but time machines don’t exist and its more productive to think about what we need to do now in our current situation |
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Yes, we should have done. We still could. We still can.
Australia starts vaccinating next week, having (in the words of some Therapeutic Goods Administration officials - think MHRA) had the luxury of time to be able to observe other countries rollouts and learn from them, given the extremely low incidence in Australia.
(Yes I'm aware that the outback exists and whatever else, ta) |
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"New Zealand has a smaller population than Scotland, about half the population of London and has a larger land mass than the entire UK.
It's logical that things would be different there."
How does the population density of the cities compare though, covid isn't exactly ravaging through low density countryside, is it. |
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"How thinks that from the start we should have taken the stance New Zealand took.? Shut the boarders and if you don't live here you can't come in..!!
It easily done as an island and you only have to look at the cases there to see it has worked.
They had 3 new confirmed cases last week and lockdown was initiated...
This stance did upset a few people but they soon got over it and realised it was the best solution to staying clear...
"
We have the added difficulty of lots of accompanied freight coming from Europe. That would need to be sorted. Do-able but another obstacle to overcome, all those lorries bring goods on ferries need drivers. They could be made to swap loads at some of the new brexit lorry parks I guess it is a headache though.
Apart from that, all international travel should be the absolute bare minimum, as much as some of us would love a holiday.
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If we had lockdown and and only had 20 cases a month and lots of people where not alowd to come back home. Did get locked out.
Would this debate now be about why did we lock down she so few got it and only 10 died.
We need to look forward as the past is in the past. |
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"They certainly did better than us during the worst.
However, they have a difficult route out.
We have vaccinated so many, New Zealand haven't even started.
They can't open the borders till they do."
We need the world to be vaccinated, until then there is a chance a new strain could develop, and take hold, that is resistant to the vaccine.
We don't want to sit here thinking we're safe and then have another strain of covid from abroad wipe out everything that has been achieved so far. |
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"If we had lockdown and and only had 20 cases a month and lots of people where not alowd to come back home. Did get locked out.
Would this debate now be about why did we lock down she so few got it and only 10 died.
We need to look forward as the past is in the past. "
No, we need to find out exactly why well over 100k people have died, whilst other countries have had a fraction of that number, learn, and prevent it happening again in the future. You can't do that by ignoring the past and moving on. |
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"If we had lockdown and and only had 20 cases a month and lots of people where not alowd to come back home. Did get locked out.
Would this debate now be about why did we lock down she so few got it and only 10 died.
We need to look forward as the past is in the past. "
As someone who's been blocked from seeing my family because they're in Australia - I'm glad of it. Even though the decision was gut wrenching and again when I nearly lost a parent (not Covid) last year. I hang tight. They're safe.
I look forward. We can close the borders now. Stop the importation of foreign threat, get out lives back by working on zero Covid here. Learn from the successes of Australasia. |
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"If we had lockdown and and only had 20 cases a month and lots of people where not alowd to come back home. Did get locked out.
Would this debate now be about why did we lock down she so few got it and only 10 died.
We need to look forward as the past is in the past.
No, we need to find out exactly why well over 100k people have died, whilst other countries have had a fraction of that number, learn, and prevent it happening again in the future. You can't do that by ignoring the past and moving on. "
And this. Some goddamn accountability. |
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"How thinks that from the start we should have taken the stance New Zealand took.? Shut the boarders and if you don't live here you can't come in..!!
It easily done as an island and you only have to look at the cases there to see it has worked.
They had 3 new confirmed cases last week and lockdown was initiated...
This stance did upset a few people but they soon got over it and realised it was the best solution to staying clear...
We have the added difficulty of lots of accompanied freight coming from Europe. That would need to be sorted. Do-able but another obstacle to overcome, all those lorries bring goods on ferries need drivers. They could be made to swap loads at some of the new brexit lorry parks I guess it is a headache though.
Apart from that, all international travel should be the absolute bare minimum, as much as some of us would love a holiday.
"
Am All for that and the R would be problems but they could be sorted. Most goods come in on container ships anyway as for hgv you change the cab most is truck and trailers
But if there was a supply problem people in the UK would be out in protest as they can't get what they want.
It is a people problem |
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"If we had lockdown and and only had 20 cases a month and lots of people where not alowd to come back home. Did get locked out.
Would this debate now be about why did we lock down she so few got it and only 10 died.
We need to look forward as the past is in the past.
As someone who's been blocked from seeing my family because they're in Australia - I'm glad of it. Even though the decision was gut wrenching and again when I nearly lost a parent (not Covid) last year. I hang tight. They're safe.
I look forward. We can close the borders now. Stop the importation of foreign threat, get out lives back by working on zero Covid here. Learn from the successes of Australasia. "
 |
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"How thinks that from the start we should have taken the stance New Zealand took.? Shut the boarders and if you don't live here you can't come in..!!
It easily done as an island and you only have to look at the cases there to see it has worked.
They had 3 new confirmed cases last week and lockdown was initiated...
This stance did upset a few people but they soon got over it and realised it was the best solution to staying clear...
We have the added difficulty of lots of accompanied freight coming from Europe. That would need to be sorted. Do-able but another obstacle to overcome, all those lorries bring goods on ferries need drivers. They could be made to swap loads at some of the new brexit lorry parks I guess it is a headache though.
Apart from that, all international travel should be the absolute bare minimum, as much as some of us would love a holiday.
Am All for that and the R would be problems but they could be sorted. Most goods come in on container ships anyway as for hgv you change the cab most is truck and trailers
But if there was a supply problem people in the UK would be out in protest as they can't get what they want.
It is a people problem "
If people got pissy because they couldn't get non essentials due to quarantine, then they can die mad about it.
Or not die, as the case may be.
International crisis. Motherfucking deal. |
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"How thinks that from the start we should have taken the stance New Zealand took.? Shut the boarders and if you don't live here you can't come in..!!
It easily done as an island and you only have to look at the cases there to see it has worked.
They had 3 new confirmed cases last week and lockdown was initiated...
This stance did upset a few people but they soon got over it and realised it was the best solution to staying clear...
We have the added difficulty of lots of accompanied freight coming from Europe. That would need to be sorted. Do-able but another obstacle to overcome, all those lorries bring goods on ferries need drivers. They could be made to swap loads at some of the new brexit lorry parks I guess it is a headache though.
Apart from that, all international travel should be the absolute bare minimum, as much as some of us would love a holiday.
Am All for that and the R would be problems but they could be sorted. Most goods come in on container ships anyway as for hgv you change the cab most is truck and trailers
But if there was a supply problem people in the UK would be out in protest as they can't get what they want.
It is a people problem
If people got pissy because they couldn't get non essentials due to quarantine, then they can die mad about it.
Or not die, as the case may be.
International crisis. Motherfucking deal."
I'm with you but I can see it people panic buying blueberries and sh1t like that. One guy at work was righting to the no dose he could not get polish bear/larger it's like we are a nany state |
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New Zealand. They aimed high, we went low.
They had a high intelligence leader, we went as low as possible with ours.
We've had bumbling along, mistakes and a constant dithering, which caused avoidable deaths at each step. They were decisive and typically fast to act.
They realised a stronger population means a stronger economy. We blathered, stoking conflicts between aspects of society, so we lost both.
Being fast to act meant that measures could be more reasonable and lighter touch. Being slow, we had to impose stronger, pervasive measures, including the autumn and January lockdowns.
Reasonable measures are always more strongly supported than reactive, impositions with conflicts, that have avoidable extremities.
Where mitigating measures are taken, it demonstrates more considered thought, than where extreme language is the norm, without actions that back it up. Eg world beating Test and Trace, outsourcing £22 billions from the NHS, that has persistently failed targets and this week was shown to have had negligible effect.
The UK, as islands, is fortunate to have easier border control than those with open land borders. Being almost a year late to impose severe restrictions meant that this year's infections are worse than they would have been if done a year ago, much, much worse.
That we have been fortunate to have ordered a range of vaccines, 1 of them via Oxford development work, is our current strength, delivered via the fantastic NHS asset we have. This is partly the fortune of good efforts and luck with vaccines around the world, rather than leadership. |
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Can't believe people still think this has got anything to do with hindsight.
It was known 12 months ago how risky the situation was, yet Cheltenham festival and the Liverpool game still went ahead. Many eminent experts were saying shut the borders then, at least until we had more understanding of the disease. |
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"Can't believe people still think this has got anything to do with hindsight.
It was known 12 months ago how risky the situation was, yet Cheltenham festival and the Liverpool game still went ahead. Many eminent experts were saying shut the borders then, at least until we had more understanding of the disease. "
I quit agree not quite a year ago I came back from India and there was not even a temp check at Gatwick it was like nothing was going on still can't believe I was not made to isolate back then.
Was thinking laying in the sun what was going to happen on returning on the 8th of March. What happened was nothing. |
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"Woulda, couldn, shoulda 
And can and should and still can
So would you agree all travel in to UK should go into hotel isolation and testing ASAP"
All except trade.
All non trade travel in, hotel quarantine. Ten to fourteen days subject to what the scientists say is needed, PCR negative required to be let out. (Obviously medical treatment as needed)
Trade, set up a quarantine zone. (Given Kent is apparently now different to the rest of the UK for the purposes of the EU, I'm sure it's possible). Traders come directly to areas with high biosecurity measures, UK residents space suited up to receive goods and pass on. We treat that area as contaminated.
We ban travel outside the UK except for limited reasons, approval only.
I'm sure it's possible. |
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"Woulda, couldn, shoulda
And can and should and still can
So would you agree all travel in to UK should go into hotel isolation and testing ASAP
All except trade.
All non trade travel in, hotel quarantine. Ten to fourteen days subject to what the scientists say is needed, PCR negative required to be let out. (Obviously medical treatment as needed)
Trade, set up a quarantine zone. (Given Kent is apparently now different to the rest of the UK for the purposes of the EU, I'm sure it's possible). Traders come directly to areas with high biosecurity measures, UK residents space suited up to receive goods and pass on. We treat that area as contaminated.
We ban travel outside the UK except for limited reasons, approval only.
I'm sure it's possible."
I'm in and it gives far as a EU driver in hocks at a port and the ferry operates the trailer to a UK port a UK driver then delivers the goods and returns the trailer. But the goods would be twice the price on this as no return load and time factors. ETC |
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"Woulda, couldn, shoulda
And can and should and still can
So would you agree all travel in to UK should go into hotel isolation and testing ASAP
All except trade.
All non trade travel in, hotel quarantine. Ten to fourteen days subject to what the scientists say is needed, PCR negative required to be let out. (Obviously medical treatment as needed)
Trade, set up a quarantine zone. (Given Kent is apparently now different to the rest of the UK for the purposes of the EU, I'm sure it's possible). Traders come directly to areas with high biosecurity measures, UK residents space suited up to receive goods and pass on. We treat that area as contaminated.
We ban travel outside the UK except for limited reasons, approval only.
I'm sure it's possible.
I'm in and it gives far as a EU driver in hocks at a port and the ferry operates the trailer to a UK port a UK driver then delivers the goods and returns the trailer. But the goods would be twice the price on this as no return load and time factors. ETC "
UK drivers can presumably deliver to just outside the quarantine trade zone? Not insurmountable |
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"Can't believe people still think this has got anything to do with hindsight.
It was known 12 months ago how risky the situation was, yet Cheltenham festival and the Liverpool game still went ahead. Many eminent experts were saying shut the borders then, at least until we had more understanding of the disease.
I quit agree not quite a year ago I came back from India and there was not even a temp check at Gatwick it was like nothing was going on still can't believe I was not made to isolate back then.
Was thinking laying in the sun what was going to happen on returning on the 8th of March. What happened was nothing. "
I got back this time last year from Indonesia, they had temperature checks at provincial airports and were restricting incoming flights by the time I left. Heathrow has some laminated A4 flyers dotted around advising people to seek medical attention if they became ill.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing, you didn't need hindsight to see this going very wrong from the very beginning. |
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"Can't believe people still think this has got anything to do with hindsight.
It was known 12 months ago how risky the situation was, yet Cheltenham festival and the Liverpool game still went ahead. Many eminent experts were saying shut the borders then, at least until we had more understanding of the disease.
I quit agree not quite a year ago I came back from India and there was not even a temp check at Gatwick it was like nothing was going on still can't believe I was not made to isolate back then.
Was thinking laying in the sun what was going to happen on returning on the 8th of March. What happened was nothing. I got back this time last year from Indonesia, they had temperature checks at provincial airports and were restricting incoming flights by the time I left. Heathrow has some laminated A4 flyers dotted around advising people to seek medical attention if they became ill.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing, you didn't need hindsight to see this going very wrong from the very beginning. "
So I guess like me you where expecting a long que at integration and all sorts of checks but nothing like it |
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"Can't believe people still think this has got anything to do with hindsight.
It was known 12 months ago how risky the situation was, yet Cheltenham festival and the Liverpool game still went ahead. Many eminent experts were saying shut the borders then, at least until we had more understanding of the disease.
I quit agree not quite a year ago I came back from India and there was not even a temp check at Gatwick it was like nothing was going on still can't believe I was not made to isolate back then.
Was thinking laying in the sun what was going to happen on returning on the 8th of March. What happened was nothing. I got back this time last year from Indonesia, they had temperature checks at provincial airports and were restricting incoming flights by the time I left. Heathrow has some laminated A4 flyers dotted around advising people to seek medical attention if they became ill.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing, you didn't need hindsight to see this going very wrong from the very beginning.
So I guess like me you where expecting a long que at integration and all sorts of checks but nothing like it "
I was certainly expecting more than a few notices printed in the office out back... It can only be described as what it was, piss poor...  |
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"Can't believe people still think this has got anything to do with hindsight.
It was known 12 months ago how risky the situation was, yet Cheltenham festival and the Liverpool game still went ahead. Many eminent experts were saying shut the borders then, at least until we had more understanding of the disease.
I quit agree not quite a year ago I came back from India and there was not even a temp check at Gatwick it was like nothing was going on still can't believe I was not made to isolate back then.
Was thinking laying in the sun what was going to happen on returning on the 8th of March. What happened was nothing. I got back this time last year from Indonesia, they had temperature checks at provincial airports and were restricting incoming flights by the time I left. Heathrow has some laminated A4 flyers dotted around advising people to seek medical attention if they became ill.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing, you didn't need hindsight to see this going very wrong from the very beginning.
So I guess like me you where expecting a long que at integration and all sorts of checks but nothing like it
I was certainly expecting more than a few notices printed in the office out back... It can only be described as what it was, piss poor... "
Yer at least we saw that the same right back then from the out set. |
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"Can't believe people still think this has got anything to do with hindsight.
It was known 12 months ago how risky the situation was, yet Cheltenham festival and the Liverpool game still went ahead. Many eminent experts were saying shut the borders then, at least until we had more understanding of the disease.
I quit agree not quite a year ago I came back from India and there was not even a temp check at Gatwick it was like nothing was going on still can't believe I was not made to isolate back then.
Was thinking laying in the sun what was going to happen on returning on the 8th of March. What happened was nothing. I got back this time last year from Indonesia, they had temperature checks at provincial airports and were restricting incoming flights by the time I left. Heathrow has some laminated A4 flyers dotted around advising people to seek medical attention if they became ill.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing, you didn't need hindsight to see this going very wrong from the very beginning. "
Hindsight is a wonderful thing, but I remember listening to American experts last year going, in real time "omg UK what are you doing, are you crazy?" |
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"Can't believe people still think this has got anything to do with hindsight.
It was known 12 months ago how risky the situation was, yet Cheltenham festival and the Liverpool game still went ahead. Many eminent experts were saying shut the borders then, at least until we had more understanding of the disease.
I quit agree not quite a year ago I came back from India and there was not even a temp check at Gatwick it was like nothing was going on still can't believe I was not made to isolate back then.
Was thinking laying in the sun what was going to happen on returning on the 8th of March. What happened was nothing. I got back this time last year from Indonesia, they had temperature checks at provincial airports and were restricting incoming flights by the time I left. Heathrow has some laminated A4 flyers dotted around advising people to seek medical attention if they became ill.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing, you didn't need hindsight to see this going very wrong from the very beginning.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing, but I remember listening to American experts last year going, in real time "omg UK what are you doing, are you crazy?""
I remember hearing WHO saying the key is test test test
But we tock so long to get testing up and running I think it could be better now. |
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"Can't believe people still think this has got anything to do with hindsight.
It was known 12 months ago how risky the situation was, yet Cheltenham festival and the Liverpool game still went ahead. Many eminent experts were saying shut the borders then, at least until we had more understanding of the disease.
I quit agree not quite a year ago I came back from India and there was not even a temp check at Gatwick it was like nothing was going on still can't believe I was not made to isolate back then.
Was thinking laying in the sun what was going to happen on returning on the 8th of March. What happened was nothing. I got back this time last year from Indonesia, they had temperature checks at provincial airports and were restricting incoming flights by the time I left. Heathrow has some laminated A4 flyers dotted around advising people to seek medical attention if they became ill.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing, you didn't need hindsight to see this going very wrong from the very beginning.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing, but I remember listening to American experts last year going, in real time "omg UK what are you doing, are you crazy?""
Yes, it's easy to find experts to support either side of argument, governments never seem to be short of experts who'll say anything they want them to.
I always liked Professor David Nutt for refusing to tow the line and getting sacked for refusing to lie to the public, completely different subject though... |
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"Can't believe people still think this has got anything to do with hindsight.
It was known 12 months ago how risky the situation was, yet Cheltenham festival and the Liverpool game still went ahead. Many eminent experts were saying shut the borders then, at least until we had more understanding of the disease.
I quit agree not quite a year ago I came back from India and there was not even a temp check at Gatwick it was like nothing was going on still can't believe I was not made to isolate back then.
Was thinking laying in the sun what was going to happen on returning on the 8th of March. What happened was nothing. I got back this time last year from Indonesia, they had temperature checks at provincial airports and were restricting incoming flights by the time I left. Heathrow has some laminated A4 flyers dotted around advising people to seek medical attention if they became ill.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing, you didn't need hindsight to see this going very wrong from the very beginning.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing, but I remember listening to American experts last year going, in real time "omg UK what are you doing, are you crazy?"
I remember hearing WHO saying the key is test test test
But we tock so long to get testing up and running I think it could be better now."
Test was step one, then work out what to do with those results.
We took ages to get tests up and running and still seem obsessed with test over all else |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Just out of interest those who flew back into the U.K. and were shocked that they weren’t told to isolate, I presume they did so anyway because they knew it was needed. |
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"Just out of interest those who flew back into the U.K. and were shocked that they weren’t told to isolate, I presume they did so anyway because they knew it was needed."
Do you know I did and after 2 weeks got strange looks shopping in Tesco with a mask on hard to think it was unconftable people looking at me |
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"Can't believe people still think this has got anything to do with hindsight.
It was known 12 months ago how risky the situation was, yet Cheltenham festival and the Liverpool game still went ahead. Many eminent experts were saying shut the borders then, at least until we had more understanding of the disease.
I quit agree not quite a year ago I came back from India and there was not even a temp check at Gatwick it was like nothing was going on still can't believe I was not made to isolate back then.
Was thinking laying in the sun what was going to happen on returning on the 8th of March. What happened was nothing. I got back this time last year from Indonesia, they had temperature checks at provincial airports and were restricting incoming flights by the time I left. Heathrow has some laminated A4 flyers dotted around advising people to seek medical attention if they became ill.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing, you didn't need hindsight to see this going very wrong from the very beginning.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing, but I remember listening to American experts last year going, in real time "omg UK what are you doing, are you crazy?"
I remember hearing WHO saying the key is test test test
But we tock so long to get testing up and running I think it could be better now.
Test was step one, then work out what to do with those results.
We took ages to get tests up and running and still seem obsessed with test over all else"
I still think testing is key
I got tested 3 weeks back and was positive not been out since
Test every one twice a week people isolate redusing spread easy |
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"
I still think testing is key
I got tested 3 weeks back and was positive not been out since
Test every one twice a week people isolate redusing spread easy "
Testing doesn't mean much if people don't isolate, which they don't always do if they can't afford to.
It's important, but it's just one part of the puzzle. |
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"
I still think testing is key
I got tested 3 weeks back and was positive not been out since
Test every one twice a week people isolate redusing spread easy
Testing doesn't mean much if people don't isolate, which they don't always do if they can't afford to.
It's important, but it's just one part of the puzzle."
yer I get that just had 3 weeks on SSP got to get back on Monday have been ok for the last week but my wrist joint flared up osteoarthritis. |
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"
I still think testing is key
I got tested 3 weeks back and was positive not been out since
Test every one twice a week people isolate redusing spread easy
Testing doesn't mean much if people don't isolate, which they don't always do if they can't afford to.
It's important, but it's just one part of the puzzle.yer I get that just had 3 weeks on SSP got to get back on Monday have been ok for the last week but my wrist joint flared up osteoarthritis."
I'm sorry. And I hope your osteoarthritis clears up soon. |
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"
I still think testing is key
I got tested 3 weeks back and was positive not been out since
Test every one twice a week people isolate redusing spread easy
Testing doesn't mean much if people don't isolate, which they don't always do if they can't afford to.
It's important, but it's just one part of the puzzle.yer I get that just had 3 weeks on SSP got to get back on Monday have been ok for the last week but my wrist joint flared up osteoarthritis.
I'm sorry. And I hope your osteoarthritis clears up soon."
Well the wrist should me ok for work on Monday as for generally have a pain management meeting on th 26th so hoping
And thanks |
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All the above.
Everything that needed doing was known twelve months ago, but our government ignored it because (excuse my french) thick as pigshit. Also they couldn't give a toss until it started affecting themselves directly.
All water under the bridge though? Except that twelve months on it's still a fucking shambles.
Closing borders? Still letting everyone through. Quarantine? The system is a joke, there's not even an attempt at segregation and biosecurity of those told to quarantine and those that are just waved through the airports. They fly in on the same plane for god's sake!
Test and trace? Billions of pounds spent, finally got testing doing something but the trace is just a total waste. It's just money given away to cabinet ministers mates.
Biosecurity of trade? Biggest failure in the world. All the fucking around for brexit to ruin our economy, when the time and money could have been spent on sorting out unaccompanied transfer of goods in shipping containers, HGVs with swap over of cab/trailer so that foreign driver never gets out of cab while briefly at a goods yard near Dover, instead immediately taking an outgoing trailer back to EU.
Vaccine programme is going well, all I can assume is that intelligent heads told the government to just fuck off out of the way, and got on with making it work. Mind you, I'm sure that the cabinet are doing everything in their power to bollocks it up. When it comes to snatching defeat from the jaws of victory, BoJo et al are world beating (fishing agreement anybody?).
I can't help thinking that the biggest tragedy is that nobody particularly high ranking died from covid last spring, because if they had maybe the pandemic might have been treated seriously as a danger to public health and handled properly, instead of just being used as an opportunity for power plays and embezzlement of billions from the public purse. |
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"All the above.
Everything that needed doing was known twelve months ago, but our government ignored it because (excuse my french) thick as pigshit. Also they couldn't give a toss until it started affecting themselves directly.
All water under the bridge though? Except that twelve months on it's still a fucking shambles.
Closing borders? Still letting everyone through. Quarantine? The system is a joke, there's not even an attempt at segregation and biosecurity of those told to quarantine and those that are just waved through the airports. They fly in on the same plane for god's sake!
Test and trace? Billions of pounds spent, finally got testing doing something but the trace is just a total waste. It's just money given away to cabinet ministers mates.
Biosecurity of trade? Biggest failure in the world. All the fucking around for brexit to ruin our economy, when the time and money could have been spent on sorting out unaccompanied transfer of goods in shipping containers, HGVs with swap over of cab/trailer so that foreign driver never gets out of cab while briefly at a goods yard near Dover, instead immediately taking an outgoing trailer back to EU.
Vaccine programme is going well, all I can assume is that intelligent heads told the government to just fuck off out of the way, and got on with making it work. Mind you, I'm sure that the cabinet are doing everything in their power to bollocks it up. When it comes to snatching defeat from the jaws of victory, BoJo et al are world beating (fishing agreement anybody?).
I can't help thinking that the biggest tragedy is that nobody particularly high ranking died from covid last spring, because if they had maybe the pandemic might have been treated seriously as a danger to public health and handled properly, instead of just being used as an opportunity for power plays and embezzlement of billions from the public purse."
On the hole that is a hole in one and I would guess you read the hole post thank you |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"They certainly did better than us during the worst.
However, they have a difficult route out.
We have vaccinated so many, New Zealand haven't even started.
They can't open the borders till they do.
The question was, should we have done the same..? If we had, then our route out now would be a breeze, we have the vaccines and the plan..."
We didn’t, what’s the wisdom in saying we should have?
It’s like saying we should have invaded Germany when they occupied Czechoslovakia. |
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"They certainly did better than us during the worst.
However, they have a difficult route out.
We have vaccinated so many, New Zealand haven't even started.
They can't open the borders till they do.
The question was, should we have done the same..? If we had, then our route out now would be a breeze, we have the vaccines and the plan...
We didn’t, what’s the wisdom in saying we should have?
It’s like saying we should have invaded Germany when they occupied Czechoslovakia."
Yep it like saying the government should a stock of everything just in case of the worst posibal out come but if it's a waste in the short term what is the point |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"New Zealand has a smaller population than Scotland, about half the population of London and has a larger land mass than the entire UK.
It's logical that things would be different there."
And not to mention how it is an island pretty far away.
The U.K. is in Europe and always been very interconnected, think about how Heathrow works as major international hub for layovers. Nobody would layover in Auckland to then go to some other major country. (Like unless you wanted to visit!)
We can’t compare the two really ... |
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"How thinks that from the start we should have taken the stance New Zealand took.? Shut the boarders and if you don't live here you can't come in..!!
It easily done as an island and you only have to look at the cases there to see it has worked.
They had 3 new confirmed cases last week and lockdown was initiated...
This stance did upset a few people but they soon got over it and realised it was the best solution to staying clear...
"
This topic has been done to death! We are not New Zealand. We had 10s of thousands of domestic cases long before anyone knew how bad it would get. If we closed boarders each time a new threat emerged then the reality is we would never be able to allow anyone in or out ever again |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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The UK exports about 30% of GDP and imports about 31% of GDP; primarily food. About 29million people are continuously employed.
That means that... does sums... a fuck tonne... of people have to move in and out, just to keep us fed and the economy going, and to avoid a devastating depression and all the social and economic consequences of that.
‘We should do what somebody else, with a completely different demographic, has done and shut borders’ is a bit of an arbitrary and pointless statement. Yes, things could probably have been done better. They weren’t. Bit more complicated than that though.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Think England have done alright really bit of a Shakey start but I think by the time we have vaccinated the population and the true figures of deaths from different countries come out not the publicised ones we are getting now we won't look so bad probably be about 10 years from now when all the investigations are compleate we will look back and think well our death rate went to hardly nothing once we were all vaccinated where as all the other countries death rate slowly crept up. |
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"
The UK exports about 30% of GDP and imports about 31% of GDP; primarily food. About 29million people are continuously employed.
That means that... does sums... a fuck tonne... of people have to move in and out, just to keep us fed and the economy going, and to avoid a devastating depression and all the social and economic consequences of that.
‘We should do what somebody else, with a completely different demographic, has done and shut borders’ is a bit of an arbitrary and pointless statement. Yes, things could probably have been done better. They weren’t. Bit more complicated than that though.
"
We are perfectly capable of feeding ourselves without food imports. The food imports you refer to are not staples but fripperies our modern lifestyles have grown used to.
Forty years ago, we used to produce about 6 tonnes of grain per hectare of wheat. It’s currently about 14 to 15 tonnes per hectare and still improving. Chickens breed like rabbits, as do rabbits.
Maybe it wouldn’t be some of the luxury fruits we are used to, but we would NOT starve if we had shit the borders. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
The UK exports about 30% of GDP and imports about 31% of GDP; primarily food. About 29million people are continuously employed.
That means that... does sums... a fuck tonne... of people have to move in and out, just to keep us fed and the economy going, and to avoid a devastating depression and all the social and economic consequences of that.
‘We should do what somebody else, with a completely different demographic, has done and shut borders’ is a bit of an arbitrary and pointless statement. Yes, things could probably have been done better. They weren’t. Bit more complicated than that though.
We are perfectly capable of feeding ourselves without food imports. The food imports you refer to are not staples but fripperies our modern lifestyles have grown used to.
Forty years ago, we used to produce about 6 tonnes of grain per hectare of wheat. It’s currently about 14 to 15 tonnes per hectare and still improving. Chickens breed like rabbits, as do rabbits.
Maybe it wouldn’t be some of the luxury fruits we are used to, but we would NOT starve if we had shit the borders."
I agree, we wouldn’t ‘starve.’ But this is not wartime and rationing is not a thing. And that’s incorrect, we couldn’t just switch to being able to feed ourselves overnight as the infrastructure isn’t in place, it would take years, not weeks to become self sufficient. Most of the crops currently growing are for feed/biofuel and not fit for consumption. The population is not what it was 40 years ago. And the impact of all these import/export businesses suffering would put more pressure on our social system. |
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By *r TriomanMan
over a year ago
Nudist Club Near Monmouth |
The fight against COVID will be a long campaign, it's too early to say which approach was the best untill the war is won. As there's no script for this, mistake will be made and lessons will have to be learnt.
Also, as the UK is a massive trading and transport hub, following New Zealand's strategy of closing boards we would've been even more damaging economically.
We are amongst the leading nations on vaccinations so now we can recapture lossed ground, rebuild our economy and massively reduce the number of COVID fatalities. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"How thinks that from the start we should have taken the stance New Zealand took.? Shut the boarders and if you don't live here you can't come in..!!
It easily done as an island and you only have to look at the cases there to see it has worked.
They had 3 new confirmed cases last week and lockdown was initiated...
This stance did upset a few people but they soon got over it and realised it was the best solution to staying clear...
This topic has been done to death! We are not New Zealand. We had 10s of thousands of domestic cases long before anyone knew how bad it would get. If we closed boarders each time a new threat emerged then the reality is we would never be able to allow anyone in or out ever again"
They knew before January when for example Australian armed forces were getting their nationals out of China. That activity requires planning. They had time to minimise the impact. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"The fight against COVID will be a long campaign, it's too early to say which approach was the best untill the war is won. As there's no script for this, mistake will be made and lessons will have to be learnt.
Also, as the UK is a massive trading and transport hub, following New Zealand's strategy of closing boards we would've been even more damaging economically.
We are amongst the leading nations on vaccinations so now we can recapture lossed ground, rebuild our economy and massively reduce the number of COVID fatalities."
NZ hasn't fully closed borders. They can't stop nationals returning, that's illegal. They've stopped non essential travel and put controls around it. Their economy relies heavily on tourism and import exports. It doesn't have to be one or the other, just the least shit option. |
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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago
Brighton |
The UK Govt handling of Covid has been a total shambles except for the vaccine rollout.
Govt policy has been characterised by u-turn after u-turn and a lack of decisive action.
Except...
1. Contracts for Cronies (currently in court over this and Hancock accused)
2. Vaccine purchasing & rollout (though interesting to note that Vaccine Minister set up a family business last summer with wife and sons as directors to...handle medical supplies) |
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"
The UK exports about 30% of GDP and imports about 31% of GDP; primarily food. About 29million people are continuously employed.
That means that... does sums... a fuck tonne... of people have to move in and out, just to keep us fed and the economy going, and to avoid a devastating depression and all the social and economic consequences of that.
‘We should do what somebody else, with a completely different demographic, has done and shut borders’ is a bit of an arbitrary and pointless statement. Yes, things could probably have been done better. They weren’t. Bit more complicated than that though.
We are perfectly capable of feeding ourselves without food imports. The food imports you refer to are not staples but fripperies our modern lifestyles have grown used to.
Forty years ago, we used to produce about 6 tonnes of grain per hectare of wheat. It’s currently about 14 to 15 tonnes per hectare and still improving. Chickens breed like rabbits, as do rabbits.
Maybe it wouldn’t be some of the luxury fruits we are used to, but we would NOT starve if we had shit the borders."
No the UK dose not have the space to farm even close to enuf to feed it's people the hase been the case for way to long and yet the population is still going up. |
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